How do I get husband to agree?

[VickiL]

I didn't know where else to turn to get this off of my chest so here goes...

A lot of things are bothering me and they will not go away. First, oldest son is not speaking to me due to the fact that husband will not allow him on our property because of the threat when he moved to CA and was panicking at being in a new environment, to "burn our house down". Not a smart move on his part, but in hindsight I blew it out of proportion to the point where I was seriously thinking of getting a restraining order. Even have the papers in my kitchen drawer still. BUT, the combo of son freaking out and me being perimenopausal is not a pretty sight. I know in my heart he was just acting out and I took it way too far. But I guess part of me was tired of his ranting and raving at me from 2000 miles away and I told husband about it. Dumb, dumb, dumb as husband cannot fathom how I can now forgive him for it and he WILL not let him near our home until he proves he is getting help for his anger. This is all well and good and should probably happen for son's benefit anyway, BUT he and his girlfriend are not letting me see Kyla because of it. I miss my grandbaby like crazy, but he refuses to have anything to do with me and since she is his daughter, he is keeping her away from me to hurt me.

Well, I have about had it with both husband and with J. I know he would never hurt me or husband or our house, but husband can hold a grudge for years and I just see it turning into me not being around Kyla anymore.

AND - first thing this morning I get a call from my youngest son's dad telling me that he had to go get him at school and that he took a "bunch of pills" and has to get drug tested and may get thrown in jail. OMG!!!! This is my baby who is the love of my life right now. He does not want to live with his dad any longer because dad has a new girlfriend (ex-druggie) and is never home so A is home all of the time by himself and does not like it. I asked him what he took (Seroquel) and how many (2) and WHY (because he had a headache and he was upset that he couldn't move up here). Well, now I am fit to be tied. I really want him to move home because now I really miss him, but we told him that he had to stay down there and graduate because that is the deal we made. He had bugged me, cried, threw fits to move down with his dad and I finally relented last year with the stipulation that he stay down there until he graduates (he's a junior this year) and that there would be no bouncing back and forth between my house and his dad's house. And he has made progress in school down there by leaps and bounds. But he promises me that if we let him move back home with us he will try in school (claims he wasn't trying at all before) and do anything we ask of him. He now has a girlfriend where we live and I know he would do good just to be able to be with her.

I know I am just rambling, sorry. What this all boils down to is husband has to have things "his way or the highway". I hate that about him, but it's not like I didn't know that. I mean, I've known and loved this man for almost 30 years. However, there is no comprise when it comes to J and I don't think he is going to change his mind about A moving back either. My problem is that we have no family close and we have NO friends that we do things with here. So, it's just me and him right now and I miss my kids and granddaughter. He has never had children and doesn't understand the feelings I am having. I even told him the other night that I wished he had had at least one kid so he would know the parental love I feel for my boys. He agreed and I about fell off of the couch. However, it did nothing to change his mind about J or letting him come over to bring the baby and drop off some things they need stored until they get their apartment in a couple of weeks.

I just feel alienated, lonely and miserable and it hurts to know that I don't think that is going to matter to him. I want A to move back with us and finish school, period. He has no supervision down there right now and that's not what he wants or needs. He misses having a "family" around. His dad and his ex-girlfriend split up and now there is this new girlfriend right away. He's miserable down there and I'm miserable having him down there. I thought I would like the "empty nest" thing and 90% of the time I do, but I am getting really, really sick of it being just husband and I and NO ONE else.

So, how do I put my foot down without causing WWIII and let it be known that I want A to move back home?

If you have made it this far in my rant, I thank you. I just needed to get it down in black and white and try and make sense of some of it.

Thanks!!!

 

[Suz]

Vicki, I can't weigh in on son#2 but let's talk a moment about son#1.

I think you might be suffering from "halo effect." What I mean is that you are not remembering how it really was...and I do...and I expect other members do, too.

I remember how frightened and angry you were. It might have been exascerbated by perimenopause but your fear and rage were genuine and his behaviors were inexcusable. Now time has passed, you miss your grandchild and you are now willing to downplay the past in order to see Kyla.

I agree with your husband, Vicki. I know you won't like to read this.

he WILL not let him near our home until he proves he is getting help for his anger.

This seems completely reasonable to me.

Please don't let your desire to see Kyla- and your admitted loneliness- minimize the severity of your son's actions. He's 21 and should be busting his backside to try to prove to you what a great son and father he is.

So let's talk about how lonely you are and what you can do to try to redirect. Interests? Hobbies? Books?

Hugs,
Suz

 

[Star*]

You know - Your rant was pretty cookie cutter. There are a lot of us here who could just take out GFGI and burning the house threat, and difficult child 2 and the moving away threat. Then throw in being lonely and you'd have a number of us here.

(self included)

I love my DF. The man has been through hell on earth with me and my son - my son, is his son. Not by blood, but by love, patience, and the annoying ability to step in and tell me NO regarding my son. I like to be right SOMETIME, but with my son? Alas - exhale.....it seems I think with my heart, forgive too easily, and then I sit around wondering WHY everyone else is so put off when I say "Let's do this with Dude, or that."

I too suffer from terminal flip-flop halo disease. Outta sight, outta mind, absence makes my heart grow fonder, and I only had a grand puppy and cried about not seeing her. I can't imagine what fresh hell it is to not see your grand child. BUT in that same thought it did occur to me

a.) your husband has a RIGHT to protect you - because he does love you, protect himself and protect his house. IRREGARDLESS of how you feel now - and what you "feel" YOU WERE beside yourself and with good right at that time. Ask yourself this - If a neighbor kid had done the same thing would you be able or WANT to forgive him?

b.) your husband won't allow your son to come to the house with your granddaughter. BUT - that doesn't stop YOUR SON from calling you, meeting in the park, McDonalds, going places with his wife.....and what you are NOT seeing in that is YOUR SON is STILL hurting you. And .....he knows it. If he was trying to get help for his anger- and did figure out "Hey you can't make idol threats about burning a home down." - he could STILL allow you to see the baby - just not at your home. He would make it work. He's using his daughter to "get" at you. And he's using your hurt as a weapon against his dad or step dad. So what you don't read between the lines here - Your son is still manipulating - other wise he'd call you and say "You know mom, I'm still good and angry about what went on - but I don't want your granddaughter to miss out on knowing you." - THAT could happen EVEN IF your husband said NO to the come near the house thing.....but your son still .......(Halo? - not so much)

c.) As far as your difficult child 2 - It's always ANYWHERE BUT HERE with these kids. OMG for as many times as Dude went away and then came back and went away and came back with bigger more grandiose promises of how he'd behave IF he could just....(fill in the blank). And he would tell me about the dangers......told me so much when he really WAS in danger I allowed him to stay and ignored his CRY wolf. (group home we had shut down) and instead of seeing THAT as WOW I really cried wolf - HE to this day will make snide comments about how we LEFT him there in Nastytown. Um - whatever.....I do get that you feel he is in danger -but what danger? Again same cookie - DF told me that he will MOVE OUT if Dude ever shows up, gets thrown out or comes knocking on the door. I know we can not live together - and sadly I would join the ranks that say "Here's the # to the Salvation ARmy shelter." and probably never see or hear from him again. I love my son - I do not love the chaos.

So before you go making plans to bring difficult child back - remember a few things about difficult child's -
he says he'll do anything and that will WILL WILL wear off
he won't be spending time with YOU - he'll be with that girl or off with friends....he's a Jr. in HS. He's not going to hang with you and he won't be your pal. I thought this last time with Dude we could at LEAST be buddies once a week - we used to love to shop and go have lunch even if it was McD's in the car. And now? I'm good for 2 things - bailing him out with my knowledge and cash.....and computer time.

Sad reality - this year - Mother's Day wasn't even on the map with him and that was AFTER I paid over $800 in fines to keep him out of jail from charge #1. And put up our house and land - for bond for charge #2. Yeap, yalp, yalp - there's my reality - no Mother's Day and he asked me how to fix a spider bite on my birthday and then mumbled in a depressed voice - happy birthday. I still made him a cake, got a card, presents.....and now because I won't let yet another of his DOGs come live at my house - I'm back on the poopie list.

I had hoped for a little better than the poopie list and to be told that I START everything and make him miserable.

Think long and hard about this - right now? YOU HAVE the ability and freedom to GO and Do - You can /could join something to get you out once a week to have something to look forward to. Suggest a date night with DF. Take him bowling - take him to a bar......I have no good ideas but we could all help you with ideas if you want.

DF told me about Dude that if I keep bailing him out when he does something and then changes his mind - I'm not helping him to grow up. And as angry as it makes me - to say - he is right.

Call your x - the 2 pills? i think are an attention seeking behavior. It certainly got your x's attention didn't it? THe night Dude swallowed an entire bottle of tylenol while we were waiting for the police after he was the lookout for the home robberies? I looked at him, watched him down the bottle - and said very calmly - "I'll tell your Dad to ask the cop to call an ambulance." and just walked out. Later Dude mentioned that I was so calm while he was trying to kill himself - and I said "Life goes on." You want to take your life today - there is nothign I can do - it is your life. I'll miss you, but I won't stop breathing - or something like that and to this day he hasn't tried anything dumb like that again - that or running away. Because we just didn't LOOK for him - we let the police look for him - it made him angry. I thought - huh - look at that .

REally think about this hon - it's tough and it hurts and I know you miss K, but............Dude ain't no angel either. Currently he's Pimping puppies. - ack!

Hugs
Star

 

[meowbunny]

Another vote for your husband. #1 son is a jerk and that's being kind. He's using a baby as a hostage to get even with someone. He can't have his way so you're punished? He threatened and someone says he needs anger management and he takes your grandbaby away? Sorry, this is a jerk to the highest order.l

As to #2, he's doing good at school now with NO supervision? Does this sound possible or logical? He's manipulating. Sounds more like he wants to come home because he is being supervised and thinks he can get away with more stuff at your home than his father's.

Go out. Find a way to connect with some of the people in your area. Take a class. Join a gym. Find something that is not child-connected. Something you've always wanted to do and never had the time. That's what an empty nest is all about. A chance to find YOU again.

As you said, you're lonely. Sometimes loneliness leads to dumb decisions. Add perimenopause on top of it and you have dumb decisions and blaming the world. been there done that. I'm sorry you're going through this. It ain't fun.

 

[Hound dog]

Vicki is there any way you and girlfriend and the baby could get together for lunch? Might curb those grandmotherly pangs and help uncloud your thinking.

I know husband's can be unreasonable. I live with one. But this time I tend to agree with your husband. I know you love and miss your kids and grandaughter, but I think your lonilness is messing with your judgement. husband is able to look from outside in, and sounds like he's not seeing changes enough to warrant a change in the statis quo.

Every once in a great while my husband is right. And on those rare occasions I look outside to check for a blue moon. (happens about that often lol)

((hugs))

 

[hearts and roses]

Oh {{{Vicki}}}, Ditto what everyone said. I struggle with my own difficult child's 'business' - she always wants to be where it's 'easiest', whether its with me or her dad (exh). It's manipulation at it's best. You have to bite down hard and ignore it. He will surive that time with hid dad and graduate.

difficult child #1 - A threat is a threat. Whether or not you know in your heart of hearts he won't follow through on it is fine, but even so, he has to KNOW that it's not okay to throw those threats out there - just because he's angry. It's not okay. This is something we've been trying to teach our own difficult child. She throws out threats that we know mean nothing in reality, but it's the point of it. She can't say whatever she wants and make threats just because things aren't going her way - Know what I mean??

Sending hugs and support. I like Lisa's idea of seeing grandbaby - get your fill of lovin'.

 

[VickiL]

Thank you all for being here for me! Yes, husband is right. And all of you are right and I still know it - a threat is a threat and it DID scare the bejezeers out of me. After I wrote my rant J called and just verified what I know to be true...he is just a jerk. He is a 21 year old acting like a two year old, just because we haven't welcomed him back with open arms. And yes, he is using the baby as a weapon, but now that I have come to my senses once again, I am okay with how things are. It is up to him to prove to me and to husband that he is doing something about his anger. That and he is an ADULT and needs to start acting like one. I know he knows he is in the wrong and instead of apologizing to me, the hurt little boy comes out and acts like a jerk. Oh well, K is too little to know what's going on and while I may miss her, I do not want to be in on all the drama with her mom and dad. His girlfriend just goes along with whatever J tells her. I still love my granddaughter and that won't ever change. I do know that she is being taken care of and while I may not get along with her mom or dad, they are very, very good parents to her.

For my youngest, well, he is not manipulating me. If anything, he is being more than honest. The child cannot lie to me to save his life. He is very unhappy down at his dad's and has been since his dad and long-time girlfriend broke up. Now he is shacked up with a woman who is a past meth-head who is still on probation for a very, very heavy drug charge. I talked to A tonight and he does not want to live in the town where he is at any longer. It is in the biggest meth county in the state, if not in the country. He actually wants to be with husband and I because he has way more supervision, structure and rules here and he likes that. I know that sounds strange, but he is my one child who always has liked structure and superivision. I know that he will be fine if we decide that he needs to stay down there, but I have to weigh all of the facts like who he is now living with and what goes along with that. His dad was with his ex-girlfriend for 8 years and she used to babysit my kids, so I knew her very well. Now there is an ex-druggie living there and I don't know if I like that or not. I cannot tell my ex who to date or live with, but I don't have to have my kid live with her. I did tell A that husband and I would have to talk about it and would let him know when we did.

And as far as being lonely, I am just having a bad day. Well, a bad week actually. I get very emotional this time of year. My dad passed away 15 years ago on Aug. 27 and his birthday was Aug. 19. I know better than to try and deal with major life changes during this week. It doesn't matter that it's been 15 years...it seems like yesterday to me. I miss him so much still to this day.

My life really is very good. I have a job I love and I do have friends here. We just all have our own lives and don't get together much. I re-read my post and boy did I make it seem like my life was horrible. husband is the love of my life and while he may be pig headed about some things, he treats me like a queen and makes me laugh everyday. That's saying something for having known each other so long. I do belong to a gym, but cannot go until the neurosurgeon releases me to. I do miss it and hope after my surgery next month I can start going again.

I was really in pity party mode this morning. Meloncholy, too. Missing my dad and all. I'm back to feeling much better tonight!

Star, thank you for making me giggle, even though I know you didn't mean to. You really get it...and thank you for making me really get it.

husband loves me and loves our granddaughter. He even loves A, too. J, no way, probably not ever, but that's okay, too. I love my son, but I don't like him and really do like that we haven't had to deal with the drama. The baby is always welcome here as long as I pick her up or they meet me somewhere for me to get her. I think that I am just going to concentrate on getting my neck and shoulder better so that I can pick her up and let the chips fall where they may with the oldest. And as far as the youngest, husband and I will have to talk and if we feel that the new girlfriend of his dad's is not the type of person we want around him, he may come back here.

Again, I have written a novel, but it feels good to get it out of my system. Thank you all for being such good friends and for being honest with me. I don't come here to get "sugar coated" answers. You all always make me see things a lot more clearly!

 

[meowbunny]

Glad to hear you're feeling better today and you certainly sound in a much better place today. Some days are rougher than others.

I understand the pain of anniversary deaths. My father's been dead for over 20 years now. I still miss him tremendously. One odd thing that I do is go out to dinner on his birthday and on the day of his death. I order his favorite meal (meatloaf and mashed potatoes) on his birthday. On the day of his death, I order his favorite dessert. I go alone and have "mind talks" with him. I tell him about my year and "hear" his replies and advice. Yes, I know it's my mind but I also know my father well enough to know exactly what he would say. Doesn't mean I'll do them (didn't when he was alive, no reason to when he's dead), but at least I can hear his voice and weigh his ideas. It does keep him close in a good way. Maybe you can find a ritual that will work for you to make this time of year a little less painful. It's still going to hurt but maybe not as much.

Many hugs.

 

[janebrain]

Hi Vicki,
you sound much more "together" in your second post, so glad to hear it! It is good you came here though and poured out your feelings!

August is hard for me too so I understand. My husband died on Aug. 6th (1996) and his birthday is coming up August 25th. My 1st child died of SIDS and his birthday is August 26th. I am always glad to get the month of August out of the way though some years are worse than others and enough time has passed that I don't get as "weird" now.

Thinking of you,
Jane

 

[DammitJanet]

Vicki

Glad to hear you feeling stronger. It is incredibly hard when the grands are used as hostages. That is one thing I really warned mine about. I never worried that Jamie would do that but I had a niggling worry that Cory might try and pull it and I flat told him that if he ever...ever...so much as tried to open his mouth to use the baby as a weapon against me it would be the biggest mistake of his life. SHE would always be welcome in my home but if he ever did that, he would never darken my doorway again. Thankfully he heard me well...kids should never be used as pawns.

I hope your son comes to his senses soon and lets you into your grand daughters life again. If you want a hint on how to maybe make that happen...offer a "free" weekend of baby sitting so they can have some time to themselves. Maybe you could offer to keep the baby one weekend a month and they could have that set schedule so they could know they would have time for them. Couldnt hurt to make the offer. Most young couples would kill to have a weekend free.

 

[Star*]

Well thank you - because as sad as it is - it was comforting to know that I'm NOT the only one who still has moments about loosing my Dad. I was ripped off. It makes me angry and I can still be somewhere and just think of him and sometimes cry, sometimes laugh and sometimes just know or feel he's around somewhere. (cue spooky music)

You sound like you have an awesome husband. I'm glad. These kids certainly take it out of us left and right. Sometimes I honeslty think when DF makes his comments that he's being somewhat selfish or that his answers are "self" serving regarding Dude and his situation. It's at THOSE times that I have to just walk away from him and agree to disagree and not speak for awhile. I swear to GOD it's like that Schmeegal character from Lord of the Rings lives in my head.

DF _ NO Dude can NOT ever come to live here =
and then
good schmeegal - He's our son, but you are right he's not able to live here
bad schmeegal - Filthy hobbit won't let me have the precious.

and so it goes until I realize that DF really isn't being selfish he's just able to see it for what it is. And that's why I still think you should think the thing with your other son over - I have a hard time believing that your x would have a meth head in the house near his son - but stranger things have happened. Any change you have some rainy day money to send his x girlfriend.? (slaps self) to come back (slap slap)

Hugs

 

[VickiL]

Well, thank you all so much!! I feel better, after seeing what the whole situation is.

First of all, Janet, they could care less about having a weekend free, as they usually just pawn her off on one of girlfriend's family members. I feel like you do about never using her as a pawn or to hurt me. I don't think he understands that I am more mad and upset over that than I am the stupid threat 5 months ago. husband is still holding his ground, which is okay with me. It's his home, too. The baby is always welcome and as far as her parents, nope, no way now.

Star, you hit the nail on the head!! I feel ripped off losing my dad when he was so young. I was 34 and I feel ripped off for my boys that they didn't get to know their grandpa better. J was his pride and joy, next to me and my brothers. He adored that child and I often wonder how much different J would have turned out had my dad lived longer. He was the only male in his life that loved him unconditionally and even at 5 he understood that.

And yes, A's dad's new girlfriend is a meth head. I researched her on a website we can access here in MO and not only did she get busted for possession, but for intent to manufacture and distribute AND trafficking!! Her ex-husband is in one of the correctional centers here and her divorce is going to be finalized tomorrow. I just love that website!! Anyway, I heard her in the background acting like his "mom" and well, you just don't get to do that after living with his dad for only a couple of weeks. If she keeps her nose clean for a while I may feel differently, but her court case on the meth charges won't be over until November. So, I am leery to say the least and husband and I had a long talk and agreed to what A has to agree to to move back with us and he has. Due to my upcoming surgery and our long planned vacation this weekend, I'm not going to be able to get to the school to get the necessary papers until after the 5th of Sept, but he said he would be okay for the next two or three weeks down there.

So, I feel a lot better. Wednesday will be hard for me as it is the anniversary of my dad's death, but I am going to eat his favorite dinner (fried chicken!) (thanks, Meowbunny ) and celebrate his life rather than concentrating on his death. He would like that!

Jane, I am so sorry for the losses you've dealt with. I admire your strength and thank you for sharing with me!!

As usual, you all are the best!