This is tough!

[sooooo tired]

Why do I go for a few days not feeling down or thinking about my daughter, then those guilty thoughts come crashing into my head? I know Im doing the right thing but I get so confused!! I just cant believe that she can actually believe that the things she says to me are true....I mean she really doesnt think she has treated me badly! I havent talked to her for a month now...It just gets me so worked up thinking she really doesnt realize just how many times I have been there for her. And I really hurt seeing the nasty environment my sweet grandson has to live in! I took him to buy him new sandals on saturday, he was riding on the cart and all of a sudden he says mama I really love being with you!!! Ripped my heart out! Sometimes I think I should rescue him from it all, then I think....do I really have the strength or the money to raise another child!!

 

[InsaneCdn]

Sometimes I think I should rescue him from it all, then I think....do I really have the strength or the money to raise another child!!

You might need to rescue him in a different way. Maybe he does need to be out of there... but still have you in his life as a grandma. I have known foster families who took on that kind of kid and actually preferred to take on ones where the (few remaining sane) members of the extended family were prepared to stay involved in appropriate roles. It provided built-in respite for the foster family, and a strong sense of belonging for the kid. I don't know your system (I'm not in the USA), but here at least, the system is VERY open especially to grandparents staying involved.

 

[BusynMember]

Well, your daughter would have to lose custody first, something that most likely won't happen. She isn't abusing him. Her crummy lifestyle is not enough for her to lose her child. Right now you have no grounds for getting custody. The bar is high for a biological parent to get her rights removed from her child.

I'm sorry you are dealing with this. Sometimes our realities differ even though we lived the same experiences. You can't change what your daughter thinks.

Perhaps the best thing for you is to go into intensive therapy and try to figure it out and also figure out how to cope and what to do. It seems hard and lonely doing it alone. I know I never could have dealt with my kids, when they were at their worst, all by myself. It is courageous to reach out for help and to let others in. A therapist is one example. Al-Anon or Narc-Anon is another. I did both for Princess. When YOU are the one suffering, YOU are the one who needs the help and it is also a good example for your daughter, whether she chooses to copy it or not, to show that there is nothing wrong by going for psychiatric help.

Wishing things were different won't help you, your grandson, or anybody. You will only get sick and your own life will slip away from you. Don't let your own life be determined by your daughter's.

Hugs and take care of yourself.

 

[Tanya M]

I just cant believe that she can actually believe that the things she says to me are true....I mean she really doesnt think she has treated me badly!

Have you ever heard the term "gaslighting" ?
Gaslighting or gas-lighting is a form of mental abuse in which information is twisted or spun, selectively omitted to favor the abuser, or false information is presented with the intent of making victims doubt their own memory, perception, and sanity.[1][2] Instances may range simply from the denial by an abuser that previous abusive incidents ever occurred, up to the staging of bizarre events by the abuser with the intention of disorienting the victim.

It is not uncommon for a Difficult Child to act in this way. Sometimes on purpose and sometimes they are not aware they are doing it. They live in their own reality.

You will have good days and bad days, it's a process and you really are doing great.

((HUGS)) to you!!

 

[sooooo tired]

Have you ever heard the term "gaslighting" ?
Gaslighting or gas-lighting is a form of mental abuse in which information is twisted or spun, selectively omitted to favor the abuser, or false information is presented with the intent of making victims doubt their own memory, perception, and sanity.[1][2] Instances may range simply from the denial by an abuser that previous abusive incidents ever occurred, up to the staging of bizarre events by the abuser with the intention of disorienting the victim.

It is not uncommon for a Difficult Child to act in this way. Sometimes on purpose and sometimes they are not aware they are doing it. They live in their own reality.

You will have good days and bad days, it's a process and you really are doing great.

((HUGS)) to you!!

Ok this fits my daughter to a tee! And all of the research I have done she fits the mold of either Borderline (BPD) or Anti Social disorder. My question is how do these disorders start? Are they born with them, or does something that happens in their lives trigger it. Did I not do something right? And if it is a disorder and they cant help it how do you keep from feeling guilty? I guess It just depresses me to think that she will be like this forever!! She is so far out of the loop as far as not working, staying home all the time with no car, to the point where she has panic attacks when she goes out. I dont even know where she would even start even if she did try. Im not saying I am ever going to take her verbal abuse anymore, I just slip into the fantasy of one day she just has to turn her life around!!

 

[BusynMember]

Nobody knows what starts it. Antisocial personality disorders tend to have brain differences. Borderline's origin is not really understood yet. Could be hereditary. You did say your ex husband is like her.

Just because they have these disorders doesn't mean they don't know what they are doing or that they can't get help to change. Many just don't WANT to change as they are happy as they are and prefer to blame everybody else. Now to change their very brain wiring takes extremely hard work and time and I would not expect your daughter to change any time soon, if ever, because she probably won't want to.

I have a question.

With your other kids and grands doing well and having so many friends, why do you just seem to dwell on this one daughter? Not saying she's not important to you, but don't you think it would be healthier for all if you just paid more attention to the other loved ones in your life and let her be as she is? Interacting with her and wishing s he were different will not change her one bit. But if you concentrated more on your blessings, you would be happier and healthier. Let your daughter figure out her own life. She is old enough. Don't take all her calls or read all her texts. She is playing head games with you. I'll bet you obsess over her the most because your other loved ones don't bother you as often and don't make you doubt yourself. Why pay so much attention to this one? Only she can change herself.

We adopted a boy at age six from another country. He is the only child I raised who fatally, in his eyes, clashed with me, when he met his wife mostly, and I haven't seen him for nine years or so nor met his kids. I went to therapy and decided to focus on my blessings, which are my husband and other kids and now their kids. I can't say you'd get the same result, but I was able to let go of that son, move on and live a very happy, peaceful life and do not need him in my life. I know he is well and thriving and that is enough. I don't want to hold him or bother him and I don't want him to try to pelt me with his religious views, which I don't share. Sometimes we HAVE to let go and we can find we still have happiness.


My life got better and better after I married my husband twenty years ago and I am very close to my other kids. I would never take time away from them to brood about the one who left. It would not be fair to them or to me. In your case, I think it is worse because she is around you, but abusive. Nobody has a right to abuse you, not even your child.

I know how you feel about that perfect family because you didn't have one. Trust me, NEITHER DID I! And I wanted a perfect family and now that I have married this man I do have practically a perfect life, even if this one adult child is not in it. Before he left he was causing rifts with my other children too and that was upsetting too. I had such a chaotic early life that I want peace and lack of drama in my life above all else, except for love. If somebody I love doesn't love me back, I would rather they leave. It is less painful in the end, in my opinion. My entire FOO was one big Drama Queen story. Was yours? Don't you want peace?

I hope you can find answers that suit you and make you happy. You raised your kids and now they are adults and their behavior is on their shoulders. You taught them right from wrong and they know right from wrong. It is up to them whether or not they decide to use that knowledge or discard it and become mean or criminals. We have no control over how they use what we have taught them. The "why" your daughter is like she is really doesn't matter. She's mean. It is her decision to be mean, even if she has a personality disorder. She is not psychotic.

I suggest you get into counseling yourself. I think you will end up feeling a lot happier with yourself and the guilt will be explored and you will have a better understanding of it...it may go away entirely. But you do need help in my opinion. Get it for yourself...because you are important and you matter and don't ruminate over your daughter, if you can stop yourself. You have others who would enjoy your attention and would treat you with the love and respect you deserve.

Obviously, we are two different people and I respect it if you are not with me on this, but I only want peaceful, calm and reasonable people in my life. I am done with drama, chaos and craziness. I don't care who is causing the craziness...I don't want it. Think about what YOU want, in a realistic way, and try hard to be good to yourself. You are as important as everybody else in this world.

 

[SeekingStrength]

Hi Tired,

I sure wish I had answers for you. My Difficult Child is almost certainly dealing with anti social behavior disorder, long history of gas lighting and delusional vilifying of his dad and me. His dad and I have no answers, although we have speculated a lot.

We see this often on this forum, but it.is.what.it.is and you cannot change it for your daughter anymore than husband and I can change it for our son.

After more time on this forum, you will see (and probably are already beginning to realize), it really does not matter from whence this came. Our Difficult Child's blaming us helps nothing. They have to decide to change the dynamics. We have absolutely no power or clout in their direction. If we could, we would---a million times over!

Keep posting and continue to vent. It can help so much; it has made a world of difference for husband and me. We still have our moments, but are way ahead of where we were two years ago.

I am so sorry you have this to deal with and feel for you.

SS

 

[AppleCori]

SoT-

I have to agree with SWOT and others--you may need to let go of your desire to have a relationship (let alone a good relationship) with your daughter.

She is around 40 years old. The chances of her changing are slim. Don't hold your breath.

We all wish we could figure out the 'why' of the way they behave. But there are no answers. We can only speculate. And we cant change them no matter how much we want to.

Put your time and effort where it makes a difference. You have two adult children and several grandchildren who appreciate you and love you. Focus your attention on them.

I feel bad for your grandchildren by this daughter. However, many people grow up in difficult circumstances and make a good life for themselves anyway. They can, too.