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<blockquote data-quote="Copabanana" data-source="post: 753011" data-attributes="member: 18958"><p>My son does not threaten me or anybody else, but he makes suicide threats. I thought they largely had stopped, but no. When he feared I would kick him out (again) a week ago he said he'd hang himself. He said he had already tried it and it doesn't hurt. Later, he said he only meant that if I had finally had my fill of him, and no longer had hope, rejected him totally, and no longer wanted him in my life, that he would want to die.</p><p></p><p>Last year in the same kind of circumstance I had the police bring him to psychiatric emergency and he was admitted, voluntarily. I had told him to leave, he ran into the garage for an electrical cord, and ran to the park with it.</p><p></p><p>My son is almost twice the age of your grandson. But he has a history of trauma too. So do I.</p><p></p><p>I think that people like us, children like your grandson and I, and those who grew up like us, have dark places in them without words. Their emotions when they are triggered, terrify them. They are impossible to mediate or to manage in their intensity. (But there are ways to learn to calm oneself.) Any language that we use when we are triggered (to ourselves or others) can be so violent, so extreme, so cruel, that the consequences are even worse.</p><p></p><p>There was no intent there. Your grandson is not murderous. He is suffering. You don't need me to tell you this.</p><p></p><p>You are not out of your mind. Although you are in a situation where mind alone cannot handle it. Mind is equipped to handle routine, repetitive, orderly events--and to label them, categorize and to respond to them. We are in situations where mind is over its head. Our children's minds can't handle what they experience, either.</p><p></p><p>I know the children are in therapy. I am wondering if they are in therapy with people who have been trained to deal with extreme childhood trauma.</p><p></p><p>You had to do what you did. Your grandson needs a strong boundary. Not that he would necessarily hurt his brother. But he has to know that there are stops. Until he is able to learn to build an internal refuge, instead of turning to violent ideation or action, in response to overwhelm. Until he learns those stops for himself, you will have to be that. And you were.</p><p></p><p>Is there equine-assisted therapy by you? There isn't by me, but I wish there was. Horses, assisted by trained therapists, help children and adults learn to calm and center and settle themselves.</p><p></p><p>Whether or not we can have hope for our adult children, that they will ever change, has been a central axis here on this forum. Some parents need to feel their children are hopeless. It's a coping mechanism. Nobody knows what will come in the future, over which we have no control. We come here needing to disabuse ourselves from the idea that anything<em><strong> that we do or don't do</strong></em> will have any effect.</p><p></p><p>There is lots of hope for Rain. But that hope come's from her.</p><p></p><p>I don't know how closely grandson's meltdown came after her visit, but I wonder if they are connected. You wrote that you thought that Rain being around loving family would have a positive effect on her. I wonder if the opposite happened. If the children were triggered by being around Rain and her boyfriend, were reminded of their parents and their lives before they had you. If so, clearly they can't handle it.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Copabanana, post: 753011, member: 18958"] My son does not threaten me or anybody else, but he makes suicide threats. I thought they largely had stopped, but no. When he feared I would kick him out (again) a week ago he said he'd hang himself. He said he had already tried it and it doesn't hurt. Later, he said he only meant that if I had finally had my fill of him, and no longer had hope, rejected him totally, and no longer wanted him in my life, that he would want to die. Last year in the same kind of circumstance I had the police bring him to psychiatric emergency and he was admitted, voluntarily. I had told him to leave, he ran into the garage for an electrical cord, and ran to the park with it. My son is almost twice the age of your grandson. But he has a history of trauma too. So do I. I think that people like us, children like your grandson and I, and those who grew up like us, have dark places in them without words. Their emotions when they are triggered, terrify them. They are impossible to mediate or to manage in their intensity. (But there are ways to learn to calm oneself.) Any language that we use when we are triggered (to ourselves or others) can be so violent, so extreme, so cruel, that the consequences are even worse. There was no intent there. Your grandson is not murderous. He is suffering. You don't need me to tell you this. You are not out of your mind. Although you are in a situation where mind alone cannot handle it. Mind is equipped to handle routine, repetitive, orderly events--and to label them, categorize and to respond to them. We are in situations where mind is over its head. Our children's minds can't handle what they experience, either. I know the children are in therapy. I am wondering if they are in therapy with people who have been trained to deal with extreme childhood trauma. You had to do what you did. Your grandson needs a strong boundary. Not that he would necessarily hurt his brother. But he has to know that there are stops. Until he is able to learn to build an internal refuge, instead of turning to violent ideation or action, in response to overwhelm. Until he learns those stops for himself, you will have to be that. And you were. Is there equine-assisted therapy by you? There isn't by me, but I wish there was. Horses, assisted by trained therapists, help children and adults learn to calm and center and settle themselves. Whether or not we can have hope for our adult children, that they will ever change, has been a central axis here on this forum. Some parents need to feel their children are hopeless. It's a coping mechanism. Nobody knows what will come in the future, over which we have no control. We come here needing to disabuse ourselves from the idea that anything[I][B] that we do or don't do[/B][/I] will have any effect. There is lots of hope for Rain. But that hope come's from her. I don't know how closely grandson's meltdown came after her visit, but I wonder if they are connected. You wrote that you thought that Rain being around loving family would have a positive effect on her. I wonder if the opposite happened. If the children were triggered by being around Rain and her boyfriend, were reminded of their parents and their lives before they had you. If so, clearly they can't handle it. [/QUOTE]
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