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Trying to ignore a gnawing panic in my belly...
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<blockquote data-quote="Marguerite" data-source="post: 95869" data-attributes="member: 1991"><p>I know I may have sounded soft re Monkeyboy, because I let my daughters bring their live-in BFs home, but THEY respect me. I have had to ban certain friends of my kids from our home, although I lifted the ban a few years later when they lifted their game. The kids and the live in BFs help out as well, doing chores (even the BFs). So if you can make Monkeyboy get involved and follow your house rules, then maybe let him stay. But this is YOUR decision, not difficult child's. It's YOUR home, it's only hers until she's an adult. And in Australia, 18 is an adult. After that they're on sufferance. And it always should be about YOUR rules, "my way or the highway". You can always be nice about it (as a flatmate would), as long as she doesn't take advantage of you, which I think she is doing at the moment. H not being on the same page doesn't help, it's sending her mixed messages. Ask him how he would feel being asked to raise a grandchild, now, perhaps one with Fetal Alcohol Syndrome (FAS) or drug dependency? Because if H doesn't get with the program, that could be your fate. Or is H someone who doesn't also pull his weight around the home? You may need to have a family meeting to lay some new rules. Talk with H privately first, see what you can both agree to, then as a team work with difficult child. And whatever rules you make, you both must enforce them.</p><p></p><p>A lot of what MWM and Star have said also is about teaching her to be independent. Star is right - how can difficult child live with others, if she can't even behave with you?</p><p></p><p>As our kids reached "that difficult age" we moved from a parental position to one of 'flatmate with name on the lease'. They have to pitch in with cooking, washing up, sorting the laundry, playing chauffeur, helping with shopping. So do we - we don't let them think they are slave labour, this is a collective. The boys also work in the garden weeding. Sometimes I put on an incentive - I pay a bit extra to difficult child 3's pocket money, or I buy the older boys a beer or cider for hard work and mowing lawns. When doing these chores we try to work as a team, one family pitching in together.</p><p></p><p>Our kids have been raised to tell us where they are going and when they will be back AND TO STICK TO IT unless they call. This isn't a control thing, it's common courtesy. When you are sharing a flat you must do the same thing, purely so meals etc can be organised. "I'm going to Jack's place, not sure when I'll be back so I'll get my own dinner. But I plan on being back by 11pm, because I'm working tomorrow."</p><p></p><p>I don't know what it's like in the US, but in Australia if we're going camping overnight we are expected to let people know when we're leaving and when we get back. We're also supposed to check in when we get back. Again, a courtesy thing. If a fire breaks out then people know there's someone to be rescued; or if we're back early, they know to not worry.</p><p></p><p>Airline pilots are expected to file flight plans. This isn't to exert control over them, or to limit their fun - it's to keep EVERYONE safe and for everyone in the air to work as a team. It's simply sound practice.</p><p></p><p>I left home when I was 17, to go to uni. I knew how to cook, to sew, to use a washing machine, but I had been so sheltered I didn't know how to keep myself safe or how to live with people. I was ripped off a few times, nearly raped a few times, homeless a few times, sick a lot of the time. But I learnt fast. I also learned that when you live with someone who isn't family, they will put up with a lot less than family would. They also don't have their own standards of behaviour as high as your parents'. Other flatmates can be just as difficult child and when you get angry, there's not much you can do about it but live with it. At one stage I was sharing a house with four blokes (each with own room) and found myself expected to clean up after them. I had to find my own way to deal with that; I couldn't run home to mummy, my parents were hundreds of miles away. I learnt a lot about people then, not all of it good.</p><p></p><p>But I had begun with certain skills and manners, I was a easy child. How, then, can a difficult child cope, unless we help them learn?</p><p></p><p>Our kids now - being difficult child, they are taking longer to learn. But learn they must. They are made to do their own tax returns, although husband will site beside them to help. difficult child 1 & easy child 2/difficult child 2 now have their own health insurance and now much pay for their own medications - husband has taught them how to do Internet banking and I am teaching them how to process their health care claims. They still have a way to go, we still need to gently nag and support a lot (I nag by saying, "Do it now, while I am here to help you"). But they are getting there. We get fewer panics.</p><p></p><p>When difficult child 1 had left school and had to enrol in a weekend college course, I knew he'd never manage alone. SO I rounded up his difficult child Aspie mate who had never finished school and bullied him into enrolling as well. Both on pensions, so for both the fees were zero.</p><p>But I had to literally hold their hands and talk them both through every little step. I was parenting both, steering them to the next room which needed more pieces of paper filled in, etc. If I hadn't been there, they would have walked out. But if I had done it all for them, they would have walked out of the course, not feeling they had any emotional investment in it. But after sweating about it and getting anxious about enrolling, they finally felt some ownership of the course and a strong desire to do well. They ended up competing with each other to see who could get the best marks!</p><p></p><p>They both gained a lot of skills by doing this course; not all the skills course-related. difficult child 1 had to travel there by train and it was in the centre of Sydney CBD, a confusing and scary place. Slowly he learned his way around, walking with his friend before and after class to shops nearby that they liked. Together they felt confident.</p><p></p><p>Now difficult child 1 is semi-independent. His friend, even more so. Both can only do a lot of their stuff because their respective GFs help them (co-dependence in the extreme) but it all builds to capability and independence. Each success is a bonus and they build.</p><p></p><p>The best gift you can give your children is to raise them to be happy, independent and functioning members of society. Simply aiming to be happy, no matter what you do to other people, and forgetting about being productive or useful - that's Paris Hilton. And you can only do that if you have bucketloads of money.</p><p></p><p>Not easy, but vitally important.</p><p></p><p>Good luck. Steel-capped boots time.</p><p></p><p>Marg</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Marguerite, post: 95869, member: 1991"] I know I may have sounded soft re Monkeyboy, because I let my daughters bring their live-in BFs home, but THEY respect me. I have had to ban certain friends of my kids from our home, although I lifted the ban a few years later when they lifted their game. The kids and the live in BFs help out as well, doing chores (even the BFs). So if you can make Monkeyboy get involved and follow your house rules, then maybe let him stay. But this is YOUR decision, not difficult child's. It's YOUR home, it's only hers until she's an adult. And in Australia, 18 is an adult. After that they're on sufferance. And it always should be about YOUR rules, "my way or the highway". You can always be nice about it (as a flatmate would), as long as she doesn't take advantage of you, which I think she is doing at the moment. H not being on the same page doesn't help, it's sending her mixed messages. Ask him how he would feel being asked to raise a grandchild, now, perhaps one with Fetal Alcohol Syndrome (FAS) or drug dependency? Because if H doesn't get with the program, that could be your fate. Or is H someone who doesn't also pull his weight around the home? You may need to have a family meeting to lay some new rules. Talk with H privately first, see what you can both agree to, then as a team work with difficult child. And whatever rules you make, you both must enforce them. A lot of what MWM and Star have said also is about teaching her to be independent. Star is right - how can difficult child live with others, if she can't even behave with you? As our kids reached "that difficult age" we moved from a parental position to one of 'flatmate with name on the lease'. They have to pitch in with cooking, washing up, sorting the laundry, playing chauffeur, helping with shopping. So do we - we don't let them think they are slave labour, this is a collective. The boys also work in the garden weeding. Sometimes I put on an incentive - I pay a bit extra to difficult child 3's pocket money, or I buy the older boys a beer or cider for hard work and mowing lawns. When doing these chores we try to work as a team, one family pitching in together. Our kids have been raised to tell us where they are going and when they will be back AND TO STICK TO IT unless they call. This isn't a control thing, it's common courtesy. When you are sharing a flat you must do the same thing, purely so meals etc can be organised. "I'm going to Jack's place, not sure when I'll be back so I'll get my own dinner. But I plan on being back by 11pm, because I'm working tomorrow." I don't know what it's like in the US, but in Australia if we're going camping overnight we are expected to let people know when we're leaving and when we get back. We're also supposed to check in when we get back. Again, a courtesy thing. If a fire breaks out then people know there's someone to be rescued; or if we're back early, they know to not worry. Airline pilots are expected to file flight plans. This isn't to exert control over them, or to limit their fun - it's to keep EVERYONE safe and for everyone in the air to work as a team. It's simply sound practice. I left home when I was 17, to go to uni. I knew how to cook, to sew, to use a washing machine, but I had been so sheltered I didn't know how to keep myself safe or how to live with people. I was ripped off a few times, nearly raped a few times, homeless a few times, sick a lot of the time. But I learnt fast. I also learned that when you live with someone who isn't family, they will put up with a lot less than family would. They also don't have their own standards of behaviour as high as your parents'. Other flatmates can be just as difficult child and when you get angry, there's not much you can do about it but live with it. At one stage I was sharing a house with four blokes (each with own room) and found myself expected to clean up after them. I had to find my own way to deal with that; I couldn't run home to mummy, my parents were hundreds of miles away. I learnt a lot about people then, not all of it good. But I had begun with certain skills and manners, I was a easy child. How, then, can a difficult child cope, unless we help them learn? Our kids now - being difficult child, they are taking longer to learn. But learn they must. They are made to do their own tax returns, although husband will site beside them to help. difficult child 1 & easy child 2/difficult child 2 now have their own health insurance and now much pay for their own medications - husband has taught them how to do Internet banking and I am teaching them how to process their health care claims. They still have a way to go, we still need to gently nag and support a lot (I nag by saying, "Do it now, while I am here to help you"). But they are getting there. We get fewer panics. When difficult child 1 had left school and had to enrol in a weekend college course, I knew he'd never manage alone. SO I rounded up his difficult child Aspie mate who had never finished school and bullied him into enrolling as well. Both on pensions, so for both the fees were zero. But I had to literally hold their hands and talk them both through every little step. I was parenting both, steering them to the next room which needed more pieces of paper filled in, etc. If I hadn't been there, they would have walked out. But if I had done it all for them, they would have walked out of the course, not feeling they had any emotional investment in it. But after sweating about it and getting anxious about enrolling, they finally felt some ownership of the course and a strong desire to do well. They ended up competing with each other to see who could get the best marks! They both gained a lot of skills by doing this course; not all the skills course-related. difficult child 1 had to travel there by train and it was in the centre of Sydney CBD, a confusing and scary place. Slowly he learned his way around, walking with his friend before and after class to shops nearby that they liked. Together they felt confident. Now difficult child 1 is semi-independent. His friend, even more so. Both can only do a lot of their stuff because their respective GFs help them (co-dependence in the extreme) but it all builds to capability and independence. Each success is a bonus and they build. The best gift you can give your children is to raise them to be happy, independent and functioning members of society. Simply aiming to be happy, no matter what you do to other people, and forgetting about being productive or useful - that's Paris Hilton. And you can only do that if you have bucketloads of money. Not easy, but vitally important. Good luck. Steel-capped boots time. Marg [/QUOTE]
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