Stay-at-home mom or not?

[BusynMember]

There is no one proper way to hold a baby unless you let the head hang down (that would be dangerous). There are no real right or Wong ways to do anything. There are people who have opinion is all. My kids thrived fine and I had no idea there was a right or wrong way to do these things.

Now I have opinion s too on right and wrong things to do from every topic from babies to working to anything in the world. But an opinion is not a truth. It is just what WE prefer and think is better.

I never watched my mom when I was little. I don't think she even held us with the bottle. I know she didn't even consider breastfeeding. She propped the bottle for me, claiming I didn't like to be held. I don't remember nor did I care if she actually cuddled my siblings when feeding them. I never once watched her change a diaper. I WISHED she would have gotten a job and left me alone!

Sven is right though. In high earner areas mother's, even way back then, did not work. They probably did lunch, shopped, did PTA, hired maids (they did in my community,) and had it easy. That did not mean they spent more time being motherly. Some did, some didn't. My mother sure didn't.

I was a good mom, even with no example. I just wasn't interested in my mom and siblings. My mom was a witch to me. I didn't want to be like her. So I did a better job with my kids, nothing like her.
.
Women are not biologically wired to be mothers. That is a fallacy. Many women are abusive and neglectful toward their babies or don't even want to have babies.

Everything on earth is subjective.

 

[Pink Elephant]

There is no one proper way to hold a baby unless you let the head hang down (that would be dangerous). There are no real right or Wong ways to do anything. There are people who have opinion is all. My kids thrived fine and I had no idea there was a right or wrong way to do these things.

Now I have opinion s too on right and wrong things to do from every topic from babies to working to anything in the world. But an opinion is not a truth. It is just what WE prefer and think is better.

I never watched my mom when I was little. I don't think she even held us with the bottle. I know she didn't even consider breastfeeding. She propped the bottle for me, claiming I didn't like to be held. I don't remember nor did I care if she actually cuddled my siblings when feeding them. I never once watched her change a diaper. I WISHED she would have gotten a job and left me alone!

Sven is right though. In high earner areas mother's, even way back then, did not work. They probably did lunch, shopped, did PTA, hired maids (they did in my community,) and had it easy. That did not mean they spent more time being motherly. Some did. Some didn't. My mother didn't have it that easy, didn't socialize and was not a good mom. She didn't drive or work though and we still had nesecities. My dad made a decision rent buck.

I was a good mom, even with no example. I just wasn't interested in my mom and siblings. My mom was a witch to me. I didn't want to be like her. So I did a better job with my kids, nothing like her.
.
Women are not biologically wired to be mothers. That is a fallacy. Many women are abusive and neglectful toward tbeir babies or don't even want to have babies.

Everything on earth is subjective.

So much of what I learned related to baby-care was the result of being taught back in the day when most everyone did things a certain way... the same way in many cases. Holding little newborn babies, you always made sure to support their necks, and that sort of thing.

I remember propping baby's bottle, too. Not only did I prop bottles with siblings, I did as a sitter, and when my own children were little.

I've always been one that believed in the actual one-on-one care of a young and growing child as being more important, than the baby basics I was taught way back when. Love, nurturing, care, that to me trumps holding a baby properly.

Where I was going with my previous thread, was some women look so uncomfortable holding babies and young children. It looks so unnatural with some, whereas others seem to be born with a natural ability, with or without previous baby experience.

 

[BusynMember]

I think this was always true. We just forget that people were always different people. My mother probably looked scared to death holding me. She did not like babies and told me she felt nothing when they put me in her arms for the first time and I believe it!! She never really liked kids. I doubt she held me with ease. I didn't notice how she held my siblings.

Back to me as a young mom. In 1977, it was BIG TIME frowned upon to prop bottles in my world. BIG TIME. You were told that feeding time was love time and to cuddle your baby in your arms .Breastfeeding was common but I was on medication so I can I had to bottle feed.

I never saw anyone prop a bottle. Not once. Nobody did it. Nobody. If a babysitter had dared prop a bottle with my babies, I would have been cross and never hired them again, but it never happened. I didn't use sitters . The babies came with us or we stayed in.

It's interesting to me to hear the differences in various parts of the world. And there are real differences.

 

[Pink Elephant]

I think this was always true. We just forget that people were always different people. My mother probably looked scared to death holding me. She did not like babies and told me she felt nothing when they put me in her arms for the first time and I believe it!! She never really liked kids. I doubt she held me with ease. I didn't notice how she held my siblings.

Back to me as a young mom. In 1977, it was BIG TIME frowned upon to prop bottles in my world. BIG TIME. You were told that feeding time was love time and to cuddle your baby in your arms .Breastfeeding was common but I was on medication so I can I had to bottle feed.

I never saw anyone prop a bottle. Not once. Nobody did it. Nobody. If a babysitter had dared prop a bottle with my babies, I would have been cross and never hired them again, but it never happened. I didn't use sitters . The babies came with us or we stayed in.

It's interesting to me to hear the differences in various parts of the world. And there are real differences.

My mom babysat before she had us, so mom was good at being at the holding, etc.

Oh yes... I remember the kerfuffle that bottle-propping caused among those who didn't support it. More so later on... like into the 80's, possibly 90's. Ideally, bottle-feeding truly was centered around holding your baby lovingly, etc, at feeding time. I gather those who wrote the book lived perfect little lives, where nothing else mattered or came into play - other than feeding baby. LOL! Such wasn't the case in our house when I was growing up. My mom had 4 babies within a 7 year period (and that's after I was born), so mom learned how to maximize her time, spreading it around frugally, and bottle-propping was one of her faves.

I didn't use sitters per se, unless needed, and I do mean needed, and when I was able to, my mom and other family did the sitting for us, though, in addition to, I did have a couple of older school/college girls that babysat for us (outside of family), and both were dependable, well-experienced, and superb.

Yes, it's true, there are differences around the world, even from neighbour to neighbour when it comes to childrearing. I'm perfectly content as to how I handled things when my kids were little. My methods may have not been perfect, but I got the job done and my kids endured no ill-suffering or pain as a result.

 

[BusynMember]

In some parts of the world mother's carry their babies on their backs and families sleep together for bonding. Princess was raised like this in her foster home in Korea so I had to sleep on the floor with her when she first came or she didn't sleep. I finally gave up and slept with her in our bed. I truly feel this made us close and we still are.

My daughter did something called bonding parenting. Not sure what that is.

Certainly if one has lots of babies you have to adjust. I don't see many big families anymore. Kids are expensive to raise.

This brings up up the interesting point that in Wealthy, IL back in my childhood, very few families had many kids. Four was rare. In the Catholic areas of Chicago there were big families, but not really in my neck of the woods.

 

[Pink Elephant]

In some parts of the world mother's carry their babies on their backs and families sleep together for bonding. Princess was raised like this in her foster home in Korea so I had to sleep on the floor with her when she first came or she didn't sleep. I finally gave up and slept with her in our bed. I truly feel this made us close and we still are.

I love that. Can't remember what television show I was watching where the mothers had their little ones tied to their backs with cotton sheets while working the fields, etc.

Personally, I loved the crib! What an invention! LOL! Not only did the baby crib serve as a place where baby could sleep, the baby crib also served as a place where I could park my kids when misbehaving, often resulting in me settling on crib-time rather than spanking-time, and I never had to worry where they were or what they were getting into when they were safely contained within their jail-bar like contraptions.

Maryjane, a neighbour I first started babysitting for, had a crib with a lid on it, so she'd set her terror of a son inside and close the lid and latch it. He used to go wild! Hated the lid thing from the time I started babysitting for her. In fact, never did I come across the lid thing ever again in any other homes after my babysitting years ended at, Maryjane's. Her house was the only house such existed in my experience.

 

[Pink Elephant]

Anyone else remember when bottle-propping was the norm? Like back in the 60's and 70's norm?

 

[BusynMember]

Wow. I think that sounds abusive. I had anxiety as a kid. I would have been traumatized for real if my mother had done that to me.

I was mostly about being a loving parent, not getting my kids out of my way or making things easier for me. I often made things harder for me if I thought it was better for my kiddos. It was a very child-centric home. I also had a high tolerance for kid silliness and noise and didn't get upset if one of mine didn't always listen to me. I was very soft hearted toward my kids, maybe too much so, but they are all independent and employed and doing well. Best of all, I am very close to them. But I could have run a tighter ship. The truth is I liked a more laid back home. I never used a crib for anything but sleep. I never used a playpen at all.

I can not say I was never stressed out. Sometimes I couldn't wait to go to my evening part time job lol. But I never thought of doing things differently. There are so many ways to be good parents. We both were good parents. We cared for and loved our children. We just did things differently. And that's okay. Right?

 

[Pink Elephant]

In some parts of the world mother's carry their babies on their backs and families sleep together for bonding. Princess was raised like this in her foster home in Korea so I had to sleep on the floor with her when she first came or she didn't sleep. I finally gave up and slept with her in our bed. I truly feel this made us close and we still are.

My daughter did something called bonding parenting. Not sure what that is.

Certainly if one has lots of babies you have to adjust. I don't see many big families anymore. Kids are expensive to raise.

This brings up up the interesting point that in Wealthy, IL back in my childhood, very few families had many kids. Four was rare. In the Catholic areas of Chicago there were big families, but not really in my neck of the woods.

Your mother never had you fetch things for her that she needed when caring for your sibs?

Yes, it's sot true, kids are expensive to raise. Families with 4 kids was somewhat rare in our neck of the woods, too. Of course the exception was never hard to find, but most homes where I babysat at had the standard 2-3 kids.

My late high school year I had a babysitting job up and across the street from our house. That was for 6 kids, 3 in diapers. The house was dirty and unorganized, clothes, junk, and laundry all over, and the kids were seldom clean or bathed. It wasn't a favourite place of mine to sit at, but she used me faithfully each week, usually on Friday nights, and she always paid me before I left.

I recall stripping crib bedding while there, bathing the kids, and washing diapers, to try and pull-together her home while there, but it was futile. Each week I visited, the home reverted back to the same chaotic state. Not a healthy environment.

 

[Pink Elephant]

Wow. I think that sounds abusive. I had anxiety as a kid. I would have been traumatized for real if my mother had done that to me.

I was mostly about being a loving parent, not getting my kids out of my way or making things easier for me. I often made things harder for me if I thought it was better for my kiddos. It was a very child-centric home. I also had a high tolerance for kid silliness and noise and didn't get upset if one of mine didn't always listen to me. I was very soft hearted toward my kids, maybe too much so, but they are all independent and employed and doing well. Best of all, I am very close to them. But I could have run a tighter ship. The truth is I liked a more laid back home. I never used a crib for anything but sleep. I never used a playpen at all.

I can not say I was never stressed out. Sometimes I couldn't wait to go to my evening part time job lol. But I never thought of doing things differently. There are so many ways to be good parents. We both were good parents. We cared for and loved our children. We just did things differently. And that's okay. Right?

As I mentioned, SOT, I didn't like it or think much of it either. Yes, looking back on it now it does seem abusive.

Boy, how that kid used to scream! Shaking the bars with all his little might. Poor thing.

 

[BusynMember]

My mother never so much as asked me to bring her a cup if she wanted some tea. I never knew when she was doing anything for my siblings and have no memory of her doing so. If she had asked for something I wouldn't have known where to find it. Maybe she had a diaper service. I don't recall her washing diapers. And I don't recall a diaper pail. I really have almost no memory of what she did with or for my siblings.She was both a lazy mother and a disorganized housekeeper so maybe she didn't do much. I remember some of the stuff she did to me but that's all. And I have no memory of wearing diapers or being changed. I think I was trained at 18 mo. That may be why.

 

[Pink Elephant]

My mother never so much as asked me to bring her a cup if she wanted some tea. I never knew when she was doing anything for my siblings and have no memory of her doing so. If she had asked for something I wouldn't have known where to find it. Maybe she had a diaper service. I don't recall her washing diapers. And I don't recall a diaper pail. I really have almost no memory of what she did with or for my siblings.She was both a lazy mother and a disorganized housekeeper so maybe she didn't do much. I remember some of the stuff she did to me but that's all. And I have no memory of wearing diapers or being changed. I think I was trained at 18 mo. That may be why.

Hugs to you, SOT.

I was moms second set of hands and feet for a while, before I was old enough to start taking on the role of caring for my sibs. I ran for clean diapers, while taking dirty ones to the bathroom, for cigarettes, for bottles, for bibs, and whatever else your mind can imagine. My mom was a domestic goddess, everything had a place and was spotlessly clean. Mom truly prided herself with doting over us kids and my dad. She did it all.

Helping out with the care of my sibs is more than likely why I carry with me such a vivid and clear recollection of all things related to my upbringing and my siblings upbringing. As for wearing diapers, I do seem to remember being changed or having my diapers fussed with by an aunt babysitting me while in my crib when I was older, but that's the only diaper thing I remember related to me. I was trained in my early two's. I do remember being scolded for accidents.

 

[BusynMember]

That's cool, pink. My mom was not into keeping a spotless house. And I never had chores or anything. None of us did. I don't much enjoy those things either and inherited her disorganization. I probably would have thrown out a man who didn't help lol but in my world men helped by then so in both marriages I got willing help with kids and home. My husband now was the BEST father from Day One. He is a twelve year Air Force vet but was never concerned about helping handily with his kids and the house. That is on top of always working full time in a very physically demanding job. I hit the jack pot with him. He is so amazing. I think this almost 24 years later. He is calm too. We have had maybe three fights in all that time. People who fight a lot may not believe that, but it's true. He is mild tempered and I am basically a door slammer who will come out and apologize when I get over it. Even the door slamming didn't happen much.

I am off topic.

It helps to have a willingly helpful partner. That was my long winded point.

As for my mom, she had one kid at a time and I imagine my grandma would help with us. She certainly did with me. She came over every Saturday.

I had no nieces or nephews to have to look after. I don't think I would have been interested enough to do a good babysitting job and I would have been grossed out by diapers. Honestly, I think cloth diapers and how they kept in the urine and poop would have never been a good fit for me. I am sure I never would have bothered to fold and organize them. I would have thought"Why bother? They are going back on a butt to get pooped in." As an aside I don't fold laundry either. I buy wash and wear. Always did. My husband folds his laundry (he does his own) but I just fold what needs folding once it's pulled out of the dryer and by my closet and dresser.. Like I don't fold underwear.

 

[Pink Elephant]

That's cool, pink. My mom was not into keeping a spotless house. And I never had chores or anything. None of us did. I don't much enjoy those things either and inherited her disorganization. I probably would have thrown out a man who didn't help lol but in my world men helped by then so in both marriages I got willing help with kids and home. My husband now was the BEST father from Day One. He is a twelve year Air Force vet but was never concerned about helping handily with his kids and the house. That is on top of always working full time in a very physically demanding job. I hit the jack pot with him. He is so amazing. I think this almost 24 years later. He is calm too. We have had maybe three fights in all that time. People who fight a lot may not believe that, but it's true. He is mild tempered and I am basically a door slammer who will come out and apologize when I get over it. Even the door slamming didn't happen much.

I am off topic.

It helps to have a willingly helpful partner. That was my long winded point.

As for my mom, she had one kid at a time and I imagine my grandma would help with us. She certainly did with me. She came over every Saturday.

I had no nieces or nephews to have to look after. I don't think I would have been interested enough to do a good babysitting job and I would have been grossed out by diapers. Honestly, I think cloth diapers and how they kept in the urine and poop would have never been a good fit for me. I am sure I never would have bothered to fold and organize them. I would have thought"Why bother? They are going back on a butt to get pooped in." As an aside I don't fold laundry either. I buy wash and wear. Always did. My husband folds his laundry (he does his own) but I just fold what needs folding once it's pulled out of the dryer and by my closet and dresser.. Like I don't fold underwear.

Good morning to you, SOT.

Yesterday was my gardening day, not that Sunday's in general are my scheduled gardening day, just that I decided that yesterday was a great day to get out and enjoy the outdoors.

Regarding getting off topic ever now and then, who cares. That's what makes conversation here so enjoyable. It's called letting our hair down.

Yes, support is number one. I would have loved a husband that took-on baby and childcare, but hey, he always did everything else, so I can't complain.

I do find when it comes to cloth diapers there are two camps, the like camp, and the hate camp. There is no in-between.

Gee-whiz, SOT... you don't fold laundry? I'd end up in a rubber-room if I had to live around unfolded laundry! LOL! Regular washing, folding, and ironing, are all part of my weekly household routine. Always has been, always will be. I run a tight ship. There's no room for wrinkles in the laundry I do, and yes, I even fold panties and bras.

 

[BusynMember]

Lol. I was pretty sure you did that.

I have no routine. I don't fold anything until it is ready for a drawer and only if it needs to be folded. Like to me an underwear drawer doesn't need to be perfectly stacked. Or socks. I buy the same socks all the time and just grab two when I need them. I don't own an iron anymore. I never used one much. Not at all anal about the house. Or anything. I am not compulsive about anything really. My husband does his own laundry and folds the big stuff, however he is picky about what he wears and doesn't have a lot of clothes so there is never much laundry. Example: He has about six pairs of black identical jeans. No kidding. He got used to wearing them because at work sometimes he would get messy so he wanted black. Well, now he is retired but still wears the same jeans lol. His shirts have to have very thin material. I gave up shopping much for him, although he liked my funny retirement shirt!

Onward: I didn't have strong opinions on cloth diapers vs. disposables. Nobody in my world used cloth when I had babies so there was nothing to think about. I just bought disposables like everyone else did. The topic never came up. When Princess was picked up at the airport from Korea, SHE had on a disposable diapers with extras in a bag!!! Even in Korea! Nobody propped bottles either where I lived. I did the same thing things my contemporaries did although many breast fed and I could not. When Bart was born I lived in a middle class Chicago suburb and this is what we did. We also made sure our kids were in at least half day three day a week preschool by age three and parent/kid classes too. And sports was huge and started at four or five. The way I was different was that I did not work full time. About it. But that was a big difference.

My hubby did not just help with the kids. He did the stereotyped male chores too. He was and is also very handle and can fix cars to washing machines to doing plumbing. So we rarely hired people to fix anything. I am very spoiled and blessed.

 

[Pink Elephant]

Lol. I was pretty sure you did that.

I have no routine. I don't fold anything until it is ready for a drawer and only if it needs to be folded. Like to me an underwear drawer doesn't need to be perfectly stacked. Or socks. I buy the same socks all the time and just grab two when I need them. I don't own an iron anymore. I never used one much. Not at all anal about the house.

I also didn't have strong opinions on cloth diapers vs. disposables. Nobody in my world used cloth when I had babies so there was nothing to think about. I just bought disposables like everyone else did. The topic never came up. Nobody propped bottles either. I did the same things my contemporaries did although many breast feed and I could not. When Bart was born I lived in a middle class Chicago suburb and this is what we did. The way I was different was not working full time. About it.

My hubby did not just help with the kids. He did the stereotyped male chores too. He was and is also very handle and can fix cars to washing machines to doing plumbing. I am very spoiled and blessed.

LOL!

I don't really have a routine, but am strict when it comes to staying on top of things. I do like a clean and organized home. In fact, it's a must with me. Even when my kids were little, everything in their dresser drawers had a place and was immaculately folded. Baby sleepers and pyjamas (first two top drawers), diapers (third drawer), rubber pants (fourth drawer), training pants, socks, and spare crib sheets (5th and 6th drawers).

Panties, socks, bras, underpants, all neatly folded and stacked in hubbies and my bed-side night tables.

I breastfed my first two (not fulltime), but I breastfed no less. Have to admit, loved the convenience of bottles, even though I now understand the benefits of breastfeeding. I knew few mothers that breastfed when my kids were babies. As for diapers, most everyone I knew used cloth. When my oldest daughter was a baby, I could look out the kitchen window (any given day) which faced the back alley, and there would be a long row of snow white diapers hanging on someone's clothesline. Mind you we lived in the poor part of town at the time, so I'm sure that played a large part as to cloth diaper use in our hood.

Dear husband also does (and did) standard home repairs... leaky faucets, toilets, engine tinkering, that sort of thing, which helped save us money, money that we didn't have to hire someone to do it for us.

 

[BusynMember]

When i think about it, disposable diapers were sort of expensive if they were name brands and even more now. Ususlly I hust bought off brands that were not expensive.

I never lived in a neighborhood that was not at least middle class. Some people who lived there we're upper middle, some middle middle and some working class. And this is the sort of place where I live now. It is also rural in certain areas, but mostly not. Mostly houses and some small apartment complexes. It is very diverse.

When I worked as a bus aide at Head Start (you had to be lower income to send your kids there) I had to sub as an aide in classrooms too. Sometimes I was in the infant to two year old or two year old room and we changed diapers often there. We had a time to change them all but if a kid pooped we changed tje diaper right away. Every child there wore disposables. We also kept extra disposables.

For us in this part of Wisconsin, which is not rich, disposables are cultural, I guess. Moms use disposables just as they did when Bart was born...in the place where I lived. I never lived anywhere where cloth was used. And I had my oldest in 1977. It was like that in my world way back then. Most of Head Start was single moms and somehow disposables were in the budget. That was all we saw.

 

[BusynMember]

I think I tried organizing clothes like you did, but it never lasted...lol.

 

[Pink Elephant]

When i think about it, disposable tapers were expensive and even more now. I never lived in a neighborhood that was not at least middle class. Some we're upper middle, some middle middle and some working class.

When I worked as a bus aide at Head Start (you had to be lower income to send your kids there) I had to sub as an aide in classrooms too. Sometimes I was in the infant to two year old or two year old room and we changed diapers often there. Every child there wore disposables. We also kept extra disposables.

For us in this part of Wisconsin, which is not rich, it is cultural. Mom's use disposables just as they did when Bart was born...in the place where I lived. I never lived anywhere where cloth was used. And I had my oldest in 1977. It was like that in my world way back then. Most of Head Start was single moms and somehow disposables were in the budget.

I agree, SOT, disposable diapers are so expensive. Well, at least in my eyes they are.

Just putting things into perspective, I could buy a pack of rubber pants (6 pairs of rubber pants in a pack) for just over $1, and those pants lasted for months on end. Pennies per pair. Cloth diapers (12 to a pack) used to go on sale each month for $8 and change, and lasted through two kids. That's less than $1 a diaper, and those diapers were good for years. So economical it was. Well worth the folding, the pinning, and the rinsing.

I was still babysitting in 1977, and cloth diapers were still in use at all of my jobs.

 

[BusynMember]

I believe you, Pink. All necks of the woods are different. And rural vs. city are night and day. And rich vs. poor.

I remember seeing a diaper service truck with a big blue safety pin as a decoration driving down my street when I was at my parent's home. I don't see them anymore at all.

If I had used them out if no choice I would have had a diaper service.