Whitney Houston dead at 48.

[Calamity Jane]

On a much more hopeful and positive note--look at how Robert Downey, Jr. has turned his life around. He was given up for hopeless and then he finally turned his life around and his career has never been better. We just can't see around corners, so we never know how things will turn out.

 

[Fran]

I remember an interview with Dan Aykroyd a few years after his best buddy, Jim Belushi died of a drug overdose. He said that Jim Belushi was an incredibly strong and powerful man. If drugs did him in, then Dan figured his number would come up soon enough. He stopped drugging after Jim Belushi died.
I hope those difficult child's who are under the power of addiction realizes that they aren't going to have a different outcome if they keep doing the same things.

Kathy, normal healthy 48 yr old women don't die suddenly. Even if she wasn't under the influence, I would bet that her heart was so damaged from all the abuse she heaped on her poor body that she could not recover.
Regardless, her gift to produce sounds that were amazing and beautiful will not be forgotten. Wish she could have beaten this demon.

 

[toughlovin]

Nancy,

I am with you in being discouraged!! And it is so disheartening to see people with so much talent and success be overcome and destroyed by addiction. I havent heard the cause of death yet but I am guessing it is drug related, if not directly then indirectly.

So I also feel discouraged but I know there is still hope even if I don't really feel it at the moment. Through my job I have met and gotten to know well several women who are recovering addicts... and they were very serious addicts... heroin and crack etc. They inspire me because I see how far they have come and know it is possible and that people do do it.... however they had to get to a place where they really wanted it. I definitely don't think my difficult child is anywhere close to really wanting it for himself yet. My fear of course is he will never get there. My hope is that given he is young that he will get there sooner rather than later. And that book "Everything Changes" had some good examples in there too.... so there is hope even if neither us feel very hopeful at the moment.

Hugs,

TL

 

[Nancy]

Thanks for understanding TL and for reminding me that there is hope even if we don't feel it right now.

Nancy

 

[HaoZi]

Many in that industry who get the fame and fortune are treated (and feel and act) like teens - invincible and stupid. They're spoonfed everything, which is how so many end up broke, broken, and addicted later. It's not a pretty industry behind the scenes.

 

[Signorina]

I agree they are spoonfed. At the same time I also believe they are exploited. Make a superstar NEED you and you have a ticket for life. And an addict needs her enablers more than anything. Control the substance, you control the addict and thus the flow of the $$$. Look at Anna Nicole and her ridiculous lawyer.

 

[Nancy]

Yeah I know that happens Sig, but I don't think that's the way it was with Whitney.I think she was surrounded by good people and I don't think anyone exploited her like they did Anna Nicole or some others, even Michael Jackson. I think she got addicted to drugs when she was married to Bobby Brown and she fought it ever since. I'll be interested to hear what she was using but if it was prescription pills it appears as though she went from street drugs to legal drugs in an attempt to sqwash the physical addiction/craving part. If she took benzos like they said she did, she was probably doing it to feel better and so she just exchanged one addiction for another and that's what has me worried. Because unless our difficult children can fix what caused them to use in the first place they will still not be comfortable in their own skin and look for something to make them feel better. And it doesn't have anything to do with the business or being exploited, it's all inside themselves.

Nancy

 

[DammitJanet]

Well we also have to remember that many people who are in show business or the music industry are also probably 50/50 chance of having some sort of mood disorder. In order to have that much creativity, they probably also have a bit of mania going on. I would guess that would leave them open to attempting drugs to enhance the creativity. I doubt they would want to take bipolar medications because it would dampen the creativity. The best case scenario would be to simply not take any drugs and just deal with the mania. I dont think that works very often though. I think they need uppers to keep the creativity going and downers to get them some sleep. It is probably how things start.

 

[Nancy]

Good Morning America today was a tribute to Whitney Houston and Celine Dion said it best. Celine said she was having such a hard time understanding this and that Whitney had an amazingly supportive family who have been there for her constantly and she was a good person and yet drugs were stronger than that, stronger than family and motherhood and support and everything else and that's what scares her and makes her realize drugs can happen to anyone and nothing else matters because drugs are stronger than everything else. Celine could not wrap her head around how drugs can be stronger than motherhood and yet it was. She said it is one reason why she never ever goes to parties or joins in the show business scene, because she will never put herself in position to have anything influence her and so even she realizes drugs can affect anyone, even herself if she lets it.

And that's what I have been thinking about the past couple days. And I know there are success stories and that does give hope, but I also know that drugs are bigger and stronger than anything else.

Nancy

 

[Signorina]

FWIW - preliminary autopsy reports are that she drowned -water in her lungs - with a combo of Xanax and alcohol and perhaps other drugs in her system. Sounds like she passed out in the tub.

So perhaps not an overdose, though it seems substances were definitely a contributor.

 

[AnnieO]

They've also said that there would be NO results till the tox screen came back, and that can take weeks on a celebrity (months on a normal person).

I feel sorry for Bobbi Kristina... That's gotta be just awful.

 

[Nancy]

I'm still not sure there was even water in the tub. No one has said that yet, just that she was found in a tub. If it turns out she drowned it certainly was because of drugs. I bet at least some of our difficult children will say "see she didn't die from an overdose she drowned" and think that makes it better. And I had to laugh at everyone speculating they would have a cause of death by today when we all know toxicology results take weeks.

Nancy

 

[Signorina]

I am sorry. ABC news reported that she had water in her lungs and Xanex in her system - I guess it was speculative. http://abcnews.go.com/Entertainment...ol-combination/story?id=15572046#.TzlfA1yPmAg

I should know better than to believe everything I see.

 

[AnnieO]

Signorina - trust me, I know the feeling!!! If not for recent personal experience...

 

[toughlovin]

I heard today that the family was told that there was not much water in her lungs and so she did not drown, but that it was probably a combination of xanax and alcohol. Not sure if the family gets more information or whether they have Occupational Therapist (OT) wait for the tox results.... a point was made on one of the radio shows that you can buy drug test kits at your local drug store so why does it take so long to get tox results. I can understand the full detailed report would take weeks but my guess is they have at least some idea now.

 

[Nancy]

From what I learned watching the Michael Jackson trial the amount of drug in a persons system changes quite a lot before and after they die because it goes through a lot of chemical reactions so it takes a while to do all the tests. Also if you ever read about car accidents and toxicology results they always stress it takes weeks. I'm sure they have some idea but it would be irresponsible for them to make any comment until all results are in. And since this is under investigation they aren't about to leak anything. Just a thought, if some unethical doctor prescribed the drug that she took that killed her they wouldn't want him to know about it.

A few months ago two young men that difficult child was drinking heavily with before she went to rehab were in a car accident and the car overturned and they were both life flighted and everyone wrote get well on their facebooks and made comments on the story on the internet newspaper story. They said toxicology results would not be in for several weeks. So when they both got out of the hospital (they were not seriously injured) they went about their business and finally about a month later they were both arrested for dui and drugs. I can't say I was sorry or surprised to hear that. They both ended up leaving town before their court case.

Nancy

 

[DaisyFace]

unless our difficult children can fix what caused them to use in the first place they will still not be comfortable in their own skin and look for something to make them feel better. And it doesn't have anything to do with the business or being exploited, it's all inside themselves.

Nancy

I agree wholeheartedly with this...

I have been disgusted to see comments over the last couple of days on television complaining that "society should have done more" to help Whitney Houston. If fact, a woman on CNN yesterday placed the blame firmly on medical doctors - saying that THEY should know that THEY are getting people addicted. I think that those sorts of comments are unfair both to "society" in general and to the individual in particular. Whitney is a sad story - a terrible loss.....but I refuse to believe that she was just a helpless victim of the society in which she lived and that we are all, somehow, to blame...

 

[AnnieO]

About the toxicology - What Nancy said - it's true.

It's not something they can just dribble a little blood or whatever on a slide and say, Ta-da! X, Y and Z were present but A and B were not.

TV has really made us believe that it's immediate. It's not. Some stuff has to be cultured.

Getting insurance for the kids when bio passed was a challenge, because it was not open enrollment so they wanted a medication history including why bio died, including toxicology... But of course we had to enroll the kids within 30 days of her passing... I invoked the "life event" clause (adoption, birth etc.) and made the ins co mad but my employer happy. It took over 2 months to find out what really happened.

 

[toughlovin]

I agree with you at least partially... I don't think in any one case you can blame "society" because that then takes the responsibility off the addict... and ultimately only addicts can save themselves.

However i do think at this point we do live in a very drug oriented culture... pills for that and this, and all kinds of info over the internet etc. etc. And I do think some (definitely not all by any means) doctors overprescribe medications... and too many doctors look for medications to solve a problem rather than other solutions.

TL

 

[DaisyFace]

However i do think at this point we do live in a very drug oriented culture... pills for that and this, and all kinds of info over the internet etc. etc. And I do think some (definitely not all by any means) doctors overprescribe medications... and too many doctors look for medications to solve a problem rather than other solutions.

TL

I agree! You are quite right...