Girlfriends past drug use.

[DavidEssex]

Hello ToughLovin,

Yes I agree, the trust issue is an issue between US. The drug issue is an issue of MINE. Yet they both feed each other.

I read a lot of your post and agreed / could see exactly where you were coming from.

But you say...

"The fact she has done drugs in the past, really so what?"

Is the issue here with me. That's an attitude which has slowly eaten me alive. It's so hard to picture somebody I know doing something hard to believe that person doing. So that's what. Whether anybody reading this can relate or not, that's the issue.

Every time a film comes on when its use is shown it eats at me. Every time I read a news article concerning its use / distribution it hurts. Every time I read an article it hurts. Yes this is my problem and I've tried so hard to find a way to deal with this. I can't begin to tell you the times I've broken down crying with a chest physically hurting over this matter. I wouldn't feel this way if it weren't for the fact I care so much about her. I love her. I see myself spending my life with her.

It's hard to get over an issue you have been lied to about. It's hard to get over something when you are faced to picture the worst when you care so much about the person.

As people who have faced loved ones engaging in drug use - can I ask whether you think it is healthy for the one you love to see no problem with their drug use. Or indeed see no problem with drug use in general? Whether it be friends using, or simply in general.

Her drug use was never a problem to the extent she was an addict thankfully. So she is in a very safe place to speak about it openly, she just doesn't want to - with me - because she knows my feelings and doesn't want to hear disapproval. I think she has a lot of denial about the subject and why she got that place, and what it says about her.

Yes it should be celebrated she no longer has a need to use. But I really believe to know where we are going, we have to understand where we've been.

 

[toughlovin]

I think it is great to recognize this is your issue... and you clearly have some strong judgements about drug use. I understand that but I think it is getting in your way. I think people do all kinds of things and experiment with things when they are young and it does not necessarily predict their future... it is part of finding out who you are and where you stand. I did a lot of things when I was young, that I dont approve of now and dont really want my kids doing (and some drug experiementation was one fo them) and yet I dont regret doing them or feel any shame about them. It was part of my process of growing up.

I dont see drug use as a moral issue and I think you do. I definitely see drug addiction as a huge problem in this country and I have come to hate drugs and what they do to some people. However I dont see people who have used drugs as bad or immoral in any way. And many many people (myself included) can experiment or use some drugs casually without them every becoming a problem. The problem we have is that some people really cant do that and become addicted... and of course there are some drugs that in themselves are very very addictive.

I really think you need to stop yourself from these images in your head. And maybe look into (via therapy maybe) as to why this is such a huge issue for you.

It sounds like your girlfriend recognized her problem drinking and stopped that.... that is a key factor I think.

TL


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[DavidEssex]

Thanks or your message.

As you say, you've done things you no longer approve of. Same here. The problem is, my girlfriend isn't there yet in regards to her drug use, if she ever will be. It's something she doesn't see a problem with. Or if she does see a problem with it... It isn't much of a problem at all. It depends on what version of her story you believe.

It's this knowledge which I wrestle with. And it fuels my pain, it fuels the thoughts and it fuels the problems. Maybe I should speak to a professional who may be able to help me.

As I say, we agreed to see somebody together at one point. Perhaps of the relationship isn't over, we can.

I am seeing her tomorrow. The biggest part of me hopes this is not the end. There is simply too much love there and potential for upper happiness.

 

[Childofmine]

Hi David, a few thoughts.

It sounds like your girlfriend is an addict. Does she acknowledge that? Has she worked any kind of program of recovery before or now? If she does not acknowledge her addiction, that is not a good sign for your future with her. If she does acknowledge it, but she isn't working a program, she is likely white-knuckling it, and that doesn't work. You might want to read this book: When the Servant Becomes the Master. A very good book and a more recent one on addiction.

But David, regardless, there is no way to know your future with her or anybody else. There is no certainty in relationships or in the world. She may use again or she may not. You have "stuff" in your past as well. There is no ranking of "what is worse" or not---we are all struggling and we all have issues we struggle with.

Lying is a problem if it exists in any relationship. Also blaming people for what they did or did not do---either in the past before they knew you or even today---will not work in any relationship.

If she is lying to you and you are lying to her, your relationship won't work.

Love, sadly, is not enough in any relationship, David. There has to be acceptance and trust and respect and boundaries and manners and all kinds of behaviors that acknowledge the separateness of two human beings and their right and responsibility to be adults and to choose to come together and to create a relationship that works for the both of you.

You will make plenty of mistakes in your life. She will also. How will you handle that?

And friends are a very good indicator of where a person is in life. If she hangs out with people who do drugs, and she is an addict, she is using or is likely to use again.

And don't expect to know when and if that happens. Drug addicts and alcoholics are amazingly deceptive people when they want to be. I was married for 29 years to a very high functioning alcoholic. I had no idea he got out of our bed at times and sat in the kitchen in the dark and drank until he passed out and then somehow came back to bed and woke up with the alarm and went to do.

Hugs to you.

 

[Childofmine]

A bit more, David:

It truly doesn't matter if we think drug use is immoral or moral. It is illegal. Doing illegal things leads to getting caught which leads to financial and legal consequences, which means we can't/don't take care of ourselves and our responsibilities which impacts other people....you get the picture. It's a slippery slope to the bottom of the ocean and we take other people along with us to drown.

I think using drugs (read: any substance or behavior) to "cope with life" is sad and it causes us to not fully realize our human potential.

We are using _____fill in the blank_______ (drugs, alcohol, sex, work, food, tanning (I just learned today that some people are addicted to tanning beds!!!)) so we don't have to fully face life. We need "something" to distract us from real life and ease the pain of real life.

We need to learn how to cope with real life.

Until we do that, we are sick individuals.

Addiction is a mental illness, and as such, requires treatment. You can't wish it away. A person who blacks out from using alcohol is very likely an alcoholic. Extremely likely. Nearly 100 percent likely. And if she is an alcoholic, that means she can't use any alcohol or any substances at all. Ever again if she is to remain free of the consequences of using.

And she has to have help to change her ways of thinking and behaving. Just stopping the use is not enough.

Please read about addiction. It will help you. And then you can decide if you want to take this particular person on or not.

Personally, I have no desire to be around an addict who is not in recovery. They are usually not very enjoyable people at all and their thinking is way out of whack. But that's just me.

Hugs.

 

[DavidEssex]

Thank you so much for your detailed message Childofmine. But just to clarify, my girlfriend isn't an addict, and never has been.

She did abuse drugs, choose to go back to drugs on a regular enough basis and put herself in poor situations, but she was never an addict. Just an idiot.

Do I think she will use again? Probably not with me around. Otherwise, who knows.

 

[n64bomb]

Thank you so much for your detailed message Childofmine. But just to clarify, my girlfriend isn't an addict, and never has been.

She did abuse drugs, choose to go back to drugs on a regular enough basis and put herself in poor situations, but she was never an addict. Just an idiot.

Do I think she will use again? Probably not with me around. Otherwise, who knows.

You are going to have some touch decisions to make in your life. Do you really know if she was an addict before? (how many addicts wont acknowledge they have a problem, especially if her friend is offering her drugs several years after she has been off drugs---wouldnt she have set the tone with these friends by now, years ago, that she isnt interested in drugs?) Major red flag to me that although you trust and believe her, I think there is something else; ie another part of the story you have not heard maybe? Sorry to be suspicious, but usually when a person finally realizes he/she wants to stop drugs, they make it very clear that they have stopped drugs, and stop hanging around those persons that encourage that kind of behavior. I'm opinionated, but I would never consider an addict to be the mother of my children, under any circumstances. Like Gus says in Breaking Bad "Never trust a drug addict". That is probably offensive to some of you, but I guess that is where my medical training has taken me. By the way, one of my patients, his brother got robbed on the street and killed for his pain pills yesterday. My patient was really shaken up. All of this over his pain pills for his cancer. His brother told me numerous time he was "in with the wrong crowd". Is that what you want to happen to the mother of your children for being associated with "the wrong crowd"? And if you think her friends' drug addictions wont affect you and her, you have another thing coming! I don't know how long your girlfriend has been friends with the people/person offering her cocaine/other drugs, but I wouldnt want her to be around any person that could offer her cocaine. I would tell her she has to make a choice. This is my opinion, but I would tell her she cant hang around anyone that could be exposing her to drugs, and she would either have to choose me or the drug influential people (hypothetical because I wouldnt date an addict anyway). Maybe im just too harsh, but drugs is a serious issue.

Dont let people make you think you have trust issues with your woman over this. There are 2 issues that i see:
1. you dont really know if your woman was an addict?/you dont know if she might ever use drugs again?cloud over her past that is unresolved complemented with carefree drug attitude and not knowing if she actually is condoning drugs in a better light when with her friends?
2. external factors(druggie friends that she hasnt set clear expectations of her not doing drugs, despite she hasnt used in 3 years??) exist to encourage drug abuse in jer future, and those factors, while she told the one friend no and not again--or so she tells you, are still present

Both of those must be addressed. If I thought my woman was cheating/doing drugs/committing a murder/and so on--ie things of a very serious issue that are essentially deal breakers for a relationship/serious crimes-- I would investigate fully and do whatever I needed to find the truth, and I would not view those as a violation of trust. I am sure others would disagree. Go find some answers.

I would also tell her she needs to put everything on the table and tell me about her past. I wouldnt take a wishy washy "i dont want to talk to you about that because you would be disapproving" or another quote like that, especially since she is obviously talking about this stuff with her friends! I would make it very clear that she has to put all her cards on the table; otherwise, the relationship couldnt go on.

I'm a pharmacist. I dont personally have an addict as a family member. An acquintence from my junior high days got into drugs, but i wasn't close with him and never hung out with him outside of school sports. I deal with druggies all day, either trying to pick up someone elses medication, get medications early, get sudafed to cook crystal meth, and so on.

So many red flags. I would dig into her past. Maybe im too insecure. But she isnt telling you the whole story, and that much is very obvious to me.

 

[DavidEssex]

N64bomb, thanks for your input. You've said several things I either think myself, or you've said them with a new perspective which is fresh.

I totally agree with what you say about cards on the table. It's sad she can't talk to me about issue she will discuss with her drug user friends. As I've mentioned elsewhere, she looks for safe opinions and conversations. A drug user is going to side with her on this one which is what she wants to hear.

The point about surely she would have set a tone in three years that she wants nothing to do with drugs to her best thing is another great point. I've ne'er thought about it like that. I've thought. What does this say about your friends opinion of you, but not how you worded it. It's a very valid point, and goes to what I said about I'm certain it's one answer for me, and likely the truth to her friends.

Re the emails, it wasn't an ideal thing to have to do. But history will prove that was the only way I would have found out the truth. That's a sad fact.

 

[DavidEssex]

RE if she would have done drugs that Sunday afternoon if I wasn't around? God knows.

Maybe it wasn't the right time for we in a sober state. But if she was drunk on a Saturday night around people he trusted and felt secure around, I have a hard time thinking she wouldn't.

This is a huge problem. 'Friends' who don't have her best interests at heart. It really bothers me. I can almost picture them having a pop at me or being a 'square' which is just so wrong.

 

[Signorina]

You're sitting in judgment of her & you want her to be sorry for something she did years ago, long before you met. You seem to find her past experimentation as definitive proof of a permanent moral flaw. Not only that, you seem certain that you and your beliefs are superior to her's and her friends.

Addiction can strike anyone at anytime. Life is about growing and learning from mistakes and broadening one's horizons. It's not about sitting in judgment of others, She's not the woman for you and frankly, she deserves better. If you loved her unconditionally you would accept her and embrace the path of her life that led her to you. You are doing just the opposite. Marriage is difficult under the best of circumstances. Hold out for someone who meets your rigid qualifications. And she should hold out for someone who accepts her for who she is.

 

[DavidEssex]

Signorina, I find your post offensive to be honest.

1. I think you be hard pressed to argue a pro cocaine attitude is better than an anti cocaine one.

2. You mention learning from mistakes. Well that's one of the main points here, she doesn't see it as a mistake. Now see point one.

To say she deserves more than me, when I'm looking out for her and breaking my heart over this is just offensive.

 

[BusynMember]

David, you get offended awfully easy. I'm kind of offended by your stance. I have a daughter who used drugs once and your rigid, I-am-sure-I-am-right,I'm the good guy, and she did horrible things is NOT something that I am interested in hearing. This is a format for parents of troubled adult children, not advice to those in relationships who are in my opinion trying to control the partner. This is not a relationship forum, sir. Frankly, it doesn't sound to me like you are worried about anyone except yourself and your girlfriend's refusal to agree with your own moral compass. Our moral compasses are our own and we can not force others to agree with them. You'll need to learn that if you ever want a successful relationship unless you find a woman who is EXACTLY like you. Now enough advice to the lovesick from me.

If you'd be so kind, can you stop making flat judgments here, such as "it is better to be pro-cocaine than anti-cocaine." Some of our kids used or still use cocaine and we are struggling with this. in my opinion there really isn't any point to this post here. It isn't what the format is about. We are a support forum of parents who care about one another. You are pouring salt into many wounds, methinks. My daughter used cocaine, meth, etc. and I dare you to post here that she is inferior to you because I'll cyber-bite your head off. She's a wonderful young woman. In my opinion only (others may not agree) this is treading into dangerous territory and it is not about your child.

My daughter feels her trip through life, which included her teen years filled with drugs, helped her grow stronger because she learned many lessons along the way. I am a very proud parent and am glad she did not find somebody so judgmental of her. I can't wait until she gives birth to my first granddaughter in two months. She'll be a GREAT mother.

Mods, can this at least we moved to the Water Cooler?

 

[Kathy813]

n64bomb,

I would tell her she cant hang around anyone that could be exposing her to drugs

If I thought my woman

I would also tell her she needs to put everything on the table and tell me about her past. I wouldnt take a wishy washy "i dont want to talk to you about that because you would be disapproving"

I would dig into her past.

Your woman? Do you own her? If my daughter brought you home I would tell her to run away as fast as she can. It sounds like you have major control issues.

David,

MWM told you what I tried to hint at in my earlier posts. You are telling parents of children who have had or currently have substance abuse problems that they are not worthy of love or a future with children.

This is not the forum for you. I think you need to find a love advice forum where people will agree with you and tell you what you want to hear. Every time one of us has tried to point out that you are judging your girlfriend and trying to control her very words you push it aside and again tell us that you deserve to hear what you want to hear.

I agree with Signorina . . . I hope your soon-to-be ex-girlfriend finds someone that will love her unconditionally and celebrate her sobriety and let her leave her past where it belongs.

Kathy

 

[n64bomb]

n64bomb,

Your woman? Do you own her? If my daughter brought you home I would tell her to run away as fast as she can. It sounds like you have major control issues.

David,

MWM told you what I tried to hint at in my earlier posts. You are telling parents of children who have had or currently have substance abuse problems that they are not worthy of love or a future with children.

This is not the forum for you. I think you need to find a love advice forum where people will agree with you and tell you what you want to hear. Every time one of us has tried to point out that you are judging your girlfriend and trying to control her very words you push it aside and again tell us that you deserve to hear what you want to hear.

I agree with Signorina . . . I hope your soon-to-be ex-girlfriend finds someone that will love her unconditionally and celebrate her sobriety and let her leave her past where it belongs.


Kathy

You guys so nitpicky lol. You are entitled to your opinion, Kathy. So am I. Thanks for exaggerating things!
Sorry you dont agree with my opinions. THAT DOESNT MAKE YOU RIGHT, FYI.

You marginalize drug abuse as if it is nothing. So sad. Sorry that I make if very obvious I would not be associated with someone who openly uses/condones drugs. It's not control issues; it's fundamental beliefs on drugs. Some things are just what you believe.

If you can't comprehend that "my woman" implies no ownership, and that is a phrase sometimes people use akin to my girlfriend/my wife, you dont need to comment, let alone try to berate me when you aren't even right! Thanks

 

[runawaybunny]

@DavidEssex @n64bomb

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[Signorina]

David,

I have a different point of view from you. And it offends you, not once, but twice.

Thank you for proving my point so beautifully.

 

[toughlovin]

N64bomb,

I am guessing you havent followed everyones story if you think we are marginaiizing drug use as if it is nothing!!! Believe me those of us on this forum know intimiately the problems with drug use.

'You say you would not associate with someone who uses drugs.... um so does that mean you will not associate with your child if they were to use drugs? really? Do you think being judgemental of the addict is going to help them stop using? I know from experience with my difficult child that it will not.

TL


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[DavidEssex]

I am

David,

I have a different point of view from you. And it offends you, not once, but twice.

Thank you for proving my point so beautifully.

I am offended because I am here looking for advise on to help a situation and try to save a relationship which has been torn by drug use. I am clearly coming from a good place with a good heart. I am trying to protect somebody from negative influence.

Overlooking this you are openly wishing she walk away from me because I struggle to accept her pro drug attitude.

You've certainly made a point, but I don't think it's a positive one. When you say 'rigid qualifications' it's obvious to me this is something which has touched a nerve because it's obviously a common issue to you so I don't want to tread on you. Unlike you're directly hurtful comments, it's not my intention to offend. But if you believe not condoning drunken cocaine use is 'rigid' then it's no wonder you want her to leave me as we are totally on different wave lengths.

MidWeatMom, if you think the only person I am worried about is myself you have totally missed the points I have been trying to make.

I will no longer be posting here as it is obvious to me I am starting to upset people by having a different outlook to parents of drug abusers. It was never my intention to cause offence so I think removing myself will be the kindest thing.

Thank you to anybody who tried to help me.

David