Time to sell his car?
- Thread starter vligrl
- Start date
S
Signorina
Guest
VG-lots of good advice here. I have been away from my laptop and am trying to answer via phone-so I'd I come across curtly-that's not my intent.
Please do not straighten out his overdrawn bank account. I wrote from experience. I paid off my sons overdraft fee/overdrawn bank account and his past due credit card.
I did it with the best intentions. He has opened a bank account at a credit card in order to get a visa there. The bank acct had overdraft protection.
He ran both to the limits & was raking up late fees. I paid them off so they could be closed. Once my checks cleared, he was able to reopen them . My good intentions enabled him tremendously.
Preserving the credit ability of a user is a bad idea. Let him sink.
{{{hugs)))
Please do not straighten out his overdrawn bank account. I wrote from experience. I paid off my sons overdraft fee/overdrawn bank account and his past due credit card.
I did it with the best intentions. He has opened a bank account at a credit card in order to get a visa there. The bank acct had overdraft protection.
He ran both to the limits & was raking up late fees. I paid them off so they could be closed. Once my checks cleared, he was able to reopen them . My good intentions enabled him tremendously.
Preserving the credit ability of a user is a bad idea. Let him sink.
{{{hugs)))
BusynMember
Well-Known Member
Coming in late, but had a daughter who used. We didn't know how much or what, but we bought her a used car before we were aware she was REALLY into drugs. It was good that you sold your son's car. My daughter had an accident with her car. Then she conned her straight arrow brother into buying her another car ( I warned him) and she destroyed that one too. After we made her leave, she was driving somebody else's car in Illinois and had a really bad accident that was her fault. She ended up owing the driver $15,000 as she was sued. Way after she was clean, she still had to pay her father back every month. He paid for it, but insisted she pay him back and, after she got clean, she was a different person and actually did pay him back. But going back to difficult child's who drink, smoke pot, use harder drugs, does it matter...?....they are not safe drivers and in my opinion it's our responsibility to do all we can to keep them out of a car. We may not be able to do it, but we have to try. After the third accident, Daughter found herself living with straight brother who would have thrown her out if she even smoked a cigarette in his house and she walked back and forth to work. She learned a lot about responsibility there.
It is never a good idea to bail out a difficult child. They think you'll always do it, and they take advantage. Then the first time you don't, they hate you and let you know it. in my opinion it's actually better to let them sink, then have to find a way to swim.
(((Hugs))) and you did the right thing!
It is never a good idea to bail out a difficult child. They think you'll always do it, and they take advantage. Then the first time you don't, they hate you and let you know it. in my opinion it's actually better to let them sink, then have to find a way to swim.
(((Hugs))) and you did the right thing!
Thank you all for your advice. Today has not been a good day and of course it is due to my son. First, he didn't go to school today saying his body hurt. He slept about 15 hours yesterday after school.,.did not go out. Besides missing school, after knowing he is failing all the subjects he missed today, he was suppose to go do his Community Service at 1:15. I had a feeling he wasn't going when he had someone pick him up instead of letting us drive him and I was right. Turns out besides missing today (called in sick an hour before he was suppose to be there telling them he has mono) he also missed going last Thursday, the day I trusted him to use his now ex car. If he doesn't make up these 6 hours by the time he goes to court next month, he will have a warrant for his arrest. He is already in hot water legally (not drug related). I feel sick to my stomach after listening to his **** about raising his grades to a C, gaining my trust again to use the new car, lying about doing his community service...I feel sick that we bought him an expensive ticket for his upcoming birthday for a music festival that he has been dying to go to (don't get the tickets until June) Not sure if he deserves one warning that if he screws up at school, lies or misses community service again, the ticket will be sold to a deserving individual, birthday or not. Personally, I think it's time he goes. I don't see anything changing school wise or anything else. He keeps talking about changing his major...why bother...I guarantee he will flunk out. Just talked to a girl he was seeing trying to find out who picked him up and apparently they aren't really seeing each other anymore as he didn't like discussing his future plans or lack thereof. She got too serious and is going to college in the fall after she graduates from high school. He is sooooooo lost. She is worried about him and his lack of motivation to do anything. Hurts that he put up a wall against her. Really appreciated knowing someone had the guts to talk to him about reality.
(((((hugs)))))
I would NOT believe a word he says until he gets some sort of rehab/12 step help and really works the program. not one single word or promise about grades, not smoking, not using, whatever. Your son is only loyal to one thing - his addiction. He is now a pod person taken over by the alien named addiction. This addiction will do the talking and the walking until it is kicked out by HIM with the help of rehab and a 12 step program. It just is what it is. He will lie to you, steal from you, con you, play you, hurt and betray you for as long as you choose to allow him to do it.
It sounds like he needs to move out an be on his own. The more you help him, the more you give him or buy him, the more $$ he has to use for drugs. This means ALL help, including help with the bank account. Get your name off of his account if it is on there, and then let him SINK. Let them report him to chex or whomeever. It is the natural and logical consequence of HIS ACTIONS.
PLEASE read mattsmom's thread in this forum. It has an interesting plea from a recovering addict. It is something I have heard in MANY speaker meetings at AA and from many who come to alanon when they learn their child is now an addict like they were.
Just remember that every penny you give him or spend on hm is another penny's worth of drugs. I stopped giving my brother ANYTHING when I realized this. I became the family &itch but that was the breaks.
I would NOT believe a word he says until he gets some sort of rehab/12 step help and really works the program. not one single word or promise about grades, not smoking, not using, whatever. Your son is only loyal to one thing - his addiction. He is now a pod person taken over by the alien named addiction. This addiction will do the talking and the walking until it is kicked out by HIM with the help of rehab and a 12 step program. It just is what it is. He will lie to you, steal from you, con you, play you, hurt and betray you for as long as you choose to allow him to do it.
It sounds like he needs to move out an be on his own. The more you help him, the more you give him or buy him, the more $$ he has to use for drugs. This means ALL help, including help with the bank account. Get your name off of his account if it is on there, and then let him SINK. Let them report him to chex or whomeever. It is the natural and logical consequence of HIS ACTIONS.
PLEASE read mattsmom's thread in this forum. It has an interesting plea from a recovering addict. It is something I have heard in MANY speaker meetings at AA and from many who come to alanon when they learn their child is now an addict like they were.
Just remember that every penny you give him or spend on hm is another penny's worth of drugs. I stopped giving my brother ANYTHING when I realized this. I became the family &itch but that was the breaks.
I have to agree with everything susie said. I am kickingmyself now knowing that every penny I gave to difficult child in the past six months to help her get started, every grocery I bought her, every gas card I gave her, every penny, was just one more penny she spent on drugs/alcohol. I was enabling her without knowing it and all the while I thought I was helping her. She was lying to me the whole time. I have been conned so many times by her that I really don't want to see her again.
Your story is so similar to mine two years ago, and it only got worse. I hope something happenes to wake your difficult child up, but all too often they have to lose everything before they get it.
Nancy
Your story is so similar to mine two years ago, and it only got worse. I hope something happenes to wake your difficult child up, but all too often they have to lose everything before they get it.
Nancy
When he came home he admitted missing Community Service and said he did today because a friend who has emotional issues needed help. My son has always been there for everyone but himself. Just point blank asked him why he keeps sabatoging himself, I don't get it. Talked for awhile about that and considering how mad I was by the time he came home it's a wonder I calmed down enough to have a civil conversation. Bottom line for him is he hates being this way, doesn't know why when he has good intentions like doing his laundry or cleaning his room, that he doesn't follow through...as most things. I told him since he thinks his parent's don't know anything and whatever his friends tell him isn't sinking in, that he should go to a professional to talk to and find a way to create new habits and get to the bottom of why he can't seem to move forward. He agreed and he wants to try the Wellbutrin he was prescribed before but never gave it a chance. He is ADHD and was told he was depressed in the past so maybe this will balance him out a bit as it does for me. He is very anxious to get out of this area, have a fresh start in the city with his best friend assuming his friend is accepted to BU, go to school part time so he can make enough money to support himself with roomates. I agree about getting the heck out of dodge. This sleepy bedroom community incites drug use because there is little else to do. I think kids in the city have less of a drug problem compared to kids in the burbs. Just my opinion. This doesn't mean my guard will be down and it doesn't mean we will give him money, which we don't if I haven't already mentioned it. He asked me to take him to his bank to straighten it out as it is only in his name. I would never co sign anything with him, ever. I also told him if I find out he has lied again, skipped community service and misses school, he can say good bye to his concert ticket and will sell it to his friends. I also told him moving out sooner than he wants to maybe next if he doesn't straighten out and get his butt in gear. After our talk he asked if we could all go to dinner which we did and it was very pleasant instead of the usual downer. As long he I think he is smoking and if I drug test him and it is positive, he will not be driving. Tomorrow I am cancelling his insurance which is on our policy. I have to tell the insurance co. that he has moved out or they won't do it especially since he is an adult, ha ha. I've done this a few times. Whew. Thanks again for listening.
Ummm... no. I live in a City. In the middle of a higher-end "right-side-of-the-tracks" kind of neighborhood, and... we have drug deals going on behind our fence, on a periodic but recurring basis.
I think the only place that has less of a drug problem is the middle of nowhere - pioneer style, where the family has to be self-sufficent. You interact with other people? There's drugs around.
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AmericanGirl
Guest
I'd think long and hard about cancelling his insurance unless he has ZERO access to any vehicle titled in your name. My agent said if difficult child drove my car, even without my permission, that I could be held liable if he hurt anyone.
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Signorina
Guest
So long as we are on the subject-my difficult child is OFF our insurance and may not drive our cars. PERIOD.
He's a legal adult who smokes pot; which remains in the system for at least 30 days. Even if he is not "high" while driving, should he cause an accident, he WILL test + for THC. A local girl is now serving a jail sentence for manslaughter because she was driving & caused the accident that killed her best friend (who was not wearing a seatbelt) the 1st week of their senior year in HS. Though even the prosecution did not believe she was high the day of the accident, trace amounts of THC were in her system - hence the charges. She was lucky to negotiate a jail sentence w daytime school release instead of city prison. Should she violate the absolute sobriety-she goes to prison for 5 years. In the meantime, she & both sets of parents (divorced) & her dads business are being sued up the yin yang.
Long story longer-my difficult child WILL NOT drive my car. I know he occasionally drives friends cars & often drives his girlfriend's car. In my state, insurance follows the driver. I don't want my insurance "dinged" or even a suggestion of our liability should he crash a borrowed car. My conscience is clear-his girlfriend's family knows he uses, I told them. We severed his car privileges. I will not take the risk that his drug use could sink us financially.And I will not take the risk that he could hurt someone! Lock up the car keys, buy a club for the steering wheel.
He's a legal adult who smokes pot; which remains in the system for at least 30 days. Even if he is not "high" while driving, should he cause an accident, he WILL test + for THC. A local girl is now serving a jail sentence for manslaughter because she was driving & caused the accident that killed her best friend (who was not wearing a seatbelt) the 1st week of their senior year in HS. Though even the prosecution did not believe she was high the day of the accident, trace amounts of THC were in her system - hence the charges. She was lucky to negotiate a jail sentence w daytime school release instead of city prison. Should she violate the absolute sobriety-she goes to prison for 5 years. In the meantime, she & both sets of parents (divorced) & her dads business are being sued up the yin yang.
Long story longer-my difficult child WILL NOT drive my car. I know he occasionally drives friends cars & often drives his girlfriend's car. In my state, insurance follows the driver. I don't want my insurance "dinged" or even a suggestion of our liability should he crash a borrowed car. My conscience is clear-his girlfriend's family knows he uses, I told them. We severed his car privileges. I will not take the risk that his drug use could sink us financially.And I will not take the risk that he could hurt someone! Lock up the car keys, buy a club for the steering wheel.
vrigrl I don't want to sound a cynic and so if you don't think what I am going to say is helpful please ignore it. Be very careful because he may be telling you what he thinks you want to believe, that he wants to get his life in order, he wants to go to school, etc etc. From my experience they have a ready excuse for everything, they miss community service and they were helping out a friend in need, they skip school and they didn't study for test and didn't want to go and fail, he doesn't clean his room because he's depressed. I have heard every excuse and made up story imagineable. And when he's afraid you are on to him he plays nice and asks to go out to family dinner. It's all a ruse to continue doing what he wants, delaying the inevitable.
I'm sorry I am such a disbeliever but as long as he is using he is lying to everyone and has no intention of following the law let alone your rules.
Just be careful what you believe. I now have a rule that I don't believe anything my difficult child says unless she proves is beyond a shadow of a doubt, and even then I will always wonder.
Nancy
I'm sorry I am such a disbeliever but as long as he is using he is lying to everyone and has no intention of following the law let alone your rules.
Just be careful what you believe. I now have a rule that I don't believe anything my difficult child says unless she proves is beyond a shadow of a doubt, and even then I will always wonder.
Nancy
A
AmericanGirl
Guest
vrigrl please ignore me as well but I agree with Nancy.
My difficult child lied to me for a long time. He knew all the right buttons to push - even said things like he was trying to help a friend get off drugs. Criticized people who did the things he was doing and hiding from me. Looked like a teenaged saint. And I foolishly believed him.
I've recently seen my son clean and clear headed for the first time in a long time. The change was stunning.
If your son is using, you are talking to the drugs. The drugs are talking to you.
Hoping you can understand the spirit in which this post was made. I wish you and your son the best.
My difficult child lied to me for a long time. He knew all the right buttons to push - even said things like he was trying to help a friend get off drugs. Criticized people who did the things he was doing and hiding from me. Looked like a teenaged saint. And I foolishly believed him.
I've recently seen my son clean and clear headed for the first time in a long time. The change was stunning.
If your son is using, you are talking to the drugs. The drugs are talking to you.
Hoping you can understand the spirit in which this post was made. I wish you and your son the best.
To me - this exchange suggests that he did not feel that losing the car was a "consequence" because he continues to assume he gets to use whatever cars are available AND can have input on whatever you purchase next.
Based on what you've posted - I'm not sure he truly "gets it"...
pinevalley
Member
Vrigrl: I don't want to scare you, but your son sounds very much like my 18 year old son who is a drug addict. He was an expert at lying to me and everyone else in order to get what he wanted - more drugs. My difficult child used to tell me all the time (usually screaming this): "Why don't you just let me live my life the way that I want to?". He absolutely refused to go to school, and all he wanted was to hang out with druggie friends all day and use drugs. I had to learn the hard way that my sweet, caring son would lie and steal from me in order to get drugs. My difficult child could aMlso tell me exactly what I wanted to hear, that he really wanted to stop using but he would get help "tomorrow". He was always delaying going to rehab or getting any help for his drug problem, and I thought that I was helping him by giving him just one more day before he went to rehab. I finally learned that my difficult child was lying to me all the time, and he had no intention of getting help for his drug problem. He continued to use drugs, and he eventually started stealing from other people and was arrested. My 18 year old son is now in jail facing three felony charges, all because he refused to get help for his drug use.
I sincerely hope that your difficult child does not end up in jail, but please be very cautious about believing everything that your difficult child says to you. The next time that your difficult child misses one of his community service days I guarantee that he will have a very good excuse for not doing what he was supposed to do. But you have given him your expectations that he must meet, and you must follow through with what you promised. Don't believe any of his excuses, because he will say anything at all in order to get what he wants. HUGS....
I sincerely hope that your difficult child does not end up in jail, but please be very cautious about believing everything that your difficult child says to you. The next time that your difficult child misses one of his community service days I guarantee that he will have a very good excuse for not doing what he was supposed to do. But you have given him your expectations that he must meet, and you must follow through with what you promised. Don't believe any of his excuses, because he will say anything at all in order to get what he wants. HUGS....
exhausted
Active Member
I have to agree with the others. It's hard in these early stages of dealing with drug use to believe your kid would work you over (been there done that). Based on his response to the car lose (which would have been huge for most kids), I think he doesn't get the severity of his situation. One year of clean drug tests and after graduating from a program, maybe, just maybe....
Our difficult child will in no way even get a drivers license. We won't sign. She will have to pay for drivers ed. on her own when she hits 18 and take care of it all. The risk to other people is to high. I could not live with myself if I participated in her hurting anyone because she was using and because she is impulsive (part of her mental health issues). ADHD kids who are unmedicated are impulsive and make even worse decisions on the road than "normal" teens. Driving is an earned privaledge and I think to many kids have licenses who should not-they are just plain immature.
Our difficult child will in no way even get a drivers license. We won't sign. She will have to pay for drivers ed. on her own when she hits 18 and take care of it all. The risk to other people is to high. I could not live with myself if I participated in her hurting anyone because she was using and because she is impulsive (part of her mental health issues). ADHD kids who are unmedicated are impulsive and make even worse decisions on the road than "normal" teens. Driving is an earned privaledge and I think to many kids have licenses who should not-they are just plain immature.
I understand what you are all forewarning me about and I will take what I believe applies to our situation. We have not gone through the horrors that many of you have and I pray to god we never do as the pain I feel when I read your stories is just heart breaking. We have a therapist lined up for him in a few weeks and he started Wellbutrin yesterday. He's been doing his homework for a change and going to community service after school today. I truly do not think my son is an addict. He has no money to buy anything, he has no car to deal, he does not steal and never has from us or anyone else. My husband leaves his wallet on the table in the kitchen and nothing has ever been taken or from me. I remember kids smoked pot when I was in Jr. High and High School. Am I happy about it, no, but one thing I can say is pot or no pot, my son has not changed his habits or behavior as far as laziness and his lack of motivation towards school since he was a little kid so I cannot blame smoking for this. This is the reason we had him tested for ADD in eighth grade. It truly is one day at a time here. Yesterday while he was out he called twice to let me know where he was, who he was with and what he was doing and when I could expect him home which was much earlier than usual. This is what I mean by one day at a time. R
Really looking forward to him going to Israel in June. No pot, lot's of physical activity and hopefully some kind of religious connection that might make him feel more whole. The groups are protected by the Israeli Army also. Again, thank you for your concern and for listening when I lose it. I feel for all of you and the pain you are going through.
Really looking forward to him going to Israel in June. No pot, lot's of physical activity and hopefully some kind of religious connection that might make him feel more whole. The groups are protected by the Israeli Army also. Again, thank you for your concern and for listening when I lose it. I feel for all of you and the pain you are going through.
pinevalley
Member
vligrl: I am sending you my best wishes for dealing with your son like we all do - one day at a time. I really hope that your son can get his use of pot under control, and that he will take positive steps toward improving his life. You are a good mother, and I'm sure that you and your husband will have a positive influence on your son's life (even if he doesn't want to admit it right now!). That was a wonderful idea to get your son involved in the program in Israel this summer. He will learn a lot from this program, and you can have a break from the daily drama with your son.
Good luck, and keep posting here. HUGS....
Good luck, and keep posting here. HUGS....
S
Signorina
Guest
VG-and I mean this kindly...how much more evidence do you need to believe your son has a drug problem? Can you really say out loud with a straight face that believe the drug paraphernalia he blatantly left out in the open in his vehicle belongs to his friends?
My son is very much like yours. To my knowledge, he has not stolen from us, been behaviorally difficult (outside of norms) and he is often pleasant to be around. He is estranged for us because I am not going to pretend that smoking pot is ok with us and pretend that it is not having a detrimental effect on him and his future. Sure lots of ppl can be casual users & be successful. But my kid is not achieving success. Neither is yours. My kid would rather give up car use & college than to stop smoking pot. Sound familiar? My kid has let his pot use come between him and his family and we have lost the trust we shared because of the lies he tells about & to cover up his pot use. Marijuana is a major cause of amotivation. Don't close your eyes to the detrimental effect pot is having on your child. He's lost his car & he doesn't care!! He'd rather lose his car, his education & your relationship than to give up pot. If that's not a drug problem... What is?
I am here with a son like yours. He hasn't gone to rehab, he hasn't stolen, he can manage to get & keep jobs. FOR NOW. I have no doubt that unless my kid comes to his senses QUICKLY, he will fall to the depths of other difficult child's on this board. I can't really speak for my board sisters-but afaik-many of those difficult child's started out just like mine. And that's why I am here. As a reminder to be strong. That my BEST shot at getting my son healthy is for him to be willing to seek help which he WON'T unless he starts to feel the effects of his bad choices. And if I don't stand for something, I will fall for anything. So, I could pretend his pot use isn't a factor in his declining mediocracy and pretend to believe its a phase... And maybe I could've maintained the status quo for another year or so... Until it got too bad. And that was not something I was willing to do. I have younger kids, and that IS a factor in our choice to take a stand. But I also learned that every time I gave him a second chance; I actually lowered the bar. And the summer of 2011? I assumed his bristly new independence was typical "returning college student" and I thought i was placating the situation. Nope! Turns out I was giving him the control in our relationship/house. I wanted so much to be reasonable to my son-but my being reasonable fueled his sense of entitlement. That's the difference. PCs accept & are grateful for second chances and are willing to meet halfway.
Again, I am not trying to burst your bubble. And may I suggest a drug test for your son? I will happily eat my words and be truthfully joyous if your kid isn't using. Really. But you need to know-one way or the other.
{{hugs}}
I hope the trip to Israel helps your difficult child understand what is important. I truly hope your son does not have a more srious drug problem, but you will quickly find out if he does not have access to pot over there. I know you are a wonderful mom and you have shown how committed you are to keeping your son on the right track. I really admire how you took charge of the car situation so quickly.
We are here for you if you find that you need more support. Many of us hoped and prayed that our intial suspicions were just that, but they turned out to be much more. For many of us our difficult child's started with pot and moved on to worse. I hope your difficult child is different.
Nancy
We are here for you if you find that you need more support. Many of us hoped and prayed that our intial suspicions were just that, but they turned out to be much more. For many of us our difficult child's started with pot and moved on to worse. I hope your difficult child is different.
Nancy
