Good Grief...Experts need for Social Security

[DDD]

"Supplemental Security Income payments" "overpayments" to difficult child.

No, I'm not having a heart attack. I'm just trying to figure out exactly WTH GFGmom has done now. Care to help?

I changed difficult child's amiling address to my house a month ago or so. GFGmom was a bit perplexed "Why did you do THAT Mom?" My reply was "mail that goes to your house gets opened by you, difficult child, boyfriend and your daughter" and I need to know what is going on for difficult child.

Are you sitting down???????????

Two pieces of mail today. Both from SSA. The first shows Amount Due $ 98.20.
due May 20th. The second showd Smount Due $ 6,999.35 due 5/20/11.

What to heck has she done to get difficult child in debt for seven grand?

He stopped receiving his disability until around four months ago. He was receiving food stamps (which I assume GFGmom is using??) but how does SSI figure into the equation???

I need some direction people. Help! DDD

 

[klmno]

I think I'd turn it over to an attorney. If he needs a GAL, try to get yourself assigned. But to leave things like this, with him at an adult age and a mom and grandmom and SS all trying to figure out what is goibng on, someone could end up in trouble and it could be the wrong person. And I'd be concerned it could leave him without being able to get benefits in the future that he needs. IOW, I don't know that you can "right" someone else's wrong in this case without you looking "bad" to SS, too.

 

[Marcie Mac]

DDD, I would suggest you get difficult child to sign a Financial Power of Attoney to you like yesterday so you can call and find out what that is for.

When SO was in the process of SSDI, he was denied because he was on "my" checking account - even though I could prove all of the money going in (paycheck) and going out (my bills) and he never issued a check - it was solely done in case something happened to me, he could get money for the boys - didn't matter - he had access to the money and they considered it "his" as well. If your difficult child had a checking account, and your daughter had him put her name on it, and used it for her personal deposits, that might be the problem. I do know they check these accounts - SO's dad sent him one year 10.00 for his birthday, he put it in his account, and he got a letter saying they were deducting 10.00 from his next check due to this "income"

I would so nail her behind to the wall if she took advantage of him..

Marcie

 

[DDD]

Do you guys realize how much energy it takes to travel this blankin' road?? Whine! Whine!

I guess I don't have any choice but to take action because ##^#@^ GFGmom is a moneyomaniac. I just can't imagine how the government has garnished wages from her in the past for taking his money and she evidently has been able to do it again.
He is innocent (like only as AS kid can be) and I know that this is going to put me through the wringer. This is not my best
time with nicotene withdrawal, weight loss, business in crisis etc. BUT I can't let him pay the piper for her Dang it! DDD

 

[klmno]

I'm sure it is more than frustrating- I feel that way a lot even without adding nicotine withdrawal on top of it. I could be the one ending up incarcerated if I tried that! LOL!

I don't really know anything about that system- I just worry that there is only so much a person can do on someone else's behalf when it comes to legal finances and the person is an adult unless you have some legal documentation stating that you have a right to.

 

[Jena]

wow wth i'm taking a stab in the dark yet apparentley she took out those benefits as let's say i would being my difficult child's mom for her like she was "caring" for him??

get all the documentation you have, i dont' know the whole story so forgive me if i'm off base. get together everything that you have stating where he was living etc. fact she was not supporting him. also copies of his bank account statements if he even has any tell him. any financial stuff at all.

for him to of had gotten it there has to be a flow of it being showed into the accounts and being spent out of the accounts.... see my point

 

[Hound dog]

If difficult child will do it, go for that POA asap. Only way I know of for you to find out wth she's done now.

Or perhaps could difficult child come over to visit, call social security (with your help) and ask what's up with the charges?? Or maybe you could take him down there to find out?

Still think the POA is your best hope though.

(((hugs)))

 

[seriously]

Ask difficult child what he knows about the bills. Just so you know what he's going to say when social security asks him.

Then take his hand and go down to your local social security office and tell them you're there to help your grandson and could someone please talk to him about these bills?

Do not take no for an answer.

Play dumb as dirt. Ask all the questions you can think of to ask and make them explain everything until you understand it. And until either difficult child understands it or it is painfully clear to everyone that difficult child is incapable of understanding either how the debt came to be or the consequences of having this large debt.

Ask them for copies of all the notices and letters that have been sent about this debt. Tell them how difficult child needs lots of help handling money and his mom has been helping him but you're not so sure she is doing the right thing sometimes.

Ask them what will happen when difficult child doesn't pay the money back.

Once you have all the info you will have to decide what to do next.

If you are lucky, it will become clear to the nice social security person that difficult child is incapable of handling his own money or even understanding what is going on.

This may actually be a blessing in disguise. Because it may help when it comes to his disability appeal. It is patently ridiculous to say that someone who cannot manage their money or understand SSA's most basic rules is not disabled.

Frankly, I think someone needs to have financial custodial care for difficult child = or a financial conservator, what ever they call it where you live. It does not have to be permanent but he would not be in this mess if you had legal custody of his finances. And if GFGmom had legal custody of his finances - SSA could go after her for fraud without hesitation if she has been misusing his funds.

I strongly advise you to not do anything to create financial entanglements with difficult child at this point and to undo any that you may have already set up - in case you have a joint account of any kind or money held in trust for him.

 

[DDD]

I did call and was, of course, low key. Very nice lady told me that she can not divulge information with-o difficult child's consent. She did verify that there is no one on his account with him. (Yep...GFGmom is a smart cookie!) She did verify that there is a meeting scheduled this month. GFGmom had told me that...and that I was welcome to attend.

I asked what the difference was between SSI and Disability and the lady said Disability is based on your earning record. He has no earnings record so I assume when GFGmom refers to "disability" she means SSI. I'm sure difficult child will go with me to the SS office and authorize them to share info. Problem is.........he gets very nervous when he thinks he is crossing his Mother.
She has fostered this love/hate relationship with him that makes him fear he will "lose" her. How xing sick it that. Geez. DDD

 

[seriously]

So it may be really hard but it sounds like you maybe need to detach from this situation and let things play out.

My guess is that the meeting may lead to someone at Social Security realizing that your grandson is being taken advantage of by his mother. He is not the first by a long shot. Whether they will do anything about that is hard to say.

As sick as it is that GFGmom is messing with his mind there is nothing you can do about that.

And the more you intrude into this the more pressure you put on difficult child to choose between you.

And he will always choose his mom.

The bond between a mother and child, especially when it is a "sick" bond fraught with pain and abuse, is intense and nearly impossible to break without breaking the kid. At least that has been my experience the couple of times I have been witness to or fostered a child with an abusive parent.

He is an adult and, unless you are prepared to file conservatorship proceedings and fight in court over it (you are unlikely to win) or you have clear and demonstrable proof that she is committing fraud, he has the right to make his own decisions.

And you need to respect that. No matter how hard it is to watch and know that things could be different.

If you do not force him to choose between you, then he will turn to you for help if the situation becomes desperate.

Do you understand the difference between SSDI (disability based on your Social Security payments while employed) and SSI (welfare program for the disabled and elderly)?

Unless difficult child has a parent who is themselves on SSDI or is dead, and he is determined to be an adult child with a disability, he would not be eligible for SSDI.

SSI has many more restrictions and requirements than SSDI. For example, SSI restricts the assets a recipient can have and requires extensive reporting of changes in household status, among other things.

SSDI does not because it is not welfare - it is the same as if you had bought a disability policy through your employer. They monitor and periodically re-assess your level of disability and require reporting of income from work but otherwise there are no asset limits or reporting requirements.

 

[DDD]

Thanks, Seriously, for your input. What you recommend makes logical sense. I've got to say that I am trying to assimilate your thoughts and I'm fighting my own. Usually I'm very confident but your post makes me recognize that there is so much emotion in my head...perhaps I need to fall back.

I abhor the idea that (1) he could be blamed and penalized for letting his Mother call the shots with his disability money. There is no doubt that she has taken funds from his account (with his permission) because she "needed" it. He has trusted her. Idea (2) that stuck like a bone in my throat is that I finally have found an apartment for him with support services so he will be away from his Mom and able to take steps forward...and now instead of getting retroactive disability payments like I expected I have in my purse a bill for over SIX GRAND that is his debt to SS.

I'm placing any decision making on hold til the dust clears from my brain. I still, lol, think a hit man would make life easier! Thanks for posting. DDD

 

[Hound dog]

DDD

Seems we've run into a similar snag with Travis' disability application. husband is filling out the paperwork for him. He needed SS to call him back for something................and they won't because he's not Travis. So far, it's looking like they may have to go to the office to have it set up husband can help him. Travis is going to attempt to call and do the same thing, but I have a strong suspicion that won't be enough. He probably has to sign something.

My only question is............IF you do the POA with difficult child.............is there someone to take it over at some point in the future when you can no longer do it for him? Someone other than biomom that can be trusted not to take advantage of him. Or do you think given time he can learn to manage it himself? There was a time I thought Travis would not be able to learn, but he has and he did well with it overall.

 

[DDD]

I just received a call from difficult child. He wants to know how my efforts to get him an apartment is coming.
I responded 'I have done all the paperwork and it's looking good but I don't know what the story is between you, your Mom and SS. I've been expecting that they will give reinstate your disability but it looks like they "may" be expecting money from you. Do you know anything about it?"

difficult child said "Yeah. They want me to pay them around $6000 because my Mom goofed up and spent my money the wrong way so I have to pay them back. But Mom says I should be able to just pay them like $100 a month from my disability check so it won't be too bad."

CUSS WORDS!!!!!!!!! Right! Poor little innocent difficult child is going to owe the Government six grand because his dear old Mom "goofed up" his money. I swear she was raised right. DDD

 

[lovemysons]

Oh DDD I am so sorry to hear the latest regarding selfish difficult child mom...and of course she expects difficult child to just pay it back not her. Good grief!!!

LMS

 

[seriously]

SSA fraud reporting hotline and info at this website.

http://www.ssa.gov/oig/hotline/index.htm

It's my understanding that she does not legally have the right to "borrow" his SSI money. It is to be used for his housing, food, clothing and other necessary expenses. Unless she can prove that she was using the money he gave her for those purposes she has committed fraud. If she used them for her own benefit for something other than those things (assuming she will claim that it was for his housing etc) then she can be charged with fraud. And that's a big enough bill that I think SSA would go after her.

Regardless of whether you're sure of the facts I would call the fraud hotline and talk to them about your concerns.

At this point, given the base amount of SSI, they have taken about 9 or 10 months worth of his benefits back.

Yes, IF he gets disability again they will let him pay it back out of his check. They usually let them pay 10% of their check which should be around $75 a month. So have difficult child divide $6000 by $75 to figure out how long he will be paying off this "mistake". About 7 years.

If he doesn't get disability then they will send it to collections and you can just forget about him ever getting an apartment on his own.