16 Year Old Son Imploding

[Copabanana]

I am only now catching up but had to stop mid way to say this: to me he should not have run of your house during the day. Especially to entertain.

If he choses to disrespect and torment you let alone thumb your nose at your parenting...he needs only the legally mandated care.

I think giving in to his every whim would not work. Even though it seems not, he is seeking boundaries. It is not in the main his welfare that is concerning. But you. He would act out more and more to get your attention.

You are caught between a rock and a hard place. You feel he has become dangerous and vindictive and that he may be a danger to your family, that as long as he feels empowered vis a vis you and his mother, he is holding your family hostage.

That you and your wife make a plan to protect the family, with a professional if necessary, seems the priority. I agree with the others. Given that you are his target and because your wife seems to be the one who resists accepting that your son bear the consequences of his behaviors the idea that she live with him sounds sound.

I agree with the rest that the younger kids need to be protected.

I get back to your wife. I hope I am not crossing a boundary here but there seems either to be a communication issue that your son is exploiting, or he is exploiting mother love. There seems to pretty much always be differences in how each part of a pair responds to difficulties of this sort. It seems to go with the territory. All of us here understand where your wife is. There is no lack of empathy for this. But the parent who bears the brunt has a hard time.

Your son is no fool. He sees that your hands are tied and is empowered by it. He sees your wife will not act, and has grown more powerful and malignant. Perhaps not one response could have made a difference. But the family could have peace.

In close, it seems to me the way you are thinking, makes a great deal of sense. In the no win and high risk situation as you describe it, it is hard to see other options . I am sorry.

 

[username40]

His power is limited, he can make life unpleasant, but this too shall pass, he's 18 in 1 year 1 month. The day I put his on the porch, or tell Him I'll give him a plane ticket anywhere and he realizes he is completely without the love and support his parents for the rest of his life and he's truly on his own, our power will be evident.

Life with the other two and my wife is about perfect otherwise, if he stays over at a friends it's like the sun just came out after 2 weeks of terrible winter weather. The family dynamic is healthy, he's just mentally ill, I mean that's really what it comes down to.

My wife at times is not on the same page as me agreed. She is not as far along with realizing the situation and his mental state. She is where I was 1 1/2 years ago. She's also his mother, it's hard for her.

 

[BusynMember]

Since there are young kids, if you do any therapy with son I would still have them living away from them. It is different when there are others.

I think your wife will come around because of the younger ones, after all she is their mother too and they are extremely vulnerable. It does take time.

 

[username40]

It's make or break time, because I have a new job offer 1.5 hours away from my house but for a lot more money. I won't take it if she insists on keeping everything status quo, I'm too far when the inevitable call comes from the cops or CPS. I just got my 40K bonus, and my new job pays 80K more a year, it's a godsend. I want to:

1. Move her and the kids into an apartment away from the toxicity and the risk of CPS taking the little ones
2. I sell our home and use the proceeds to set myself up in a shitty 1 BR with the the boy, and pay off all debts
3. By August I can have them in a new home, nicer home
4. He turns 18 and I move back into the home

She wants to keep doing what we've been doing. We've had 2 CPS investigations, he has an ankle bracelet on, suspended from school, and the police to our house 11 times. It's insane to keep doing this, especially the risk it's putting the kids in. With 2 CPS investigations they're being put in jeopardy.

I won't be a party to this enabling and insanity though, if she won't make the hard decisions I'm going to move out so the kids at least have a soft landing spot when things completely implode. If just I move out, I'm not taking the new job so I'm close, and I'll need to instead file bankruptcy, so huge ramifications she won't accept any of this for what it is.

 

[BloodiedButUnbowed]

UN, you have a lot going on. Do you have a therapist or even a trusted friend in real life with whom you can vent, sort out your thoughts and bounce some ideas around?

At the risk of being too forward, it sounds to me that you have an issue in your marriage as much if not more so than with your son. The steps you are suggesting are very, very drastic. I don't doubt that you love your wife very much, but something is very wrong if you are willing to leave the household in order to escape your eldest son.

Also at the risk of being too forward, please don't make the mistake of assuming 18 is the magic number after which your son will never trouble you again. If he struggles to launch - which given his profile he likely will - and knows his mom will bail him out, even behind your back if necessary, then his presence in your life will continue.

Sad to say, but it sounds from where I sit that to achieve what you are seeking you may need to divorce your wife and file for custody of your two younger children based on the danger posed to them by their brother, which your wife won't address.

I would contact a lawyer sooner rather than later. This sounds like a potentially very explosive situation.

 

[ahhjeez]

I agree with BBU in that I would have a sit down with an attorney and look at my options. I'm so very sorry you are having to deal with this.

 

[Triedntrue]

I went through a lot with my son at that age and now wish i had pressed charges but even now that is hard. I have told others here that by spending so much effort trying to fix my oldest i drove my other 2 away they moved out of state right after college and i pretty much see them on holidays. One way to reach your wife may be with stories like this. She may decide she is not willing to lose them. The biggest break i had with him was when he got in trouble with the law and instead of getting him out of it we plea bargained him into a residential facility for 6 months. If you get an opportunity like that take it. It is one thing i do not regret at all. Even he admitted at one point it was good for him. I also agree with the others about making sure the younger ones are safe either by you moving out with them or moving him somewhere else. If you are letting him do as he wants he is not facing natural consequences, he is not facing any. I like the camera ideas you then have evidence to show police if he tries to falsely accuse you of anything. I hope you find some peace.

 

[Littleboylost]

UN40
This is so very difficult. I have a sense what you are going through. My sons behaviour brought a lot of things to the surface within my marriage. We only have the one child and there were no others impacted by his behaviour in the house. Regardless it dismantled us completely becoase we were not on the same page with how to manage our sons issues.

We separated and sold our home and my son came to live with me. I had him arrested for bringing drugs into my home and he retaliated by going to live with my husband. Who I might add newly loSt his mind trying to deal with our son and his behaviour. Our son OD’d a short time after being with Dad and this was a huge wake up call for Dad.
After a lot of time and therapy we are in the same page with how to manage our son and we are back under the same roof stronger bonds than evrer before.
My heart goes out to you these are suck challenging issues.
I have no answers and I hope tou have some good supports in place for yourself.

 

[CDN_DAD_in_tough]

wow there's a whole lot in this thread that is amazingly familiar to me. My 16 yr old ( I have a 12 year old as well who lives with my ex wife and who is a pretty normal kid) has many of the traits discussed here. My wife and I are divorced now and I'm in my own apartment. The problem child lives with me (mom kicked him out shortly after I moved out when we separated because he opened the doors of her house up to a bunch of strangers and had a party while she was out one evening. She came home to a trashed house full of losers she didn't know!) He had been a tough kid to manage since the age of probably 6 or 7 - he seemed to need to be the focus of attention all the time and he would constantly do things to sabotage any family outings. He started giving me the finger and telling me to f off by about 9 and his behavior caused no end of difficulty for us on a daily basis. Last year, things got violent on several occasions between myself and him. Yep. I got physical. We had a few wrestling matches - I was utterly at my wits end after months of being made late for work every day because he's refuse to get moving in the morning. He'd just lay there in bed as I tried repeatedly to wake him and get him moving - often rolling over enough to give me the finger. This is when he was 14-15! I couldn't take it anymore and tried to pull him phyisically out of bed and we went at it a couple times. The police and CFS were involved (well they were involved prior to that as well) but the file was closed when they determined I truly was trying my best to manage this kid who was completely unreasonable.

He skipped most of the year of school last year and still skips many classes. He also does nothing to clean up his space or help with anything. Loads up dishes of food and drink and takes them to his room, leaves it half un-eaten to rot until I go in and get them myself.

And I do go in and get them. I do his laundry once a week too. And I clean his room on the occasions when he goes somewhere and I can get in there for a bit. I do this because I no longer have any interest in fighting with him to change him or get him to straighten out. We're just putting in time trying to get through the days at this point. He'll have to make his own way soon and he's going to learn how badly he's messed his life up. I'll be sad, but I can't do anything about it because he utterly refuses to accept any outside influence from anyone who cares about him. I have my apartment set up so that he has a room and I mostly leave him to it. I give him $5 every morning - I do this because I used to make him a lunch every day but I kept finding the food on the floor of his room petrified. So I leave him a $5 on the bathroom vanity every morning when I get ready. I don't care what he does with it. It's worth it to me just to know I'm not wasting time and money making him a nice lunch. I bend quite a bit to his demands. But I have limits and I try and enforce those as best I can. But I've definitely pretty much detached from him and no longer really try to get through his wall of anger and irrational hatred and bizarre resentment. He and I communicate primarily via text message - even when we are ten feet apart at home. Any actual conversation between us that lasts more than a couple sentences ends up with him telling me he hates me and to off. I can't even begin to comprehend how a person can possibly hold on to such anger for such a consistent long period of time. It seems insane!

 

[Baggy Bags]

Wow, CDN, you have some amazing patience! Your son sounds like my son in many ways, but I have a ways to go before getting to your level of ... I don't know what to call it ... acceptance, detachment, resignation... Anyway. I applaud you for keeping your son safe without letting him drive you insane.

I am barely 5ft tall and 105 lbs, and my son is a good 5'7 and 140lbs. We've had wrestling matches too. Good thing I lift weights and am strong, but he could do more damage if he really tried. All the same, it really sucks to get to that point of physical violence, and all those FU's and fingers. Sucks, sucks, sucks. But it's gotten a little better in that sense, since he's been on the medications.

 

[CDN_DAD_in_tough]

I don’t know if i’d call it patience really. It’s mostly just a survival mechanism. I have some hope that there will be a time when he wakes up and realizes that he can’t go through life this way, but we’ll see. He’s basically pathologically selfish - there seems to never be a time when he pauses and considers the effects his actions have on other people. All that matters is whatever he wants at any given time and he’ll go to pretty extreme lengths if he doesn’t get his way. He also has significant boundary issues. Anything sitting around in any common area is considered by him to be free for the taking if he decides he wants it. I keep my bedroom door locked whenever I go out and anything I don’t want him to have stays in there. I mean even my freakin deodorant stick in the bathroom! He uses it for some reason even though there must be 6 of the things laying around his room! I have a little fridge in the closet of my room so I can keep some beers and pop in it because if I leave them in the kitchen fridge he drinks them all over night.

My ex wife still tries to engage with him on occasions when he stays with her. She tries to be fun and joke around with him. There’s been a couple occasions when we’ve all been together and it drives me nuts when she does this because she can’t seem to see how it invariably devolves into an argument - he can’t stand any hint of humour at his expense. He’ll do something. She’ll make an innocuous little joke comment about it. He’ll make a comment back...then her turn...and gradually he gets more and more annoyed (which I can sense but my ex apparently can’t) and eventually everyone is fighting. I’ve learned that you just can’t have any sort of normal interaction with him. On a daily basis, I might actually say ten words to him...stuff like “are you riding with me this morning?” To which his response is usually “no go away!”

He’s started seeing a girl about 8 months ago, and it’s actually had some positive effect. She’s a good student, and he’s been making a bit more effort at school in order to keep up with her. Of course he wants to have her over constantly which is really a pain because I don’t want her over unless i’m home too. I know he’s sexually active and I hate the idea of them getting busy in my place. I know they’ll likely find ways no matter what but I don’t feel like I need to make it easy. I let him have her over one or two evenings a week...I hate watching them cozy up in his room for several hours but I put up with it. I make an effort to keep them guessing as to when I might walk by and look in on them. Best I can do...

 

[CDN_DAD_in_tough]

Of course I know that when the inevitable break-up happens there’s going to be an epic shitstorm. I’m not looking forward to that. He’s a good looking kid and he can be quite charming and polite when he chooses...but at some point she will see the real person and she’ll tire of it. There’s already been a few “mini break-ups” and some heated late night phone conversations - which are highly annoying to have to listen to.

But right now, things are a bit better than a few years ago when he was couch surfing 3 or 4 nights a week and going to Instagram parties in dangerous areas and so forth...

Oh, I also keep a wi-fi cam pointed at my apartment entrance so I can monitor who’s coming and going. Gives me some peace of mind.

 

[CDN_DAD_in_tough]

...in the end, there’s only so much I can do. I have to get up and go to work every day and keep paying the bills and try once in a while to get some joy out of life. I also have to try and fit some sort of relationship with my younger son in. He’s a really smart, engaged kid who so far exhibits none of the older one’s more negative traits. I can’t spend all day every day focused on managing this angry stranger who lives in my place. He’s basically Jesse Pinkman from Breaking Bad, but with less empathy and no conscience.

 

[BloodiedButUnbowed]

My oldest stepson is violent, willful and impervious to consequences - because he has never had any.

He does not live with us. His custodial parent, my wife's ex, gives him everything he wants for nothing.

We have tried to hold him accountable and have boundaries. His response has been to jettison us from his life. We are no contact by his choice. It is hard for us but we feel, ultimately, for the best.

He needed therapeutic residential care as a child. He never received it. Now he is, I am sorry to say, a ticking time bomb. A bomb that one day will go off.

The young men described by OP and CDN Dad sound very similar to my stepson.

There is recourse. Being a parent doesn't mean being a punching bag, or enduring criminal acts (assault is a criminal act), because "he's my kid."

Custody changes, the juvenile justice system, social services, all are imperfect options which take time to have an effect, BUT to my mind at least they are better than living at the mercy of a delinquent.

BB, I hope your son stays stable on his medications and is no longer violent. DS refuses his medications which did make a big difference for him as well. He could function then and was not violent, either.

But please do not sweep this under the rug. You, as a parent, are taking a big risk engaging physically with your child, no matter his size (although you say he is already larger and stronger than you which is a whole other layer of risk). Remember that if a child claims abuse he will be believed, as just one example, which could lead to horrible consequences for you. If you put your hands on him, technically speaking, that could put you at some risk of these type of allegations.

God bless you all, I am chilled hearing your stories. At one point I considered purchasing and learning to use a Taser in the event I had to protect my wife from her son. Thankfully it never came to that, but I was very serious. I witnessed him choke her which was terrifying, especially because he has the build of an NFL linebacker.

 

[Baggy Bags]

Hearing all your stories, so similar in so many ways (I also have to keep my valuables in my office locked always), I do realize that it is a huge blessing that my son trusts his psychiatrist and takes the medications. I hope that all these kids come around and accept the help. (((hugs all around)))

 

[Searching for answers]

I'm just kind of looking for a place to tell my story and get some support. My son is 16 years old, he has always been difficult, we made a lot of excuses for him when teachers would report on his behavior, or if he vandalized we paid his way out and said "kids will be kids". There were warning signs, that we ignored, not really consciously, but we did.

Fast forward to Freshman year in High School, that summer he basically never left his room, his group of friends was gone. My wife refused to admit there was something wrong. Every interaction with him became him snapping, yelling, nasty, and downright awful to be around. If we ignored him and let him do what he wanted there was intermittent peace between stealing the car, suicide threats, drugs, catching girls in my home at 4:00 AM, property damage, verbal and emotional abuse to his mother and I.

It got to the point where he refused to obey a curfew, refused to go to school, refused to stop steeling beer and wine, refused to stop smoking in his room and said " you, what are you going to do about it". Now I can't hit him (Lord knows I've been tempted and so close) because then my life is ruined. So I went to family court and filed PINS on him. Once PINS started the behavior got 10 times worse. Part of the deal was he had to see a mental health professional. He as put on an anti-psychotic medication which he refuses to take. He ended up stealing my car and running away to California with a girl. I flew to California and got him, we had a long talk, I felt like I broke through. Came home and same mean S.O.B who left. So I went to court and had a warrant out for his arrest. He turned himself in and got 30 days with an ankle bracelet. He's since been suspended for the entire school year for drug use on campus.

And now, he is actively baiting me into a physical fight. He wants to get me arrested to pay me back for putting him on PINS. I'm obviously not taking the bait, but the household is so toxic. I have 2 little ones 11 and 5 who are so great, they're feeling the stress of the insanity he's bringing into the house. I told my wife that I could get an apartment and he moves in with me until he's 18. This way the kids can have a calm and peaceful house. Or since she doesn't want him to go to a group home, she stay with him and I take the other 2 kids away from the craziness.

We just don't know what to do at this point. Nothing seems to improve the situation, he gets angrier, meaner, and does even more impulsive and crazy stuff. He refuses medication, refuses to really participate in therapy. He see nothing wrong with his behavior, says his mother and I are the problem, he just does what all teens do and we're being way too hard on him.

I know that the "group homes" has a bad rap and I don't know what you consider group homes. Without giving too much personal information the st

I'm just kind of looking for a place to tell my story and get some support. My son is 16 years old, he has always been difficult, we made a lot of excuses for him when teachers would report on his behavior, or if he vandalized we paid his way out and said "kids will be kids". There were warning signs, that we ignored, not really consciously, but we did.

Fast forward to Freshman year in High School, that summer he basically never left his room, his group of friends was gone. My wife refused to admit there was something wrong. Every interaction with him became him snapping, yelling, nasty, and downright awful to be around. If we ignored him and let him do what he wanted there was intermittent peace between stealing the car, suicide threats, drugs, catching girls in my home at 4:00 AM, property damage, verbal and emotional abuse to his mother and I.

It got to the point where he refused to obey a curfew, refused to go to school, refused to stop steeling beer and wine, refused to stop smoking in his room and said " you, what are you going to do about it". Now I can't hit him (Lord knows I've been tempted and so close) because then my life is ruined. So I went to family court and filed PINS on him. Once PINS started the behavior got 10 times worse. Part of the deal was he had to see a mental health professional. He as put on an anti-psychotic medication which he refuses to take. He ended up stealing my car and running away to California with a girl. I flew to California and got him, we had a long talk, I felt like I broke through. Came home and same mean S.O.B who left. So I went to court and had a warrant out for his arrest. He turned himself in and got 30 days with an ankle bracelet. He's since been suspended for the entire school year for drug use on campus.

And now, he is actively baiting me into a physical fight. He wants to get me arrested to pay me back for putting him on PINS. I'm obviously not taking the bait, but the household is so toxic. I have 2 little ones 11 and 5 who are so great, they're feeling the stress of the insanity he's bringing into the house. I told my wife that I could get an apartment and he moves in with me until he's 18. This way the kids can have a calm and peaceful house. Or since she doesn't want him to go to a group home, she stay with him and I take the other 2 kids away from the craziness.

We just don't know what to do at this point. Nothing seems to improve the situation, he gets angrier, meaner, and does even more impulsive and crazy stuff. He refuses medication, refuses to really participate in therapy. He see nothing wrong with his behavior, says his mother and I are the problem, he just does what all teens do and we're being way too hard on him.

I have put one of my children in the nexus behavior health homes. He was there for 7 months and got a lot of issues worked out. He still has conduct disorder and we still have issues but we have an amazing mental health worker who totally gets him. I would recommend this but the waiting list can be long.

 

[sail24]

I know that the "group homes" has a bad rap and I don't know what you consider group homes. Without giving too much personal information the st

I have put one of my children in the nexus behavior health homes. He was there for 7 months and got a lot of issues worked out. He still has conduct disorder and we still have issues but we have an amazing mental health worker who totally gets him. I would recommend this but the waiting list can be long.

I'm currently researching facilities for my 16 year old with conduct disorder.when I pulled up Nexus, I was surprised to see that it's in Washington. I live in Redmond, WA so this was very interesting to me. Or am I looking at the wrong facility? The website I'm on doesn't mention in patient homes.

 

[twoofthree]

I feel like I could have written these stories. The similarities are uncanny. Unfortunately, I am in-between UN40's wife, and him, in terms of how I feel. I am afraid my son will think I don't love or care about him. I am afraid he will hurt himself. I am afraid of so much.

 

[BusynMember]

Please remember there are safe places for troubled kids who hurt their siblings. The brother and sister need protection from him. Best may be to find a place where he can get 24/7 care and you can visit. Or it could traumatized not just him but all. ResidentiLcare is a common option.

Love and light!

 

[username40]

I just wanted to give a quick update to this. My son is now 17 we've been to court three times. They don't do much other than put him on probation, but due to cuts to their program in order to be removed from the home you basically have to have extreme violence and threats of violence.

Before our last court date, he knew we were going to hammer him with drinking, drugs, stealing, terrible behavior, not going to school, etc... So he spoke to us so softly and kindly, saying how we were right, his behavior has been terrible, he's struggling because he's lost all of his friends and social circle and never made an attempt to make amends. He's extremely sensitive and he lashes out with very little provocation and stews over what most people would consider minor annoyances. And because he's so miserable he takes it out on us. He promised changes and seemed so genuine (I knew he was full of ). Things were calm for a bit simply because we gave him his stuff back (new start), and asked nothing of him. My wife was like "everything's going so good". I said "it is? He's failing out of High School, he lives in filth, has no friends, drinks and does drugs alone in his room, sleeps until 6:00 PM at night and plays Fortnight until 8:00 AM, how is this good?" She said "he's being nice", I said "ask him to do one thing, clean his room, pick up his laundry and see the reaction you get". So she did, and here we are...

He was laying in bed at 4:00 PM, and hadn't been to night school, which he's failing out of. She said he needs to get up, clean his room, and get to school on time. My son preceded to lambaste her with every vile thing you can think of. When my wife said you can't talk to me like that he stared straight at her and said "I can do whatever I want, and if you yell at me again, I'll make it so you can't yell at me". My wife didn't tell me this until recently, and he's been a mean lying anyway, once she did I lost it. He's 17 and over 6 feet, big kid, he can't be threatening his 130 lb 5'3 Mom. I dragged him out of bed and put him through his door and slammed him on his back and told him if he threatens his mother physically again, the beating he will get from me will be so severe I do not give a about consequences, jail, or anything else. I felt terribly guilty about it, I've never been there before, but we are all at our breaking point. My wife is now on anti-depressants and benzos just to cope with life. I take anti-depressants and klonopin to get through.

We took pictures of his living situation, he lives in filth, we believed he soiled himself and bed several times prior to this blowup. Hasn't showered in weeks or maybe months. It was enough to get him committed for a week, they are treating him for bi-polar, and they believe there's an underlying personality disorder. For years when he's gone to doctors and therapists he lied to them, didn't admit any symptoms, with his therapist he would just make up stories about how many friends he has, he's popular, and on sports teams. He USED to be popular and a great ball player, until this all started ~9th grade, since then it's been a living hell.

I still think he has a conduct disorder like anti-social, oppositional defiant disorder, or maybe borderline personality.

But at least he's in a hospital until next week, and I'm enjoying the peace with my wife and other two kids. My wife is sad he's there, I'm not, not even one bit. I hold out very little hope for the kid at this point. I think he's sick, but I also just think he's a mean . This week will be the best week I've had in years. I will feel normalcy for the first time in 3 years.