Need input on excessive rudeness from 17/yo

[Marguerite]

I guess it's semantics, too - what you call ignoring is probably what I'm advocating - to not react as they expect, but to take a totally different direction that is partly distraction and partly a challenge on a friendly level to state their opinions in ways that are not only more acceptable, but are less emotive and more clinical.
"I don't like that person," then has to become, "I don't like what that person is doing because..."

That is the eventual target, but getting to that point, especially making a start to get to that point, needs the individual management and fast thinking on the feet - and above all, NOT reacting how they expect (and to a certain extent want, so they can justify their bad behaviour and continue on their merry way wreaking havoc and emotional destruction).

Kids! They certainly keep us busy - I look in the mirror and see the old hag I've become, then pull out an old photo and think, "When did that happen? I looked good in that photo, it was only a few years ago..."

But it's kids - all the work and the worry.

It must be worthwhile. I keep telling myself that. Because if I walked away, I think I'd probably age even faster, worrying about how they're doing without the constant guidance and support!

Here's to wrinkles & grey hair - they are our badges of honour!

Marg

 

[Mrs Smith]

It's also about self-preservation and venting his overwhelming and negative feelings about himself onto everybody else. I'm going to reject you before you can reject me. He's desperate, pushing your buttons, daring you to reject him too. Therapy is supposed to help him learn better ways to cope. Sometimes a third party is the only way to break the cycle. It was for us anyway.

 

[Sunlight]

He is still my child, and these actions still grieve me. Even if it sounds like he is the most horrible kid in the world, I still love him very very much. I feel, too often, like people judge me, him, my parenting.

I don't care how people see my parenting, I don't care if they hate my son, he is mine. that kind of stuff should make anyone say "there but for the grace of God go I"

I hear ya loud and clear. ant spews a lot of verbiage straight from the heart of anger. his dad did that very thing. I remember a commercial of a flower. there were all kinds of words gossiping, and downgrading others, bad talk...the flower wilted as the words were said. it was a commercial about not poisoning others with bad words.

with ant, I have never kept silent. like Marg said I did it in a non cranky fashion and would tell him not to say those things around me, that Jesus was in every person he came across. I will not tolerate racist remarks, disparaging words against women or the F word. I do not care if that is popular with ant or not.

I think your son is hurting with hate as ant can be at times. ant has even said he hates how he feels angry. wish I knew how to make that stop but for my own one part, I take a stand against verbal pollution any time I hear it.

 

[Star*]

Question (Star raises her hand)

Has anyone asked him WHAT makes him happy? If the answer is NOTHING = explore what NOTHING gets him.

Has anyone asked him WHAT makes him sad? If the answer is EVERYTHING= you all have a lot of work cut out; a lot, but not impossible.

I think sometimes we concentrate on the hateful words so much that we tend to forget the underlying reason FOR the spewing. When difficult child went through this very brief hateful period - he was also pooping his pants and making gestures to people twice his size.

I made it quite clear that I did not raise him to be like this
He said: You don't live in MY world
That opened the door for him to tell me WHAT his world was like. Once I had a better picture of his day to day teenage anxiety (and he was right, we did NOT have the same problems as they do, it's a lot worse now than it was 25 years ago when we went to school or socialized) For the most part - we got along racially, ethically but our school was divided economically and clickety click click clicks. He has to go to school and deal with tons of junk we never had to. Gangs, more drugs, 2 parent households that worked and have no supervision moreso than not, Guns in school, higher (albeit we live in SC so that's not the case) educational standards, petifiles, parents that are difficult child to the nth degree and their list goes on and on.

I don't know if I was a teen right now if I wouldn't be sullen and dark too. There is no place to go to get away from it.

We took difficult child to the farm 2500 miles from here almost to Canada. We cut him loose up there with all the kids that really don't have a clue about what goes on down where we live. They were all polite, not a difficult child in the bunch...pleasant, worked like dogs, and difficult child didn't utter one ugly thing the entire time he was there. The trip up? OH HOW I WANTED TO KNOW YOU COULD DUCT TAPE A SMART MOUTH KID TO THE ROOF AND NOT GO TO JAIL.

On the trip home? He was a different kid, he's always been a social butterfly like his mother, but the hateful things stopped. I have said before I'll stop and give a homeless person something to drink or eat, some cash if I have it. I'll hug them, ask how they are doing. And my son SAW this the entire time he was growing up. Some where along the lines of being a teen he lost the ability to have any empathy for anyone other than his miserable self and EVERYONE was a (fill in the blank) I would tell him how Albert - the homeless guy lost his legs in a construction accident, had no home, no money, no bed to sleep in - and the shelters here? I took him....let him see for himself when he would mouth off and call names saying "GO get a room at a shelter you bum." You wouldn't allow your dog in most of them.
I'm not saying go on a crusade to hug the homeless, I'm the only one I know that does that, but maybe you could take him somewhere that he could see his misery and outlashing aren't worth the effort he's putting into it.

My son kept on and on about toys one year, so we went to the childrens cancer ward - He was silent the entire trip home. The kids who were dying had better attitudes than him - I told him it was a matter of choice. The school took him to the nursing home and that stopped it all together. He still wants to volunteer there. I told him with his language barrier he wouldn't be appreciated for who he is. He said "Well I wouldn't talk like that in there" and I said "Then you don't need to talk like that anywhere."

I wish you luck.....Just keep telling him how he talks is a reflection of his character, and the definition of character is how you behave when you think no one is looking or listening.

Hugs
Star

 

[flutterbee]

Question (Star raises her hand)

Has anyone asked him WHAT makes him happy? If the answer is NOTHING = explore what NOTHING gets him.

Has anyone asked him WHAT makes him sad? If the answer is EVERYTHING= you all have a lot of work cut out; a lot, but not impossible.

I think sometimes we concentrate on the hateful words so much that we tend to forget the underlying reason FOR the spewing.

I second this. My son is the most happy go-lucky, friendly, sociable, and tolerant kid I know. But when he was depressed, he was toxic to be around. My daughter does the opposite - she turns inward and thinks everyone is laughing at her or saying things about her when they're not.

When I see kids behaving in the way you described with your son, I always tend to think of depression and/or self esteem issues. Like another poster said, I'm going to reject you before you reject me. Plus he has the added bonus of pushing Mom's buttons.

I really think how you handle it depends on the individual kid and their unique traits. With my kids, I would ask them to quantify their statements. What about the 5 seconds you saw this person made you think that? Do you think that's a fair assessment? When others hear the kind of stuff spilling out of your mouth, do you think they might come to the same snap judgment without knowing you like you just made about them?

I think, though, to really tackle this you're going to have to detach somewhat. The fact that he does this more around you means one of two things (or both): 1) he gets a reaction from you and/or 2) he feels comfortable enough around you to say these things. If you can detach from his statements and treat them more clinically (objectively), you take away one of the benefits he has for doing these things and might make it less appealing.

Just random thoughts.