6 yr old ADHD son wont wipe anything. Please Help

DeterminedMama

New Member
My apologies for my nonsense repeats today. Looks like i wont be writing from my phone any more! IEP meeting tomorrow. Bad, bad day at school today. Hoping his dad wakes up, huge fight today and with the way school went, eating hand sanitizer, play doh, bumping into others on purpose, (the list goes on), I think he's seeing it's not that I'm so "mean". He asked what we're supposed to do about it I said we need to start with a neuro evaluation. Hoping he stays on board...

Also did some research, looks like Sensory Processing Disorder might be something to look further into, Occupational Therapist (OT) and a sensory integration approach. I should make an appointment with a neurologist i assume? Does it make a difference if i speak with a developmental pediatrician or neuro psychologist or neurologist?

IEP meeting tomorrow, can i request these through the school???
 
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BusynMember

Well-Known Member
It matters. This is not a neurologist's field, unless he has epilepsy. A developmental pediatrician is better for a very small child. I'd take him to a neuropsychologist.
 

buddy

New Member
Neuropsychologist

Plus occupational therapist = in my humble opinion first choices.

If you can't get the neuropsychologist try developmental pediatrician.

Still do the Occupational Therapist (OT).

You may need a sign of for Occupational Therapist (OT) from a medical doctor. His pediatrician can do it.

Don't ask for referrals, just kindly but firmly let them know this is what you want. Period.

A neuropsychologist does the extensive testing. A neurologist does not do that. A neurologist can diagnose any medical condition in their area.....and you may need that for MD confirmation of FASD or autism or whatever...but wait till you get the testing done. in my humble opinion as usual.

I have a neurologist for my son and she approves all of the evaluations and therapies we want. But she needs the evaluation info to help.
 

DeterminedMama

New Member
Thank you I will definitely see about a neuropsychologist. We're both on board now he also thinks its a sensory processing issue. It explains a lot of things... Messy body, trouble with behavior in school, eating play doh, over touching EVERYTHING, inability to 'get' training wheels, motor skills, the list goes on!!!!

I'm so happy to have joined and really appreciate all of the advice & help. I'll be sure to update :)
 

InsaneCdn

Well-Known Member
Motor skills issues + sensory issues = Occupational Therapist (OT) evaluation. That's in addition to the neuropsychologist/comp-evaluation.
Occupational Therapist (OT) evaluates both. And has therapies, interventions and accomodations for both.
AND the Occupational Therapist (OT) report is useful to the neuropsychologist/comp-evaluator.
 

DeterminedMama

New Member
InsaneCdn what do u mean by comp- evaluation? By the neuropsychologist?

I'm going to ask at his school today if they can send set us up for evaluations. If not, I'll call a neuropsychologist and Occupational Therapist (OT) whom specialize in sensory integrated therapy on my own tomorrow.
 

InsaneCdn

Well-Known Member
Comprehensive evaluations are available from a number of sources - neuropsychs are just one source.
Here (Canada), we don't usually have that option.
Other options include child developmental/behavioral teams at childrens' hospitals, PhD-level Psychologists with extensive experience in evaluating kids with multiple challenges, etc.

The key is to get a comprehensive evaluation.
A 1-hour appointment with a neuropsychologist isn't going to give you much.
A 1-hour appointment with ANYBODY isn't going to give you much.
Comprehensive evaluations take time.

Schools generally do NOT do a thorough job of Occupational Therapist (OT) evaluations - they usually only look directly at "school skills" (like fine-motor for writing) and not the big picture. You may still want to do ALL of the evaluations on both fronts, if you can (school and medical).
 

buddy

New Member
School evaluations are by law just to connect what issues a child has with their success or challenges at school. Even if you have an excellent staff person who can give you a great evaluation, that is the mandate.

It is really really important to have this done in the medical or private arena to get him the appropriate diagnosis.

Schools also by law can not diagnose. For example, I am a speech-language pathologist....in a medical setting I can use the dsm and give a diagnosis code in my area of professional training, the md then making that a medical diagnosis based on my evaluation.

In the schools, I can do the very same testing but can only say what the results mean. I have to relate that to how it impacts the child in the educational setting. That is the way special education is created and funded.

Many times the two overlap....and many times the schools simply do not do that complete of an evaluation, because they only have to do what they need to qualify or not qualify a student for special education.

In the school setting, Occupational Therapist (OT) is specifically a "related service" that means that it is only used in the schools if it is required to help accomplish a goal on the IEP. Speech and Language services can be either a related service or a stand alone disability category on the IEP. There is no Occupational Therapist (OT) category in special education.

in my humble opinion start with the medical evaluations. That is where you get the big picture evaluations. They look at cognitive development, learning, milestones, behaviors, health history and birth history and social history and emotional history and issues, etc....they look at communication skills in general and motor skills in general. That is why it is also helpful to get a private and separate speech language evaluation and an occupational therapy evaluation.

Also, because the goal of school therapies are pretty legally restricted, it is often helpful to have them work toward school success and to also have private Occupational Therapist (OT) and speech/language therapy to address more global skills that help in all areas of life.

I often collaborated with private area therapists so that we knew what each other was doing and then we supported and didn't contradict each other in our therapy work.

I know it is overwhelming. The school evaluations are free. But you are likely not to get the results you are looking for in this case. They especially will not be able to help with a differential diagnosis regarding FASD or other kinds of drug exposure conditions, genetic conditions, mental health conditions, etc. That is only going to happen with the "comprehensive evaluation" which means it covers many many areas of the child's life and skills....it will include checklist and forms for the parents to fill out as well as direct tests with the child....most are pictures and manipulatives that the child does in a sort of game like format.

Bringing those results to the school will help you revise the IEP and get more appropriate services.
 

buddy

New Member
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clinical_neuropsychology

This is what is different about a neuropsychologist...they have much extra training in how the brain works and how that is connected to injuries or damage......and how that then is related to learning, behavior, mental health, developmental conditions, etc.

A developmental team can do similar testing if you can't find a neuropsychologist but make sure they are evaluating all areas of his life....motor, communication, learning, cognitive development, mental health, etc.
 

DeterminedMama

New Member
This is very helpful since there wasn't anything in his evaluation stating he'd need Occupational Therapist (OT) or speech. I'll be getting the little guy in as soon as we can make an appointment! I do like the idea of bringing a comprehensive evaluation by a Neuropsychologist, Occupational Therapist, and Speech-Language Pathologist diagnosis into school, rather than having them just talk about general ways he can be helped to 'get by'. I wish he were 3 and we were doing this, but hopefully an intervention at age 6 will be just as beneficial.

School evaluations are by law just to connect what issues a child has with their success or challenges at school. Even if you have an excellent staff person who can give you a great evaluation, that is the mandate.

It is really really important to have this done in the medical or private arena to get him the appropriate diagnosis.

Schools also by law can not diagnose. For example, I am a speech-language pathologist....in a medical setting I can use the dsm and give a diagnosis code in my area of professional training, the md then making that a medical diagnosis based on my evaluation.

In the schools, I can do the very same testing but can only say what the results mean. I have to relate that to how it impacts the child in the educational setting. That is the way special education is created and funded.

Many times the two overlap....and many times the schools simply do not do that complete of an evaluation, because they only have to do what they need to qualify or not qualify a student for special education.

In the school setting, Occupational Therapist (OT) is specifically a "related service" that means that it is only used in the schools if it is required to help accomplish a goal on the IEP. Speech and Language services can be either a related service or a stand alone disability category on the IEP. There is no Occupational Therapist (OT) category in special education.

in my humble opinion start with the medical evaluations. That is where you get the big picture evaluations. They look at cognitive development, learning, milestones, behaviors, health history and birth history and social history and emotional history and issues, etc....they look at communication skills in general and motor skills in general. That is why it is also helpful to get a private and separate speech language evaluation and an occupational therapy evaluation.

Also, because the goal of school therapies are pretty legally restricted, it is often helpful to have them work toward school success and to also have private Occupational Therapist (OT) and speech/language therapy to address more global skills that help in all areas of life.

I often collaborated with private area therapists so that we knew what each other was doing and then we supported and didn't contradict each other in our therapy work.

I know it is overwhelming. The school evaluations are free. But you are likely not to get the results you are looking for in this case. They especially will not be able to help with a differential diagnosis regarding FASD or other kinds of drug exposure conditions, genetic conditions, mental health conditions, etc. That is only going to happen with the "comprehensive evaluation" which means it covers many many areas of the child's life and skills....it will include checklist and forms for the parents to fill out as well as direct tests with the child....most are pictures and manipulatives that the child does in a sort of game like format.

Bringing those results to the school will help you revise the IEP and get more appropriate services.
 

DeterminedMama

New Member
Oh boy, high school?! I'm happy we're starting now. I'm hopeful for the day when I can look back with some relief that while I don't expect 'perfection', we'll have a bit more consistency and predictability.

On a side note.. I think since finding out about this disorder (which has my sons name written all over it) & sharing information with my fiancé, he's been more open to talking with me about the issues and the steps we need to take, rather than just thinking I'm "attacking" or "making fun of his son". Pfewwwfff. It's like I have a leg to stand on AND I can breathe a little easier. ESP with the support and help I get here.

Oh, and as far as IEP meeting today, they're going to do an Occupational Therapist (OT) evaluation in the near future at least to get SOMETHING started at school. But tomorrow I'll be finding a neuropsychologist whom is hopefully taken by insurance...

I wish he were 3 and we were doing this, but hopefully an intervention at age 6 will be just as beneficial.


Read more: http://www.conductdisorders.com/for...g-please-help-53224/index2.html#ixzz2PKge97MZ
DM... trust me. LOTS of us didn't start getting help until LONG after age 6. Try... high school? And we STILL are making a difference.

Yes there are advantages to starting early. But you're definitely NOT "too late"!!
 

InsaneCdn

Well-Known Member
Getting a label is something many people fight against.
We saw it as getting an explanation of what we were dealing with ... a bit of a roadmap, if you like.
Autism Spectrum Disorders (ASD) is very different from, say, Fetal Alcohol Effects (FAE), or Reactive Attachment Disorder (RAD)... all can be the source of serious "behaviour" issues, but... with Autism Spectrum Disorders (ASD), there is a logic to it. We like to say that they are not "weird", they are just "wired differently".

Do you have access to a good library?
Someone else may have already suggested "The Explosive Child" by Ross Greene.
There's also "Be Different" by John Elder Robinson.
Either gives a different perspective on parenting kids with intensive needs.
 

DeterminedMama

New Member
InsaneCDN, I will definitely look for those books, my library or should have it or i should be able to get it thru them.. Thanks!

Yes, in the beginning his father did not want any kind of classification of Special Education. He was in denial and wanted to think his son was perfect. "My sons not a retard! There's nothing wrong with him", etc. But he's coming around and was ok having him classified this fall. He started to see that classification means that they help him.

He was also hell-bent against medication from the start. In the past I've tried explaining that the effects of methadone on a baby can have effects that cant be 'fixed' with behavioral modifications. He was still like i dont care!

Yesterday I brought up the fact of his neurological damage from methadone addiction, exposure to who knows what else, & lack of interaction as an infant and how if neurons don't fire properly or aren't firing to the right places he isn't going to get better, and it might take therapy and medication. Just like when you gets sick, medicine helps fix the problem. At first he was so mad at me, took such offense to what i was saying he wasn't even listening to me. But after school when we got a new full report of each incident of the day, he automatically opened his eyes and asked me what we're supposed to do, and realized i wasnt on the attack and what i was saying was valid. Relief....

And thanks buddy :) I really needed to get the ball rolling. In general, once I know what I'm working with, I tackle it. But until im at the dr's I'll be really realllly anxious!
 

DeterminedMama

New Member
DeterminedMomma....at least your getting help at 6...try not getting help until you were 38!

Very anxious to get him help which will in turn help our whole household hopefully!

Next it'll be my turn to talk to a therapist and get my own ducks in a row! I think we kind of go thru life just thinking whatever we've dealt with in the past is how things are supposed to be.. Until you actually really look at things and realize, Wtf.. Things arent supposed to be this way, and do something about it.
 
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