Respect and such

A few thoughts on respect and staying truthful.

Just before my son went to rehab ( and eventually skipped that shortly after) I sat with him and had a talk. We had cycled to a lakeside nearby and sat there, overlooking the view while he talked about the stuff he wanted to do, the things that he wanted to change, and so on. And then it dawned on me; all that talk. All those words about applying for jobs or going back to school. On and on. Every time its the same story. He does this for one reason only: to keep me off his back. This is a pattern I know very well and have seen him practice for years.
So I revisited my decision from last year when I told him to make a choice, that ultimately ended in him moving out.

I tell him what I told him back then:
You do not have to make any promises to anyone. Make them to yourself instead, Son.
Your choice to do (anything in life) and not mine.
Your responsibility to make it happen, not anyone else's.
So make it happen.
Or stop talking about it.

Get help when needed, but respect that help. Or it too will run out.

All this is said with love.

I also repeat this to myself, to remember that it is not productive for me to worry about stuff that I cannot do anything about.
I think it was Melody Beattie who said that worrying in itself makes no difference whatsoever?
So true.

Since he came back from rehab, he has ghosted me completely which is a disrespectful thing to do to anyone, let alone one´s parent.
It fine to have no contact, if necessary, but I believe its always best, to be honest about it and say why.
This is for me a rule of thumb in any relationship and is not about being a father.

As of right now, he can still rely on his highly codependent mother and grandmother to "help" him out. This appears to not end soon.
The addicts´ repeating behavior is well known to many of you here; its as if you can almost write the script for the next instance.
So all I can do is sit back and watch his life go nowhere. But I keep reminding myself that is is HIS life. Not mine.
Also when the heart screams.
 
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Copabanana

Well-Known Member
he has ghosted me completely
All those words about applying for jobs or going back to school. On and on. Every time its the same story. He does this for one reason only: to keep me off his back.
I would guess that when he mouths the words he believes them. I think he thinks at the time that he is creating a future but can't or won't back it up by acts. My son was like this. They're what I call "magic words." The sense by them if they say them they are real. I would also guess that he has disappeared either because of shame so deep that he cannot even feel it; or the fact that he knows you will be of no use to him, as he goes down this road (a good thing.)

Drugs rob somebody of any will or energy for any other thing. If you are not useful to procure or support his using drugs, you or anybody becomes peripheral.

I gained a great deal from this forum and I have been here over 5 years. While I needed here, I regret all of the time and agony I devoted to this. I wish I had realized much sooner that I can be okay, even if my son is not. I can hold in my heart the two lives at once, and I did not have to go down that road with my son.
 

RN0441

100% better than I was but not at 100% yet
Copa

I have seen a great growth and change in you. I am so happy that you are living your own life and letting your son live his. We all have to find our own way. Hugs.
 
Thanks Copa,
I very much agree that he believes every word himself. But he also has a mile-long record of telling people just what they want to hear, to keep things quiet. It's a typical ADD strategy: avoidance behavior. And totally understandable, if not very productive, for a young person with these issues, only when applied to drug addiction the script, unfortunately, writes itself.
In some ways, the predictability of it all makes it easier to cope with.
 

Copabanana

Well-Known Member
I have seen a great growth and change in you.
Dear RN (I don't mean to hijack Bruce. Maybe some of this applies to your situation, too.)

Thank you very much. I feel great change. However the challenges are here too. My son keeps making some of the same mistakes, and his way of escaping the consequences is to seek to return here.

He triggers me. Not just the marijuana or the dirtiness but his dominance and unwillingness or inability to permit another person to have autonomy of ideas or needs.

When my son triggers me I begin to feel that the defect is in me. And that begins a downward spiral. It's hard to hold onto myself. And M is still in the picture. *Yet again, M would want me to let my son come back, think. I dread it. I have no hope that any (more) support from me will in any way alter the picture for my son.

He has shown that he is able to find supportive living situations like sober living, if he chooses. Although he antagonizes house managers by refusing to adhere to reasonable rules. This last time he refused to accede to reasonable rules about the pandemic because he refuses to acknowledge it is real and believes that everybody should think and behave as does he. How does anybody get along with somebody who won't give an inch?

It is still very hard for me to think of him (let alone deal with the reality) on the street, abused by others, with nowhere to go.
 
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BusynMember

Well-Known Member
My daughter Kay listens to nobody and talks nonstop about conspiracy theories related to the government and vaccinations. It is tiring. Exhausting.

I don't.believe that it is possible to have a real relationship if it is one sided and your views are not accepted. It is very hard to let go but I don't care if we never talk again if she does not change. I feel better not talking to her.

I am so sorry Copa. It is very hard. Especially when they are into conspiracy stuff. It's so crazy. How can you have a conversation with people who believe in things that are not real?

Sending prayers and love to all.
 

JMom

Well-Known Member
Bruce,

I dislike that you were ghosted. I agree it is disrespectful and hurtful. I see your pain and I also see that you are staying very grounded in all of this. You pointing out the words of Beattie and reminding yourself that it is HIS life is, in my opinion VERY healthy. It is disappointing that his mom and grandmother are enablers. They will no doubt have their own journey with your son. Please keep posting and let us know how you are holding up.

Hugs,
JMOM
 

RN0441

100% better than I was but not at 100% yet
Bruce

The addict will be friendly with those that support their lifestyle. Your son KNOWS he cannot fool you and he doesn't like it.

I am glad he is not with you so you can have some peace. In time I am sure his mother and grandmother will see they are enabling him. You should let them know about this site! It's something we're all guilty of UNTIL we figure out what is going on. It took me some time to do this. I didn't want to face that my son was an addict. What??!! That was beyond my comprehension.

Stay here and keep posting. You will get wisdom and strength from those who have walked this path.

Oh and I loved your frank conversation with him!! Awesome.
 

HMBgal

Well-Known Member
Bruce
The addict will be friendly with those that support their lifestyle. Your son KNOWS he cannot fool you and he doesn't like it.
Boy, this is so true! But you know, these people always get it in the end. They get tired of being used, let down, and lied to. My daughter is a master of collecting "helpful" friends. She's so smart, sweet, and has the potential of being such a good and loyal friend, so people warm to her and want to help. But then I start getting the messages from them. It's so damn hard.
 
My story is on another thread, but I can relate to the subject of these posts. It dawned on me after reading these post, that in my case it is my son's girlfriend's family who is enabling them ( my son and his girlfriend both have addictions) which is making our family's jounery harder. I have been a big enabler as well in the past, and again just recently.
 
A few thoughts on respect and staying truthful.
I also repeat this to myself, to remember that it is not productive for me to worry about stuff that I cannot do anything about.
I think it was Melody Beattie who said that worrying in itself makes no difference whatsoever?
So true.

I need to do this too. You sound like a strong person.
 

amazeofgrace

A maze of Grace - that about sums it up
[\QUOTE]As of right now, he can still rely on his highly codependent mother and grandmother to "help" him out. This appears to not end soon. The addicts´ repeating behavior is well known to many of you here; its as if you can almost write the script for the next instance.
So all I can do is sit back and watch his life go nowhere. But I keep reminding myself that is is HIS life. Not mine.
Also when the heart screams.
[/QUOTE]


I say this with humor and no disrespect, as the highly codependent mother who needs 8 holes patched, one piece of dry wall, 3 new doors, a dryer bubble and new drawers for her fridge - there are days were I wish my son would only ghost me. Humor is very much my coping mechanism...

It sounds like despite the ghosting (which is obviously avoidance and possible guilt on his part) that he has respect for you. I wonder sometimes if it's not the Father/Son relationship - sadly my sons' Father checked out over 15 years ago. I actually don't consider myself "highly" codependent - it's just every time I stand my ground, a kitchen appliance loses it's life - or worse. And I know the day is coming where I have to just stand my ground and let the chips fall where they may (Police, Arrest, Shelter) - I've done it before when he was younger (and not taller than me) and he was hospitalized for 9 months.

We don't know each other - but the fact you're on here means you're a good Dad and I can completely relate, as my heart screams and aches daily for both my boys. We can only take it one day at a time.
 
[\QUOTE]As of right now, he can still rely on his highly codependent mother and grandmother to "help" him out. This appears to not end soon. The addicts´ repeating behavior is well known to many of you here; its as if you can almost write the script for the next instance.
So all I can do is sit back and watch his life go nowhere. But I keep reminding myself that is is HIS life. Not mine.
Also when the heart screams.

I say this with humor and no disrespect, as the highly codependent mother who needs 8 holes patched, one piece of dry wall, 3 new doors, a dryer bubble and new drawers for her fridge - there are days were I wish my son would only ghost me. Humor is very much my coping mechanism...

It sounds like despite the ghosting (which is obviously avoidance and possible guilt on his part) that he has respect for you. I wonder sometimes if it's not the Father/Son relationship - sadly my sons' Father checked out over 15 years ago. I actually don't consider myself "highly" codependent - it's just every time I stand my ground, a kitchen appliance loses it's life - or worse. And I know the day is coming where I have to just stand my ground and let the chips fall where they may (Police, Arrest, Shelter) - I've done it before when he was younger (and not taller than me) and he was hospitalized for 9 months.

We don't know each other - but the fact you're on here means you're a good Dad and I can completely relate, as my heart screams and aches daily for both my boys. We can only take it one day at a time.
[/QUOTE]

Thanks for your words. I have had thoughts about the father/son dynamic many times.
 

amazeofgrace

A maze of Grace - that about sums it up
My daughter Kay listens to nobody and talks nonstop about conspiracy theories related to the government and vaccinations. It is tiring. Exhausting.

I don't.believe that it is possible to have a real relationship if it is one sided and your views are not accepted. It is very hard to let go but I don't care if we never talk again if she does not change. I feel better not talking to her.

I am so sorry Copa. It is very hard. Especially when they are into conspiracy stuff. It's so crazy. How can you have a conversation with people who believe in things that are not real?

Sending prayers and love to all.
[/QUOTE}

I am so glad I am not alone - both of my sons constantly go on and on about conspiracy theories and try and discredit my faith (I am a Christian) it's exhausting and I learned no amount of research on my part will help so long as they have Wikopedia SMH - D
 
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