Primal Scream...
- Thread starter witzend
- Start date
witzend
Well-Known Member
He and husband are still texting. I'm getting PO'd about his never having made anything right by anyone who has done something good for him in his life. He lost his financial aid by schtupping out of classes this summer. He has nowhere to go. He says he will check himself into the mental hospital so he'll have a meal and a bed. I told husband to tell him to go ahead and then to not check himself out until he has figured out how to live.
He's no different than he was when he was 6 years old. He can't take even an iota of criticism. This is about him trashing these people's apartment while they let him sublet while they were in Alaska for 3 months. He didn't even have the grace to clean before they came home, then he stormed out when they found the mess and told him he'd have to make it right. He's 24 years old for crying out loud!
Is he a sociopath? What is it? He has no sense of anyone else's feelings. He's only upset because he is in trouble.
He's no different than he was when he was 6 years old. He can't take even an iota of criticism. This is about him trashing these people's apartment while they let him sublet while they were in Alaska for 3 months. He didn't even have the grace to clean before they came home, then he stormed out when they found the mess and told him he'd have to make it right. He's 24 years old for crying out loud!
Is he a sociopath? What is it? He has no sense of anyone else's feelings. He's only upset because he is in trouble.
I'm sorry Witz. Sadly, this sounds all too familiar to me. Oldest has walked out on many a lease, even has judgments against her for past rent due. She leaves things behind, including a big mess. She used to check herself in to the psychiatric unit whenever things got too bad, as a way of escape, and also as a way of seeking sympathy from those who were angry at her, in my opinion. It was incredibly manipulative. No, I don't think that makes your difficult child (or Oldest) a sociopath. In Oldest's case, I think it's a severe manifestation of her borderline personality disorder, this inability to accept any responsibility for her actions, or to clean up her messes, or accept criticism, even if well-intended (I need to speak to her again about her hygiene, she's showed up at my office a few times recently reeking of stale cigarettes and b.o., it's embarrassing). Everything is someone else's fault. There is no remorse when things go wrong, only excuses. Although recently, Oldest has taken to blaming herself when things take a bad turn, saying things like "I can't do anything right" ... honestly, another manipulative tactic, in my book.
It's a heck of a way to live.
It's a heck of a way to live.
DammitJanet
Well-Known Member
Oh witz, Im sorry.
I dont think this is sociopathic behavior if that is any consolation. It probably fits a personality disorder but not sociopath. Lots of our kids dont have that "its not all about me" gene. Or maybe it just doesnt mutate until they are older. I know Cory's girlfriend is one of those who thinks that if someone does her "wrong" in her mind, she wants to get them back in some form or fashion that is just crazy to even watch. (or listen to)
I hope that M starts learning that he has to conform to society since it isnt going to conform to him. Big life lesson.
I dont think this is sociopathic behavior if that is any consolation. It probably fits a personality disorder but not sociopath. Lots of our kids dont have that "its not all about me" gene. Or maybe it just doesnt mutate until they are older. I know Cory's girlfriend is one of those who thinks that if someone does her "wrong" in her mind, she wants to get them back in some form or fashion that is just crazy to even watch. (or listen to)
I hope that M starts learning that he has to conform to society since it isnt going to conform to him. Big life lesson.
witzend
Well-Known Member
Thanks, all. I know that you all have been through this too and it does help to know I'm not alone. I'm certain that the "Check myself into the hospital" is another manipulation. He himself even starts this all out by "I'm a manipulative loser." Well, that really makes me want to think you've changed. NOT!
There's no real damage to the apartment, just a basic fact that he never once cleaned up after himself in 3 months so it's scummy. And I mentioned to you all about how the last time we saw him he stunk to high heaven of BO. He scratched their car. He's gotten their electric bill to the point that they're going to get cut off. I talked to the gal last night, and she was angry at first but calmed down quickly. I told her I would pay a cleaning lady to come clean up the bath and kitchen. I know. It's bailing him out. But my thought is that if I sat in a dump for very long I'd be steaming mad and thinking about pressing charges. If it were clean and I didn't have to live in filth or clean for days in addition to school, I might be more philosophical about the car scratch and the electric bill...
Maybe borderline is more appropriate. I knew it was going to be very difficult for him to be alone. No one likes being along but he has never been. He's also not ever once conformed to anyone else's needs or schedules, so he's always moving from friend to friend.
We don't need this right now. We're living from paycheck to paycheck as it is. I'm trying to refi the house to get the payment down, but it's only been 2.5 years, so I don't know how well we can do with that. Oh, well. Enough about that. I told husband last night that at some point we are going to have to accept that he is a person who needs to be in jail or in a mental institution and just let that happen. husband agreed. He's pretty miffed, too.
There's no real damage to the apartment, just a basic fact that he never once cleaned up after himself in 3 months so it's scummy. And I mentioned to you all about how the last time we saw him he stunk to high heaven of BO. He scratched their car. He's gotten their electric bill to the point that they're going to get cut off. I talked to the gal last night, and she was angry at first but calmed down quickly. I told her I would pay a cleaning lady to come clean up the bath and kitchen. I know. It's bailing him out. But my thought is that if I sat in a dump for very long I'd be steaming mad and thinking about pressing charges. If it were clean and I didn't have to live in filth or clean for days in addition to school, I might be more philosophical about the car scratch and the electric bill...
Maybe borderline is more appropriate. I knew it was going to be very difficult for him to be alone. No one likes being along but he has never been. He's also not ever once conformed to anyone else's needs or schedules, so he's always moving from friend to friend.
We don't need this right now. We're living from paycheck to paycheck as it is. I'm trying to refi the house to get the payment down, but it's only been 2.5 years, so I don't know how well we can do with that. Oh, well. Enough about that. I told husband last night that at some point we are going to have to accept that he is a person who needs to be in jail or in a mental institution and just let that happen. husband agreed. He's pretty miffed, too.
Bean
Member
OK, I read your other post about putting stuff in storage, and now I'm seeing this. Makes more sense.
So... one more year until his brain is fully formed, right?
Heh. I don't know what went corrupted in some of these kids heads, but let me just say I understand your frustration. It really is difficult to have an opinion to give when it isn't accepted (or is often argued), or to make comments (same thing), or do much more than nod your head and hope that their natural consequences will teach them something in the process. If only they would take a smidgen of advice here and there. If only they felt accountable all of the time, instead of only when they get caught.
So... one more year until his brain is fully formed, right?
Heh. I don't know what went corrupted in some of these kids heads, but let me just say I understand your frustration. It really is difficult to have an opinion to give when it isn't accepted (or is often argued), or to make comments (same thing), or do much more than nod your head and hope that their natural consequences will teach them something in the process. If only they would take a smidgen of advice here and there. If only they felt accountable all of the time, instead of only when they get caught.
N
Nomad
Guest
I'm so sorry.
I suppose it is good that he is texting with- his dad. As long as your husband isn't 'into' enabling.
We always had better luck (not necessarily good luck...but at least a better result....and many of us here will take better because that is 10000x brighter than what we usually get) when we make our difficult child meet us half way.
So, we don't do things for her...hand things to her on a silver platter.
Case in point....she moved to the other side of town. We use to take her to the doctor near our house. Now, she has to take several buses to get there. We drop off the check to pay the doctor at the doctor's office or have the doctor's receptionist call us for payment after the appointment. We are still willing to pay, but she has to get herself there. We use to offer transpotation one way....again a 'help' of sorts. Now, even that is not do-able for us. But, we are still waying to pay for the apt, as long as she gets herself to and from the apt. It sounds silly and is only a small comparssion in view of the severity of the situation....but an example of 'meeting us half way." In tiny increments, she is learning to take care of herself and some of her own responsibilities.
We also do NOT do anything that will hurt us personally or our family to help difficult child. We help her when we can and if she is willing to do her part (meet us half way at the very least).
Don't know if this applies here or how it might apply...but it is something to consider. Sort of a philosophy.
Hang in there (hugs).
I suppose it is good that he is texting with- his dad. As long as your husband isn't 'into' enabling.
We always had better luck (not necessarily good luck...but at least a better result....and many of us here will take better because that is 10000x brighter than what we usually get) when we make our difficult child meet us half way.
So, we don't do things for her...hand things to her on a silver platter.
Case in point....she moved to the other side of town. We use to take her to the doctor near our house. Now, she has to take several buses to get there. We drop off the check to pay the doctor at the doctor's office or have the doctor's receptionist call us for payment after the appointment. We are still willing to pay, but she has to get herself there. We use to offer transpotation one way....again a 'help' of sorts. Now, even that is not do-able for us. But, we are still waying to pay for the apt, as long as she gets herself to and from the apt. It sounds silly and is only a small comparssion in view of the severity of the situation....but an example of 'meeting us half way." In tiny increments, she is learning to take care of herself and some of her own responsibilities.
We also do NOT do anything that will hurt us personally or our family to help difficult child. We help her when we can and if she is willing to do her part (meet us half way at the very least).
Don't know if this applies here or how it might apply...but it is something to consider. Sort of a philosophy.
Hang in there (hugs).
Fran
Former desparate mom
Ugh! I'm sure you are disgusted. My difficult child has to be reminded with a check list to take trash out. Dirt and smells gross me out and I get nuts when I visit him and his environment is dirty. Not messy mind you but dirty. Makes me nauseous. I'm sure your son and my son learned different but don't seem to know how to transfer that info into action. Right now(knock on wood) difficult child is afraid of failing so he is actually using the check list. I'm sure it's not up to what I would want but if the health dept doesn't need to close it down, I'll be happy.
I understand the offer to clean the bathroom and kitchen. The longer they look at the filth the angrier they will get.
I don't know what will help your difficult child but he has to make some leaps to learn to live on his own. What happened to the lady who took him in for all that time? Did he wear out his welcome?
I'm sorry. I know it's a worry.
I understand the offer to clean the bathroom and kitchen. The longer they look at the filth the angrier they will get.
I don't know what will help your difficult child but he has to make some leaps to learn to live on his own. What happened to the lady who took him in for all that time? Did he wear out his welcome?
I'm sorry. I know it's a worry.
witzend
Well-Known Member
Oh, Fran that welcome was worn out long ago! She was mad as a hornet by the time he left 18 months later. She knew he had taken advantage of and manipulated her but somehow it was still all our fault for raising such a damaged person. Gawd if people only knew the years and years of therapy and treatment that we supplied and participated in. I think that the "my parents abused me" argument doesn't sell too well with friends at this point. For some reason grown women were more than happy to rescue him from his terrible parents, but people his own age expect him to get over it, I'm sure. They sure don't expect him to act as though he's 12 years old and can't take a shower or wash his clothes or clean the toilet. These are people who are getting married and have careers or are at least on their way to careers and it's clear to them that M is not stupid. He has an IQ of 135, so that doesn't sell. He just comes across as lazy and selfish.
