Forums
New posts
Search forums
What's new
New posts
New profile posts
Latest activity
Internet Search
Members
Current visitors
New profile posts
Search profile posts
Log in
Register
What's new
Search
Search
Search titles only
By:
New posts
Search forums
Menu
Log in
Register
Install the app
Install
Forums
General Discussions
Family of Origin
For Cedar or anyone: My dad did it again...
JavaScript is disabled. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding.
You are using an out of date browser. It may not display this or other websites correctly.
You should upgrade or use an
alternative browser
.
Reply to thread
Message
<blockquote data-quote="Scent of Cedar *" data-source="post: 651128" data-attributes="member: 17461"><p>You were raised to feel this way. Even a parent cannot run a victimizer's game without a victim.</p><p></p><p>Some one of the siblings would have taken that victim role. The others would take the other roles and the family dynamic would be acted out that way. Whether the dynamic is healthy or not, that is what happens. That is why some families are loving and accepting and highly ethical.</p><p></p><p>Family roles, good or bad, are intergenerational things, like family identity.</p><p></p><p>The siblings act out as they have been taught to act out. Negative, destructive roles are toxic, and create imbalance.</p><p></p><p>And so, some families fall apart.</p><p></p><p>There is nothing personal about it.</p><p></p><p>I am two years older than my sister. I think that adds a sting to the dysfunction in the family. I think the oldest child (who does tend to feel protective, and who does tend to have authority over and watch over the younger ones) becomes an acceptable target for hostility that cannot be directed toward the parent.</p><p></p><p>?</p><p></p><p>I don't know where else the hostility that fuels all this could be coming from. I do know that it seems bottomless, and that it is a very blatant thing, once you see it for what it is.</p><p></p><p>I acknowledge that I have hostility too. </p><p></p><p>Boy, do I.</p><p></p><p>Mostly, I have regret. I wish it could have been so different for us.</p><p></p><p>***</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>My sister sees her mates through eyes like that, too.</p><p></p><p>I heard her telling someone one time that I was "Minnesota married". That meant I didn't see my marriage the way she and her friends saw theirs. To me, it seems (so far in my life, anyway) that a betrayal of trust is a betrayal of trust. If the marriage cannot be pulled together, then you leave the marriage and <em>then</em> you can do whatever you want to sexually or any other way. For me, the whole relationship thing has to do with trust, I think. I think I do not believe in "love". I believe in warmth and laughter and stability, I think. If someone wants to go away from me, that is fine.</p><p></p><p>If I want to go away from them, that is fine.</p><p></p><p>But I don't like gossip or slimy game playing very much, and tend not to play with those who do. We all have our challenges to overcome. It is difficult enough to try to figure out what decent is without acting like jerks ourselves.</p><p></p><p>And I still do act like a jerk sometimes, of course.</p><p></p><p>But I try to honor a contract.</p><p></p><p>And I try to do the things I say I will do.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Maybe the capacity for real love between siblings in dysfunctional families can only be realized if everyone understands and rejects the roles they were forced to grow into. My sibs and I did alright until my father died. (Alright would look nothing like normal. I just mean that the roles were not questioned. We did not see one another often.) When my father died, my mother told everyone who would listen how bad my father had been, and how he was the source of the dysfunction in the family. </p><p></p><p>So she was forgiven, and was given protection and a period of grace to work her really wicked little nasty games.</p><p></p><p>Turns out the poison was in my mother, all along.</p><p></p><p>And that she prefers it!</p><p></p><p>Ha!! I still cannot understand how that could be satisfying. But, there you have it. </p><p></p><p>People do not change.</p><p></p><p>Really, I think I have not changed, MWM. I just don't want to be the who they insist I must be, to be in relationship with them.</p><p></p><p>Maybe they are the right ones, and I am wrong.</p><p></p><p>I too am finding that the longer I am away from them, the less I miss them, except in the way I always missed having decent family.</p><p></p><p>The key now is that I want it decent, or I don't feel responsible for trying to create decency or love or even, the appearance of family.</p><p></p><p>That is what forgiving ourselves is about.</p><p></p><p>We are never going to change them.</p><p></p><p>You told me that, once.</p><p></p><p>I found it so helpful.</p><p></p><p>My family is toxic.</p><p></p><p>My job (Should I choose to accept it, as they say in Mission:Impossible) is to heal as much of the hurt as I can, and to be aware of and not pass it on as much as I can.</p><p></p><p>We are doing just fine, MWM.</p><p></p><p>Cedar</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Scent of Cedar *, post: 651128, member: 17461"] You were raised to feel this way. Even a parent cannot run a victimizer's game without a victim. Some one of the siblings would have taken that victim role. The others would take the other roles and the family dynamic would be acted out that way. Whether the dynamic is healthy or not, that is what happens. That is why some families are loving and accepting and highly ethical. Family roles, good or bad, are intergenerational things, like family identity. The siblings act out as they have been taught to act out. Negative, destructive roles are toxic, and create imbalance. And so, some families fall apart. There is nothing personal about it. I am two years older than my sister. I think that adds a sting to the dysfunction in the family. I think the oldest child (who does tend to feel protective, and who does tend to have authority over and watch over the younger ones) becomes an acceptable target for hostility that cannot be directed toward the parent. ? I don't know where else the hostility that fuels all this could be coming from. I do know that it seems bottomless, and that it is a very blatant thing, once you see it for what it is. I acknowledge that I have hostility too. Boy, do I. Mostly, I have regret. I wish it could have been so different for us. *** My sister sees her mates through eyes like that, too. I heard her telling someone one time that I was "Minnesota married". That meant I didn't see my marriage the way she and her friends saw theirs. To me, it seems (so far in my life, anyway) that a betrayal of trust is a betrayal of trust. If the marriage cannot be pulled together, then you leave the marriage and [I]then[/I] you can do whatever you want to sexually or any other way. For me, the whole relationship thing has to do with trust, I think. I think I do not believe in "love". I believe in warmth and laughter and stability, I think. If someone wants to go away from me, that is fine. If I want to go away from them, that is fine. But I don't like gossip or slimy game playing very much, and tend not to play with those who do. We all have our challenges to overcome. It is difficult enough to try to figure out what decent is without acting like jerks ourselves. And I still do act like a jerk sometimes, of course. But I try to honor a contract. And I try to do the things I say I will do. Maybe the capacity for real love between siblings in dysfunctional families can only be realized if everyone understands and rejects the roles they were forced to grow into. My sibs and I did alright until my father died. (Alright would look nothing like normal. I just mean that the roles were not questioned. We did not see one another often.) When my father died, my mother told everyone who would listen how bad my father had been, and how he was the source of the dysfunction in the family. So she was forgiven, and was given protection and a period of grace to work her really wicked little nasty games. Turns out the poison was in my mother, all along. And that she prefers it! Ha!! I still cannot understand how that could be satisfying. But, there you have it. People do not change. Really, I think I have not changed, MWM. I just don't want to be the who they insist I must be, to be in relationship with them. Maybe they are the right ones, and I am wrong. I too am finding that the longer I am away from them, the less I miss them, except in the way I always missed having decent family. The key now is that I want it decent, or I don't feel responsible for trying to create decency or love or even, the appearance of family. That is what forgiving ourselves is about. We are never going to change them. You told me that, once. I found it so helpful. My family is toxic. My job (Should I choose to accept it, as they say in Mission:Impossible) is to heal as much of the hurt as I can, and to be aware of and not pass it on as much as I can. We are doing just fine, MWM. Cedar [/QUOTE]
Insert quotes…
Verification
Post reply
Forums
General Discussions
Family of Origin
For Cedar or anyone: My dad did it again...
Top