I called 911 last week re my 20 yo. Looking for support and suggestions going forward

Ascending

New Member
Book that was recommended as having helped someone with addiction who had tried all sorts of approaches but finally found help from is: Rational Recovery by Jack Trimpey.

It and everyone I have talked with agree that the desire to recover has to be in the person with the addiction, or nothing works. But a lot of things seem not to work well even if the person themselves wants to change.
 

Ascending

New Member
Yes, we have significant overlap, right down to the crutches, as I am currently experiencing some knee/hip issues and may need surgery. And yes, my son, actually my biological nephew, is adopted. We do not live in a weed legal state and I would agree, that does put a different perspective on things.

If you click on my name or do a search, I think you can find previous posts and read some of my story. It got bad last December when he was in jail in another state and had a psychotic break. I got great advice from the people here at the time and I am so grateful to them.

Unfortunately, even after his begging and pleading to get him out of jail, (he was there 6 months), saying he wanted treatment, blah, blah, blah…it was not enough to get him past the 3 month mark in a treatment center—his third in 2 years. He always manages to break the rules, have a bad attitude and end up getting kicked out.

His drug of choice was weed, but when he couldn’t get it he started smoking meth and that’s when all his troubles began. He committed a (non-violent) crime and is now on probation for 3 years. However, he blew a real good opportunity when he walked away from the last treatment center as they would have helped him with jobs, life skills, all those things he desperately needs to make it in this world. And, to be honest, I’ve kinda had it with him. I love him but I am not currently in contact. I need a break.

I am a little short on time but I will add more later. I’ve been wanting to post an update, but tbh, it’s just hard to get the words out sometimes. Another failure…he’s 21. He needs to grow up some before anything we can do for him will actually benefit him, and we’re done for awhile.

I hope you will stick to your guns about him living with you. It never seems to turn out well for many of us.

I would be interested in hearing more about getting “unaddicted.” My son has absolutely zero motivation, but I’m still interested.

The best to you!

See above post for book title

The other thing that someone said actually worked remarkably well was a subliminal type audio program:

See next post as I find and post it
 

Ascending

New Member

And might help some of us who are parents though the person who recommended it didn’t have the parent experience to know for sure
 

Ascending

New Member
In Sheep’s Clothing by George K Simon has been a godsend for me.


I recommend for anyone with a child who is “difficult” to at least look and see if it might apply. I think it’s easy to miss manipulating going on when one is in the midst of it or have gotten tolerant or dismissed bad behavior due to (whatever issues pertain).
 
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Ascending

New Member
Can we edit posts? Like if I discovered I was wanting to reply LOL to :
So, now he’s vowing to never return to earth. Would he like an all expense paid trip to Mars? Tell him you’ll finance it if he agrees to never come back.

But chose Mirabelle’s more serious comment accidentally?

Ah . Never mind! I found how! But also that it seems to have time cut off or something so I can’t edit any post.
 
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Nandina

Member
I think you have 5 minutes after sending a post to go back and edit it. But I agree, that was a real lol! Good sense of humor, Crayola, we need that sometimes!
 

BusynMember

Well-Known Member
Hi. I am so sorry. All I can say is, been there, done that, have the tee shirt.

Your son, however, is not like he was as a child of 7, and you will find that you can't help him unless he is motivated to do most of the work. He is an adult even if immature and childish. All of our kids are emotionally young. He is still an adult and big, strong, dangerous if he comes at you and he legally doesn't have to listen to you. And being an adult, he 99% probably won't listen to you. We give ourselves too much power with adults who are also our kids. We think we can mother them to health like when they were young. We can't. They won't listen and can get abusive. We have to take care of the only person we can control and that is ourselves. We have no control over anyone but us, not even a beloved child.

What we can do, all we can do, is learn to take care of ourselves and to react with calmness and sanity. We can serk therapy for codependency or go to a 12 Step Meeting for loved ones of addicts. Your sons chaos belongs to him, not you. You did not cause it, you can't control it and you can't cure it (Narcotics Anonymous). Only your son, of his own desire, can help himself. You can learn to live with peace in spite of your sons problems. The more we try to get in their way, the more we fail to help them. If that sounds crazy right now, one day you will see that it's true. Then you will get help to heal because it is too painful/hard not to. Your son's journey will be his. You can't save him or make him better. But that is sometimes hard to believe. So I hope you learn this before I did. It almost destroyed my marriage and other kids. Took me ten years to let go.

I send lots of hugs and love and assure you that you are not alone.
 

Ascending

New Member
Update

He returned home this past weekend...
Has been on better behavior
and off drugs ...
Applying for jobs
Had a first interview today.
Also looking for housing

I am praying

And trying to catch smaller lapses earlier
Like rudeness
Meanness to dog

It is hard

🙏🙏🙏
 

Mirabelle

Member
Hello Ascending :). Thank you for the update on how things are going. I'm glad things sound like they are improved from the first time you posted. When you first let them back into the home to give it a try, it can be very nerve wracking. You want to give them a chance to show that they 'get it'; that the way they were acting before they left was unacceptable and that they can do better. Please, please do better!! Time to act like a grown up. Better behavior, off drugs, job interviews.....it sounds awesome!! I do hope he 'gets it' and stays on a solid path.

Our son never did 'get it.' We gave it several tries. A few times we had to kick him out, a few times he got mad at us and left on his own. I think it was a combination of him not having complete control over his own behavior, and his attitude that as an adult he should be able to do what he pleased in his own room / home. All of the rights of an adult with none of the responsibilities or obligations to others. His mom has a big spacious house, and I think living with her he got used to making noise, living in a pigsty, and smoking weed out his window. Our house is smaller, clean, and weed free! The rules were different and he didn't care for that at all. But after she kicked him out he didn't have a choice. Rather than modify his behavior, he tried to impose his will onto us.

Sometimes he left over major deal breakers eg. doing drugs, stealing. Other times it was our refusal to put up with the 'small lapses' as you say. After years of asking nicely and explaining why these things were important and getting yupped to death, we just said enough is enough. On one return home we came up with a contract with a three strikes system - and that return lasted three days! After losing two strikes in one weekend (loud music in the middle of the night, promising that he had fed the animals when he hadn't), he bailed because I guess he realized we weren't going to let up and be fine with him lying and acting like a big kid. And for a few years this continued back and forth. He would swear he understood how it needed to be, but within four or five days at the most he would slip back into his old ways.

All of this to say, I totally get why you are so concerned with the small stuff. The big stuff staying on course is paramount. But my husband and I always felt disrespected and taken advantage of when our son would not take the small stuff seriously. I guess because it was indicative of the fact that he thought he could say the right things and then sucker us into putting up with the same old BS. In fact he essentially told his sister at one point that this was his approach to dealing with us.

Only you know what is acceptable behavior to you from your son. I would just encourage you to be fair, be supportive, but be smart about it. Hopefully a job will come soon and he will be in a position to leave on his own.

Keep us updated!
Mirabelle
 

Ascending

New Member
Hello Ascending :). Thank you for the update on how things are going. I'm glad things sound like they are improved from the first time you posted. When you first let them back into the home to give it a try, it can be very nerve wracking. You want to give them a chance to show that they 'get it'; that the way they were acting before they left was unacceptable and that they can do better. Please, please do better!! Time to act like a grown up. Better behavior, off drugs, job interviews.....it sounds awesome!! I do hope he 'gets it' and stays on a solid path.

Our son never did 'get it.' We gave it several tries. A few times we had to kick him out, a few times he got mad at us and left on his own. I think it was a combination of him not having complete control over his own behavior, and his attitude that as an adult he should be able to do what he pleased in his own room / home. All of the rights of an adult with none of the responsibilities or obligations to others. His mom has a big spacious house, and I think living with her he got used to making noise, living in a pigsty, and smoking weed out his window. Our house is smaller, clean, and weed free! The rules were different and he didn't care for that at all. But after she kicked him out he didn't have a choice. Rather than modify his behavior, he tried to impose his will onto us.

Sometimes he left over major deal breakers eg. doing drugs, stealing. Other times it was our refusal to put up with the 'small lapses' as you say. After years of asking nicely and explaining why these things were important and getting yupped to death, we just said enough is enough. On one return home we came up with a contract with a three strikes system - and that return lasted three days! After losing two strikes in one weekend (loud music in the middle of the night, promising that he had fed the animals when he hadn't), he bailed because I guess he realized we weren't going to let up and be fine with him lying and acting like a big kid. And for a few years this continued back and forth. He would swear he understood how it needed to be, but within four or five days at the most he would slip back into his old ways.

All of this to say, I totally get why you are so concerned with the small stuff. The big stuff staying on course is paramount. But my husband and I always felt disrespected and taken advantage of when our son would not take the small stuff seriously. I guess because it was indicative of the fact that he thought he could say the right things and then sucker us into putting up with the same old BS. In fact he essentially told his sister at one point that this was his approach to dealing with us.

Only you know what is acceptable behavior to you from your son. I would just encourage you to be fair, be supportive, but be smart about it. Hopefully a job will come soon and he will be in a position to leave on his own.

Keep us updated!
Mirabelle

I thought my previous approach obviously had not worked and it involved letting lesser rudeness and so on go. Which seemed to lead to him uppping and upping the levels of what he was doing till we got to 911 stage.

Also I have been using the Sheep book I mentioned above to help guide me and it says don’t let the small things go. I have also apologized sometimes when he has said he acted like “y” because I had said “x”.

The newest update is he starts a job Monday morning (2 days hence).

He hasn’t gotten up as of noon today which is a bit worrisome to me. In part because he went out with friends yesterday after getting job. I didn’t notice him seeming high when he came home, and he was pleasant when he arrived back. But that kind of thing remains a worry.

When I had asked if he wanted help with morning getting up, he got angry and said he’s an adult and doesn’t need a mom to help that. I told him grown ups don’t tend to constantly assert that they are adults, and in future he can just say, “No thank you.”


Anyway work on Monday starts at 7am, so he will need to leave no later than 6:30 am. And obviously up earlier than that to have time to get ready, eat etc.

We were trying to figure out breakfast and such (water to have available for example since it’s a landscaping company job in hot weather) .

Any thoughts? Including what foods etc tends to be settling for emotional behavior as well as sustaining a first day of probably pretty hard work ?
 

Mirabelle

Member
I'm so pleased he got the job! Yay! Geez, the food. If I were lucky enough to send mine off for a hard day's work I would probably go with a pbnj or a ham and cheese sandwich, a bag of chips, an apple, and lots of water and sports drinks. Young men sure eat a lot but the hot weather will probably curb his appetite some.

Best of luck to you guys. Very nerve wracking I know. I'll be thinking of you tomorrow!!
 

Ascending

New Member
Hello Ascending :). Thank you for the update on how things are going. I'm glad things sound like they are improved from the first time you posted. When you first let them back into the home to give it a try, it can be very nerve wracking. You want to give them a chance to show that they 'get it'; that the way they were acting before they left was unacceptable and that they can do better. Please, please do better!! Time to act like a grown up. Better behavior, off drugs, job interviews.....it sounds awesome!! I do hope he 'gets it' and stays on a solid path.

Our son never did 'get it.' We gave it several tries. A few times we had to kick him out, a few times he got mad at us and left on his own. I think it was a combination of him not having complete control over his own behavior, and his attitude that as an adult he should be able to do what he pleased in his own room / home. All of the rights of an adult with none of the responsibilities or obligations to others. His mom has a big spacious house, and I think living with her he got used to making noise, living in a pigsty, and smoking weed out his window. Our house is smaller, clean, and weed free! The rules were different and he didn't care for that at all. But after she kicked him out he didn't have a choice. Rather than modify his behavior, he tried to impose his will onto us.

Sometimes he left over major deal breakers eg. doing drugs, stealing. Other times it was our refusal to put up with the 'small lapses' as you say. After years of asking nicely and explaining why these things were important and getting yupped to death, we just said enough is enough. On one return home we came up with a contract with a three strikes system - and that return lasted three days! After losing two strikes in one weekend (loud music in the middle of the night, promising that he had fed the animals when he hadn't), he bailed because I guess he realized we weren't going to let up and be fine with him lying and acting like a big kid. And for a few years this continued back and forth. He would swear he understood how it needed to be, but within four or five days at the most he would slip back into his old ways.

All of this to say, I totally get why you are so concerned with the small stuff. The big stuff staying on course is paramount. But my husband and I always felt disrespected and taken advantage of when our son would not take the small stuff seriously. I guess because it was indicative of the fact that he thought he could say the right things and then sucker us into putting up with the same old BS. In fact he essentially told his sister at one point that this was his approach to dealing with us.

Only you know what is acceptable behavior to you from your son. I would just encourage you to be fair, be supportive, but be smart about it. Hopefully a job will come soon and he will be in a position to leave on his own.

Keep us updated!
Mirabelle
Confusion in posting.
He had job, but it was intensely disorganized snd he quit ... as he had an interview at probably a much better place... but not guaranteed.

Now he probably has the new job, more below.

Some of past reply was in my editor so forgive the repetition...

Anyway new job (which could be a career job with benefits etc) depends now on drug screening passage.

🙏🙏🙏

I thought my previous approach obviously had not worked and it involved letting lesser rudeness and so on go. Which seemed to lead to him uppping and upping the levels of what he was doing till we got to 911 stage.

And the information / guidance in In Sheep’s Clothing is to not let the little things go.

Well, the big news is: He probably has a (another different) job. It is dependent on passing a drug screening which he took today. I am praying he will have passed that. (And prayers from others appreciated!!!) He wasn’t sure when he last smoked weed, and it was less than two weeks since he came back home and has been off during that time which metabolites could still show up from longer than that. .

It is expected to start week after next with an orientation meeting.


It will be hard physical work. And possibly even 10 hour days in all weather. At least for a minimum of 3 months at entry level in forestry / lumber industry. After that he may be able to advance in the company.

He is planning to stay living at home as job starts, so his home behavior remains important.

I think the job may not only be a good entry job, but a good career path for him, one of his interviewers started at age 18 and has worked his way up and is now in supervisory position in his 40’s, he told my son.

I am praying hard for him to pass the screening and to Work hard and to make the job work !
 
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