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Am I Losing My Mind? Please Help!
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<blockquote data-quote="Star*" data-source="post: 543171" data-attributes="member: 4964"><p>Hi Pippi, </p><p></p><p>Welcome to the board and the family. I'd like to start by saying I usually do not play in the General Forum, I'm mostly in the Water Cooler - because my children are grown and what I think I could offer here seems to be outdated advice because in so many years things have changed, medicines have come along that are different, and I don't have any little ones in school anymore. My "little one" is 21, and expecting a little one any day now. However your story so mimiced our life years ago I wanted to share some hindsight and insight with you as it pertained to our life. Our life? Was hell on earth. We got out, lived to tell about it, and have since moved on. </p><p></p><p>So for as much as you may understand and share that knowledge? The abuses, misguided lessons (the cursing, the swearing, the thought processes, the lighter) any thing like that which Daddy NOT SO WONDERFUL (hence forth DN) taught his Daughter - and it doesn't matter if they had 2 months or 2 years together - she DID learn things at an age when her mind was a varitable sponge. Everything we hear, see, smell, touch - is stored in our minds like digital processing in a computer. We may not remember it - but it's there, for recall. Think about a smell that "takes you back" - digital recall. Think about a color that you see and you may say "Oh my Granny had a couch that exact same color" - digital recal. Well - our children remember behaviors that they got 'praise' for at an early age and it changed the mapping in their minds. Mapping is what makes up our character, our thought processes, or choices, our mannerisms.....who we our and how we react to situations. The things that DN taught your daughter ALTERED her thought processes from normal to NOT SO normal. (Sound Familiar? The not so normal?) yeah - and why is that? Well Some of it - NOT ALL OF IT - but some is genetic, and some is learned behavior. MOST of what your daughter is exhibiting right now? .....</p><p></p><p>Well hang on to your hat......It's learned. It can be changed, altered, and started to be fixed. BUT it IS damaged. Changing the mapping in her mind? Do-able - but it takes YEARS of work. The work is MOSTLY going to fall to YOU and your husband - because right now? YOU have to admit things like - I am NOT parenting this child correctly. I am NOT reacting correctly to her outrageous behaviors. I am NOT calm and serene and non- reactive when she is trying to get all the attention......and why is that Pepper? Well - Because the instruction manual that should come with all damaged kids? Just doesn't. I mean who would think to write such a thing and pass it out and go - Well - Okay you got married, you had a baby, and the Daddy slick and clean went postal with a newborn, soooooo instead of the Dr. Spock version of How to raise your children - YOU get - Dat dah dahhh Dahhh. The Conduct disorders revised edition 2.0 - HOw to tame your mouth around a smart alek kid when what you'd really like to do is put your fist through a wall and scream like a banshee because you've BEEN a good, understanding parent for the last 12 weeks and nothing's NOTHING has worked? (yeah Barnes and Noble doesn't have that out yet - but I'm sure we could get several parents here to commit to at least a chapter or 2) </p><p></p><p>So how do you cope before your marriage falls apart, or you loose your sanity? And when I say that? I'm not being the least bit funny.....See I had this episode where we were driving down the road and I started laughing at this bumper sticker that said REAL MEN LOVE JESUS....EXCEPT.....IN MY demented state of stress? I thought it said REAL MEN LOVE CHEESES - (WOULD HAVE SWORN TO IT) AND began laughing so hysterically my fiance nearly pulled off the road to slap my face. I scared my son so badly he was on the verge of tears - he was like 15, maybe 16. You ever see people in a sanitarium laughing in a movie? Well - the psychiatrist told me that's the bodies LAST defense to stablize our brains before your cheeses really (vvvvvvrrrrrrrrt) slides off your cracker......and mine was going South fast. So what do you do about that? At that point our family had been in counseling for years......and it was the only thing that kept me sane (THE ONLY THING) because we had tried - out of home placements, medications - like up to that point around 64, and group homes, psychiatric hospitals, residential treatments, foster care.....outpatient....and family therapy. The kid didn't like therapy - but it's what worked the most - and I'm not sure if it worked the best because for him? He was obstinate - and willful - would not participate, but we made him go anyway. it was a pattern, a routine if you will that said - THIS IS WHAT IS NORMAL - and what is going on at home and in your life? IS NOT - but we went as a family , I went as a MOm and he went as a kid - so three times a week/ for nearly 15 years - we went. And a lot of that was to help ME figure out HOW to deal with MYSELF and HIM. I learned an enormous lot about HOW not to be a parent, a MOTHER, a friend, ......a better person - a DOORMAT......how to say NO......and stand up for myself. WHY I made poor choices in my life and how not to repeat them in relationships, jobs, and life. AND of all that - the most important - to be the best example I COULD BE for my son. </p><p></p><p>The back side flip to that? Was at 17? We threw our son out of our home. He went to go live with the man that was more abusive in his life (my x) that anyone could ever have paid anyone to be. It broke my heart....but therapy had taught me to detach. My son lived in parks, was homeless, ate out of dumpsters......had no clothes, was dirty...and never asked me for a dime - once he called and asked for clothes for a job interview in 3 years. When it seemed he got himself straightenend out? We helped him out. When he needs it - truly needs help? We're there. When he tries for himself........and does things for himself and we see improvements on his behalf.....sure. But it's a give and take - and you have to realize that some times you have to do things for them for yourself - but do NOT make a habit out of it, and DO NOT do those things out of GUILT because of the past. GET RID OF THE WORD......SHOULD from your vocabulary - as in "OH when she was little I should have...." nope - it's a killer statement - and our kids while emotionally stunted....are not dumb....so they figure things out in a room like (Snap) and prey on those things. Very clever about the baby talk and the Xray don't you think? Most 9 year olds don't have that cognitive thinking ......so she's not dumb - she's just had her mapping changed to get by on her wits.....and she uses them like a honed blade. CHANGING that for good? Hard to do but not impossible and it WILL get worse before it gets better - but the benefit you have is that if you start NOW.....at NINE.......by the time shes 21/ MOST of what you teach her NOW.......MAY sink in and she'll use those tools......in her 20's. </p><p></p><p>Otherwise - you're flirting with antisocial behaviors, which could possibly lead you to sociopathic or psychopathic tendencies. (this is what I was told) Conduct disorders left unchecked - can progress. </p><p></p><p>I guess that's your gamble. I know my x - he's a psychopath/sociopath bipolar, drug abuser, womanizer, alcoholic - and well - I wanted to genetically give my son the benefit of the doubt. </p><p></p><p>My son too - at age 3 - took ballbats to our hired help - and got "laughs" ----he too at age 2 was taught to curse and call women (his own Mother) FILTHY disgusting names..and got praised for it. Like I said our list goes on and on - and it's horrid, and vile. But I want you to understand something right now......something you said that caught my attention first and made me write you - </p><p></p><p>DO NOT EVER - EVER minimalize the trauma that you and your daughter went through or compare it to anyones here or anywhere else. What she experienced, what you witnessed was horrible, awful, and unspeakable, by every stretch of anyones imagination. Your life, her life doesn't have to be a comparison to mine, or anyone's. There is no comparison. For what those people did to any child? I hope there is a moment of forgiveness for their souls - becuase if I wished them a deep dark hole for eternity? I'd be no better than the person that caused the pain. Sounds odd - but it's where I've managed to come full circle in therapy, and I'm okay being there. Trust me it didn't come easy, I don't want any reunions...and that person needs to stay away. However - what you and your little girl went through COST YOU - a life-time. There's no replacement in this world that will repay that. Stop waiting for it. Make your own new future with her. Do you like her? Nope. Why would you ? Look what she's become...a by product of a person who is unspeakably cruel. The best thing you can do at this point? Get into therapy.....get her into therapy.......LEARN how to talk to her, what to SAY to her, HOW TO PARENT her.....HOW TO SAY NO and mean it....HOW TO HAVE EFFECTIVE COMMUNICATION without guilt......and BECOME A DIFFERENT PARENT - that learns all over again - to like her kid. I promise - it's not easy but the kid inside there - the one that you carried? The one that got to know you 9 months before she knew ANYONE else and talked and listed to YOU all that time before knowing anyone else? WILL listen....eventually and that closeness can be there again. LOTS of hard work......but worth it. Even if it takes 2 years to undo every 1 year of abuse.....yup. And get a therapist you all like - a lot. </p><p></p><p>Hope this helps......Here anytime you need me - or any of us. </p><p></p><p>Oh and as far as being crazy? Well - like I said - if ya find yerself trying to push cheese back on yer cracker? Ya just may be in the club cracker brand of cheese pushers. Other than that? I don't think you can parent one of these kids and be sane. And with regards to the kid causing you to loose all your "FRIENDS" - let me tell you something about those "SO CALLED FRIENDS" ------thank the kid for cutting the weak ones from the herd - because a TRUE FRIEND would stick by you no matter WHAT......and I mean that. Nare -do -well friends - run at the first sign on trouble - and if they're going to take off for something as simple as a nine years old child? HEAVEN HELP YOU if you really needed some help like - MOVING, or natural disaster, or -----someone to drive you home from the hospital and "delicate" hemmhoroid surgery - Know what I mean?? I mean they'd blab....so yeah - thank her with a hug and kiss for that.....</p><p></p><p>Remind me sometime to tell you my story about the bubble container and the holy water episode.......you think YOU've got the devils daughter? PFfffffffffffffft. Rock on ----------</p><p>Best of Luck - </p><p>Star</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Star*, post: 543171, member: 4964"] Hi Pippi, Welcome to the board and the family. I'd like to start by saying I usually do not play in the General Forum, I'm mostly in the Water Cooler - because my children are grown and what I think I could offer here seems to be outdated advice because in so many years things have changed, medicines have come along that are different, and I don't have any little ones in school anymore. My "little one" is 21, and expecting a little one any day now. However your story so mimiced our life years ago I wanted to share some hindsight and insight with you as it pertained to our life. Our life? Was hell on earth. We got out, lived to tell about it, and have since moved on. So for as much as you may understand and share that knowledge? The abuses, misguided lessons (the cursing, the swearing, the thought processes, the lighter) any thing like that which Daddy NOT SO WONDERFUL (hence forth DN) taught his Daughter - and it doesn't matter if they had 2 months or 2 years together - she DID learn things at an age when her mind was a varitable sponge. Everything we hear, see, smell, touch - is stored in our minds like digital processing in a computer. We may not remember it - but it's there, for recall. Think about a smell that "takes you back" - digital recall. Think about a color that you see and you may say "Oh my Granny had a couch that exact same color" - digital recal. Well - our children remember behaviors that they got 'praise' for at an early age and it changed the mapping in their minds. Mapping is what makes up our character, our thought processes, or choices, our mannerisms.....who we our and how we react to situations. The things that DN taught your daughter ALTERED her thought processes from normal to NOT SO normal. (Sound Familiar? The not so normal?) yeah - and why is that? Well Some of it - NOT ALL OF IT - but some is genetic, and some is learned behavior. MOST of what your daughter is exhibiting right now? ..... Well hang on to your hat......It's learned. It can be changed, altered, and started to be fixed. BUT it IS damaged. Changing the mapping in her mind? Do-able - but it takes YEARS of work. The work is MOSTLY going to fall to YOU and your husband - because right now? YOU have to admit things like - I am NOT parenting this child correctly. I am NOT reacting correctly to her outrageous behaviors. I am NOT calm and serene and non- reactive when she is trying to get all the attention......and why is that Pepper? Well - Because the instruction manual that should come with all damaged kids? Just doesn't. I mean who would think to write such a thing and pass it out and go - Well - Okay you got married, you had a baby, and the Daddy slick and clean went postal with a newborn, soooooo instead of the Dr. Spock version of How to raise your children - YOU get - Dat dah dahhh Dahhh. The Conduct disorders revised edition 2.0 - HOw to tame your mouth around a smart alek kid when what you'd really like to do is put your fist through a wall and scream like a banshee because you've BEEN a good, understanding parent for the last 12 weeks and nothing's NOTHING has worked? (yeah Barnes and Noble doesn't have that out yet - but I'm sure we could get several parents here to commit to at least a chapter or 2) So how do you cope before your marriage falls apart, or you loose your sanity? And when I say that? I'm not being the least bit funny.....See I had this episode where we were driving down the road and I started laughing at this bumper sticker that said REAL MEN LOVE JESUS....EXCEPT.....IN MY demented state of stress? I thought it said REAL MEN LOVE CHEESES - (WOULD HAVE SWORN TO IT) AND began laughing so hysterically my fiance nearly pulled off the road to slap my face. I scared my son so badly he was on the verge of tears - he was like 15, maybe 16. You ever see people in a sanitarium laughing in a movie? Well - the psychiatrist told me that's the bodies LAST defense to stablize our brains before your cheeses really (vvvvvvrrrrrrrrt) slides off your cracker......and mine was going South fast. So what do you do about that? At that point our family had been in counseling for years......and it was the only thing that kept me sane (THE ONLY THING) because we had tried - out of home placements, medications - like up to that point around 64, and group homes, psychiatric hospitals, residential treatments, foster care.....outpatient....and family therapy. The kid didn't like therapy - but it's what worked the most - and I'm not sure if it worked the best because for him? He was obstinate - and willful - would not participate, but we made him go anyway. it was a pattern, a routine if you will that said - THIS IS WHAT IS NORMAL - and what is going on at home and in your life? IS NOT - but we went as a family , I went as a MOm and he went as a kid - so three times a week/ for nearly 15 years - we went. And a lot of that was to help ME figure out HOW to deal with MYSELF and HIM. I learned an enormous lot about HOW not to be a parent, a MOTHER, a friend, ......a better person - a DOORMAT......how to say NO......and stand up for myself. WHY I made poor choices in my life and how not to repeat them in relationships, jobs, and life. AND of all that - the most important - to be the best example I COULD BE for my son. The back side flip to that? Was at 17? We threw our son out of our home. He went to go live with the man that was more abusive in his life (my x) that anyone could ever have paid anyone to be. It broke my heart....but therapy had taught me to detach. My son lived in parks, was homeless, ate out of dumpsters......had no clothes, was dirty...and never asked me for a dime - once he called and asked for clothes for a job interview in 3 years. When it seemed he got himself straightenend out? We helped him out. When he needs it - truly needs help? We're there. When he tries for himself........and does things for himself and we see improvements on his behalf.....sure. But it's a give and take - and you have to realize that some times you have to do things for them for yourself - but do NOT make a habit out of it, and DO NOT do those things out of GUILT because of the past. GET RID OF THE WORD......SHOULD from your vocabulary - as in "OH when she was little I should have...." nope - it's a killer statement - and our kids while emotionally stunted....are not dumb....so they figure things out in a room like (Snap) and prey on those things. Very clever about the baby talk and the Xray don't you think? Most 9 year olds don't have that cognitive thinking ......so she's not dumb - she's just had her mapping changed to get by on her wits.....and she uses them like a honed blade. CHANGING that for good? Hard to do but not impossible and it WILL get worse before it gets better - but the benefit you have is that if you start NOW.....at NINE.......by the time shes 21/ MOST of what you teach her NOW.......MAY sink in and she'll use those tools......in her 20's. Otherwise - you're flirting with antisocial behaviors, which could possibly lead you to sociopathic or psychopathic tendencies. (this is what I was told) Conduct disorders left unchecked - can progress. I guess that's your gamble. I know my x - he's a psychopath/sociopath bipolar, drug abuser, womanizer, alcoholic - and well - I wanted to genetically give my son the benefit of the doubt. My son too - at age 3 - took ballbats to our hired help - and got "laughs" ----he too at age 2 was taught to curse and call women (his own Mother) FILTHY disgusting names..and got praised for it. Like I said our list goes on and on - and it's horrid, and vile. But I want you to understand something right now......something you said that caught my attention first and made me write you - DO NOT EVER - EVER minimalize the trauma that you and your daughter went through or compare it to anyones here or anywhere else. What she experienced, what you witnessed was horrible, awful, and unspeakable, by every stretch of anyones imagination. Your life, her life doesn't have to be a comparison to mine, or anyone's. There is no comparison. For what those people did to any child? I hope there is a moment of forgiveness for their souls - becuase if I wished them a deep dark hole for eternity? I'd be no better than the person that caused the pain. Sounds odd - but it's where I've managed to come full circle in therapy, and I'm okay being there. Trust me it didn't come easy, I don't want any reunions...and that person needs to stay away. However - what you and your little girl went through COST YOU - a life-time. There's no replacement in this world that will repay that. Stop waiting for it. Make your own new future with her. Do you like her? Nope. Why would you ? Look what she's become...a by product of a person who is unspeakably cruel. The best thing you can do at this point? Get into therapy.....get her into therapy.......LEARN how to talk to her, what to SAY to her, HOW TO PARENT her.....HOW TO SAY NO and mean it....HOW TO HAVE EFFECTIVE COMMUNICATION without guilt......and BECOME A DIFFERENT PARENT - that learns all over again - to like her kid. I promise - it's not easy but the kid inside there - the one that you carried? The one that got to know you 9 months before she knew ANYONE else and talked and listed to YOU all that time before knowing anyone else? WILL listen....eventually and that closeness can be there again. LOTS of hard work......but worth it. Even if it takes 2 years to undo every 1 year of abuse.....yup. And get a therapist you all like - a lot. Hope this helps......Here anytime you need me - or any of us. Oh and as far as being crazy? Well - like I said - if ya find yerself trying to push cheese back on yer cracker? Ya just may be in the club cracker brand of cheese pushers. Other than that? I don't think you can parent one of these kids and be sane. And with regards to the kid causing you to loose all your "FRIENDS" - let me tell you something about those "SO CALLED FRIENDS" ------thank the kid for cutting the weak ones from the herd - because a TRUE FRIEND would stick by you no matter WHAT......and I mean that. Nare -do -well friends - run at the first sign on trouble - and if they're going to take off for something as simple as a nine years old child? HEAVEN HELP YOU if you really needed some help like - MOVING, or natural disaster, or -----someone to drive you home from the hospital and "delicate" hemmhoroid surgery - Know what I mean?? I mean they'd blab....so yeah - thank her with a hug and kiss for that..... Remind me sometime to tell you my story about the bubble container and the holy water episode.......you think YOU've got the devils daughter? PFfffffffffffffft. Rock on ---------- Best of Luck - Star [/QUOTE]
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