warrior moms with- grandbabies please advise...URGENT

[Masta]

for those of you who remember my story, I have a 18yr difficult child, i placed her in foster care voluntarily, who is 8 weeks pregnant who suffers from (unofficially diagnosis'ed and not treated becuase the State refused to listen to me) bipolar and borderline personality disorder. graduated in may (has learning disorders).

difficult child and caseworker have been enabling difficult child's behaviors for 2yrs now. but the last few months difficult child has shown her true colors.

Her case worker emailed me this:

difficult child will be released at the next hearing aug 15th. She is pregnant and not listening to a word anyone tells her. Being in care after graduation of high school to receive services is something that we try SO hard to do but when a youth hurts and destroys her placement, there is no much we can do. difficult child has decided that we are not her support system but b/f parents are. There are no long term group homes for difficult child. difficult child is able to function in society - she just does not function like we would like her to. She had not sexually offended anyone. She has finished school. Her choices are poor but we can't put her in a group home because she got pregnant and lies to people. I don't believe releasing her is the best thing but she has pushed it to that. difficult child was to go out in her own apartment soon but can't be living on her own, pregnant so she will be unable to do that option. She can't stay at fostermoms because she is destroying that relationship too. She has related that she wants to move in with you guys. This is an option that we could look at if you want..... case worker.

foster care wants to hold a meeting tonight at 6pm so we can meet the parents of the b/f and the b/f. and to confront difficult child with all of her lies. she has lied to everyone about everyone else (triangulation). she has become verbally abusive to her foster parents.

im pushing for difficult child to be placed in a long term group home. case worker thinks difficult child can look after herself. she has been diagnosed as brain damaged but not bad enough to claim SSI (so I have been told). difficult child mentality is about half her age. I have detached from her but I am still concerned about her and now this baby.

background info on the b/f: b/f's pand his parents have bought everything for baby (new and 2nd hand) already including a crib, breast pumps toys etc. b/friend is 17yrs old.. and was in a structured self contained class for boys at the same high school as difficult child. (difficult child was in the structured class for girls) b/f did not graduate, works at a pizza place. b/fs parents supposedly have seen difficult child lash out to her foster mom and still want her to move in.

my anxiety is through the roof... coz I know difficult child will become extremely aggravated tonight at this meeting.. when she is confronted she lashed out.

my email to caseworker:

So what is the purpose of this meeting tomorrow night? So husband and I can meet b/f's parents? That can be done anytime.

difficult child destroys relationship because she has mental health issues. Issues that were never taken care of. Issues that I have been nagging you about for years and you chose to ignore me and the issues.

It seems to me foster mom and yourself are dealing with what I went through with difficult child.

Cant you see difficult child's mentality is not normal? She jumps from one person to the next, she has relationship issues. I am sure she is bipolar and a has a personality disorder (borderline). difficult child cannot keep or have a genuine relationship with anyone.

Show me how difficult child can function in society, because difficult child's teacher and you pushed her through school and enabled her behaviors? Because she can hold down a job (barely). She isn't even working anymore. She cannot follow through with simple tasks, she hasn't got her drivers license.

You promised me you would treat difficult child like one of your own and now you are wiping your hands clean of her. When the going gets tough is when she needs the support. Would you wipe your hands of your own child because they pushed you away and lied?

difficult child cannot move back home, we cannot handle her drama. I don't know where she got this idea to move back home. difficult child hasn't spoken to or seen us since the march cftm. We have text back and forth and that's all.

Why didn't you address how you rudely treated me at the (CFTM) Child Family Team Meeting? Why cant you admit you were wrong about difficult child and that all of her actions just proved everything I told you about her, and that you refused to listen to me because "I was a negative support person".

I hope you have learned from all of this. Families have been deeply hurt.

A baby is now on the way, with little to no hope of a normal stable life. Masta

difficult child will move in with babies father and parents. it wont be too long before an arguement errupts. if she shows up at my door i will give her contact details for womens shelters.

is there anything the State can do that they arent telling me?

i know difficult child cant move back home, im worried about her. please any of you with some advice, im all ears.

 

[Big Bad Kitty]

Masta,

I have no advice. I so wish I did. I would like to offer a shoulder to lean on.

Sending strength and prayers for you, daughter, and that baby (as well as baby's father).

 

[DammitJanet]

Ugh...it sounds like a really nasty situation.

Unless your daughter is bad enough off that you can get guardianship of her I dont think there is much you can do at this point. I would meet the parents of the boyfriend if you want to.

Have you talked to the other parents at all? Maybe between the two of you, you could decide how to handle this situation because it doesnt sound like either of the two parents are really stable. It sounds like this baby will be raised by grandparents. Do you want to be a part of this childs life?

Right now, while my son is quite active in his daughters life, the maternal grandma and us are doing most of the actual raising of my oldest grandchild. Cory loves her and takes care of her when he is here but he has no money to support her right now. We provide for her. We dont mind because he is in a bad situation right now and we love the baby to death. We have her every week for 3 days a week.

These are all things to think about.

 

[busywend]

Just have clear in your mind you will and will not do. Will difficult child live with you ever? No - then make that clear.

At 18 she calls the shots - she may never get treatment for BiPolar (BP) or Borderline (BPD). Unfortunately the system that could have helped her believed her lies. What is done is done. Not much advice here, I know.

Just to be sure you know what you will accept and not accept into your own life. If BFs parents want to take her on, so be it.

I think you could make on last ditch effort at getting the system to actually help difficult child. I believe that is what you want, and I would try once more. Perhaps you should have that case worker's supervisor in the room while you plead your case.

 

[Masta]

thanks moms for your words of wisdom and thoughts.

i wanted to try one more last ditch effort, but i dont have the strength in me. i have accepted what is going to happen.

my anxiety is in overdrive. im shaking. i want to go to this meeting but i dont want to deal with her outbursts.

im scared to ruin what relationship i have with difficult child by telling her she cannot ever come back home.

how do i go about telling her this?

 

[DDD]

I just signed on and see that your meeting is pdq...I don't envy
you your position. Sadly, the one thing I feel confident saying
is don't get sucked into grandparenting because it is too hard to
do when you have a dysfunctional GFGmom. I don't think you have
to ever say those words "you can never live with us again" as it
will be apparent over time. To say "we can not have changes in
our household but we wish you well" gives the same message but without the harshness. I would assume that the paternal gp's are
hoping to be participatory. You can pray that the baby ends up
safe and sound with someone who is loving and capable but you
probably need to review and take a refresher course on Detachment
...201, perhaps. I'm sorry and sending caring hugs. DDD

 

[Masta]

DDD: i wont get suckered into grandparenting.

i havent met the boyfriend or his parents. thats going to happen 2hrs from now. the b/friends parents want difficult child to move in with them. so they may be suckered into parenting.

i pray that this baby has a normal stable life but i dont think its going to happen.

Thanks DDD for your help with what to say.. i will use it at the meeting.

i will fill you in when i get back from this meeting.

Thanks all...

 

[mom_to_3]

Masta,
Our difficult child's sound almost exactly alike except for the mentally delayed part. We too turned our difficult child over to foster care, hoping that the Residential Treatment Center (RTC) and specialized foster parents would be able to help our difficult child more than we had been able to accomplish. I can't begin to tell you how lacking their "services" were and I believe our difficult child turned out much worse at their hands. Way to much patronizing, and enabling of her bad behaviors and the lack of accountability I think CPS, the foster parents, the Residential Treatment Center (RTC) and the p-docs and therapists had to each other, themselves, to the parents and most importantly to the children they are to serve. I don't think all of the people involved are bad, but there is definitely an undercurrent (tidal wave???) of corruptness in that government entity.

What is, is what is, with our difficult child's. They will not change no matter how much YOU want it to or how much you do to help them. Your anxiety is very much understandable. Your body is telling you something, heed those signals and stay out of it. Do not involve yourself or you will be sucked into the chaos that will be.
I see two options, one of which is probably not going to happen, but I would still have to try. See if for once you can reason with your difficult child (HA) and try to have her place the baby for adoption. I doubt she'll agree, but I couldn't rest unless I knew I had tried to help the baby that way. The only other option I see is to keep CPS informed when the baby is born and anytime you are aware of any problems. Decide now what kind of involvement you want in this baby's life and act accordingly. Be firm in your convictions whatever they are because your difficult child is going to drag herself, the baby and YOU to hell and back, I can almost guarantee it. Sorry to be such a downer, but this has been our experience. Our difficult child's sound very much alike. I pray you find peace for your worried heart.

 

[scent of cedar]

Masta, how did the meeting go?

Barbara

 

[Jen]

I too would be upset with the system and how they have handled all this but, I dont know if I were to go as far as to say, she may have done better off at home then there, because obviously you felt she wouldnt whenyou gave her up. It is a moot point as all always point out to me. It is time to just deal with what today is bringing, and how you are going to deal with it or not.
I used to think I didnt want to rock the boat with my difficult child when we were on talking terms, but I found out he was going to act and react however he wants to no matter what I say or not.

I think you need to examine what part you want to play in your grandchilds life. Let his parents deal with what you already know she is capable of doing. Maybe they are thinking this is great , a granchild and look at it as the only normal thing their difficult child is going to ever do, and they are going to hold onto that.

Good luck with the mtg.

 

[Hound dog]

Masta

I'm also wondering how the meeting went?

You mentioned the brain damage.... I'm also wondering about that. Is the brain damage linked to her level of functioning/maturity? Is there some way that it could be? How extensive is it?

I'm just thinking maybe if you can't get them to listen to you about the mental illness, you might get them to listen with something you can give them proof of, the brain damage.

I know all of the areas Travis' brain damage effects of his life. Far more than we ever suspected until we hooked up with a knowledgable neuro with huge experience in that area. Much of the boy's behavior began to make sense when linked related to the brain damage.

I was just wondering if maybe you could get difficult child placed in a group home under these circumstances if the mental illness (that's undiagnosed) doesn't work?

Hugs

 

[SunnyFlorida]

Oh Masta, I'm so sorry for the way things have been working out. I have followed your story for many years now.

Hope the meeting went ok. I too agree with-DDD on not getting suckered in grandparenting with a gfgmom in the picture.

I guess if, boyfriend's parents want her to come live with-them and they want to raise the baby, I'm all for it. If you could have visitation, that would be grand. difficult child cannot come live with-you and she will probably bounce around until she gets more stable.

somehow I think you've got quite a journey ahead of you.

Sending some gentle cyber and {{{sunny hugs}}}}

 

[Masta]

Thank you to all who have been keeping track of my story and have asked how the meeting went.

The meeting: In attendance were myself and husband, foster parents, case worker and her boss, difficult child, her b/friend and his parents.

The meeting started with the b/f's mom apologizing to difficult child for something she said to her. they didn't go into detail.

then the meeting started to focus on difficult child burning bridges with everyone and the lies she has told everyone. difficult child said she didn't like how the meeting was going. she didn't want us (her parents) to meet her b/friends parents in this type of setting. (well she had 2 mths to introduce us). husband said well if you didn't tell caseworker and foster mom we couldn't attend the two previous meetings we would of met the parents. difficult child denied saying she didn't want us there...caseworker and foster mom said difficult child said those words. difficult child said do you have that documented on paper.

caseworker kept discussing difficult child burning the bridges, difficult child said she feels like this meeting was held to call her a liar. then b/friend stepped in and said he thinks everyone is confused and we should focus on now and the future.

I said to the b/friends parents im sure you are wondering why my difficult child is in foster care. they said yes. I said she was placed in care because she would not let me parent her. difficult child said she never knew why she was in care (now this could be lack of insight on her part, doctors reports say she has no insight). husband said.. it wasn't a surprise, we didn't just packed you up and send you off to care. we dealt with many yrs of turmoil before we decided this was best for everyone.

case worker said you are in care for dependency. difficult child said that's all she was ever told. caseworker went on to tell difficult child her parents did all they could. difficult child said you never say these things in front of my parents, how good they are etc. (which funny enough I believe difficult child when she says that about caseworker)

caseworker has rosy colored glasses on. caseworker basically said everyone in the room is there to support her... caseworker went around the room and asked if everyone was going to stick by difficult child. we all said yes. caseworker said if you burn bridges eventually you will have no-one left to support you.

I grilled the b/friend for a bit asking him what his plans were. asked him if he graduated etc. he hasn't. he plans on getting his g.e.d. I asked him and his parents if he went to the self contained classroom for boys (usually court ordered) (my daughter was in the sc classroom for girls due to mental illness) they said yes he was for a little while. I asked them if they wouldn't mind telling me why b/f was in there or if it was a touchy subject they said its a touchy subject so I left well enough alone. b'f's mother said b'f is so smart he fooled high school and acted disabled and was placed in a special class. it was weird that she told us at...how she was proud that her son was smart enough to be able to get away with that.

caseworker tried to go over what the state will do to help difficult child money wise and whats out there for her.

difficult child was asked to apologize to foster mom for verbally abusing her. difficult child said she would rather do that in private (which means it wont happen).

I asked b/fs parents if they have enough room for my difficult child they said no, but they will make room. b/f's mother said they may need to rent a storage unit for difficult children stuff. difficult child previously told me they had a big home. b/f's mom has taken in one of b/f's friends (she seems to be a mother who helps others without knowing the full story)

to me b/f's mother is co dependant and admitted it herself. I cant pin point whats wrong with b/f's family but it doesn't seem right how they could instantly love my difficult child and treat her like their own in a matter of 2mths. b/f's mom seems to want to be too involved. buying baby clothes when difficult child found out she was 5 weeks preggers (she is 10 weeks now and they have just about everything needed). helping her son buy a ring (he is 17yrs old). b/f's parents have little money but they can afford to go buy stuff. i would have at least waited till she was past 12 weeks and then only buy little at a time if i were in their situation. b/f and his mom go garage sale shopping for the baby.. i dont think my difficult child likes that.

foster dad said b/f's house is a small rental, and dilapidated inside.

everyone was asked if they would help baby-sit if needed. I didn't answer with a yes or no, I said im still trying to accept the fact im gonna be a grandma. difficult child didn't ask to move back home.

my difficult child has always said she didn't want kids. this is a complete turn around for her. when I saw her at this meeting I could tell she was either scared or didn't want to be in this situation. im wondering if she got pregnant because she just finished school and didn't know what to do with herself (even though the State and difficult child planned on difficult child going to beauty school) difficult child is learning disabled but was helped through school. i think difficult child knows she wouldnt be able to attend a technical college without allot of help. difficult child is someone who cannot handle change.

im glad the meeting didn't end up with everyone fighting.. it was headed there for a brief minute with difficult child trying to say how do we know people in this room haven't lied. she tries to blame others for her actions all the time.

as for some of your questions: we have documentation that says difficult child has no insight, difficult child has had a MMPI (or kids) and was due to take another MMPI for adults this Nov. that wont happen now. it states both sides of her brain are damaged. she has had neuro pyschs done all say she is emotional and mentally delayed. her iq has stayed the same from 8th grade till now (about 4yrs) its 92. difficult child does suffer from central auditory processing disorder.

no matter what documentation I have the caseworker will not even listen to me suggesting difficult child go to a group home. caseworker just cant take her rosy colored glasses off. im too tired to keep fighting her on this issue. foster mom has finally seen the light. she use to be on the same page as caseworker, until recently when difficult child showed her true colors. foster mom wanted to go down a list of issues she had with difficult child including all of her lies. she was frustrated when she didn't get to do this in the meeting. she said to me difficult child has lied and nothing got solved. I said I know. she asked me how do I manage to live with all of difficult child crap. I said I pick my battles and I have detached as much as I can. foster mom is going through the anger stage, im past that.. I try to avoid difficult child and her crap when I can.

husband said to foster mom in private we have enough room at our house so difficult child doesn't have to rent a storage unit and foster mom said to husband, I wouldn't go there if I was you. she said she wasn't going there herself. like I said foster mom has had rosy colored glasses on, so for her to see the light is wonderful in my opinion.

to summarize: difficult child will be moving in with b/f's and his parents aug 15th and there isn't anything I can do about it. b/f's parents seem to attend all of difficult child meeting and court dates. I sure hope she doesn't burn the bridges with her new soon to be in-laws and her b/f. im sure I will get to see the grandbaby from time to time. I know I will not raise the child. my difficult child for sure has borderline pd... she only contacts us when something new is happening in her life, or her birthday, other then that we never hear from her.. she acts out during xmas etc she says its because she isn't at home with us. she has been like this for years, since she went into the Residential Treatment Center (RTC) and foster care. so I don't know if I will see the baby much and that's ok with me. I will love the baby from a distance and when I do get to see it I will smother it with affection. baby is due end of Feb 08.

 

[Big Bad Kitty]

((((((((((((((hugs)))))))))))))) for your mommy heart.

 

[DDD]

Sounds like it went as well as it possibly could. I know it is
not a chapter out of The Brady Bunch...but such is our life when
difficult children (and particularly brain deficiencies!) are involved. Hugs.
DDD

 

[DammitJanet]

Well the meeting went as well as could be expected I guess.

Has your daughter actually been diagnosed with borderline PD? Some things you mention sound like it but then it could be the brain damage too. If she has, then I have some good links if you want them. Just PM me.

As far as the boyfriend and the parents, maybe they are happy with a crowd and feel they can live with supporting a grandchild if they have to. There were times that I had both Cory and his girlfriend and the baby living here and could happily have kicked both the parents out and kept the baby. I really wonder now what will happen to that child. Her future isnt looking too bright.

You just concentrate on being a part time grandparent. See the baby when you can.

 

[Masta]

To answer Dammit janets question: i have had many doctors over the years suggest a personality disorder may be present but for some reason no doctor will give her that "label" till she turned 18yr old, because "once you have a label like that it will make your life harder and it will follow you everywhere" was what i was told.. She did a MMPI last year but it was a kid version (administered by the State because i requested it). An adult version was to be administered but wont happen now that she is leaving care.

The self contained classroom pychologist (who has watched my difficult child for several years now at school and held weekly therapy sessions with the girls in the classroom) suggested right before school got out in May that difficult child shows signs of having a personality disorder. He was the one who suggested she take another MMPI test this November. This was said in front of caseworker, foster mom and teacher.

we would never discuss any mental health stuff in front of difficult child, she would start argueing if we did, because she has no insight to her problems so she claims im trying to fix something that is not broken.

i sure hope the baby doesnt have mental health problems.