Snow White
On the Mad Tea Party Ride
Amann, another book that I found really helpful was, "When Your Adult Child Breaks Your Heart: Coping With Mental Illness, Substance Abuse, And The Problems That Tear Families Apart" by Joel Young.
Daughter not speaking to me
- Thread starter Mamacat
- Start date
Mamacat
Active Member
I'm feeling very sad tonight. I really miss my daughter and granddaughters. I just don't understand. So confusing. Sweet and caring. Then angry and hateful when she doesn't get what she wants. When I said no to a car last year about this time, she called me malicious and that I enjoyed seeing her suffer. What the heck? I've done everything I could do to help her. I don't even know who she is anymore. Then I did an amends letter (I think it's 4th step of CODA). She accepted my amends and all was well again. Then I gave (sold) her my car. Then everything was really great. She's quit so many jobs in the last 8 years, went through over $100.000 from the sale of a house. Ran up credit cards and threw them in the garbage when bills came. My blinders were on and I just made excuses for all this because shecould talk a good talk. So much psychobabble. It was amazing. Not to mention the church-going. All of these gave me hope, but now I feel so hopeless, confused, sad, angry. Don't know what to think. I hope my grand babies are okay. I hope they remember how much their grandma loves them and I would see them if I could. I hope my granddaughter has a birthday party. I hope my daughter gives her the gifts I sent. Thank y'all for listening.
I'm so sorry Amann, it is heartbreaking.
You did the best you could, and now that you know better, you'll do better. Many of our kids are master manipulators and we can be their number one 'prey'.......it takes us awhile to admit that and stop it, but when we do, it all changes. I saw a quote today, "Things don't change. WE change."
You're changing now and in the midst of it, there's sorrow, grief in letting go........it's sad.......be with the sorrow, it's part of all of this.......you will emerge out of it..........
Hang in there, you're not alone, we're all here with you.....
You did the best you could, and now that you know better, you'll do better. Many of our kids are master manipulators and we can be their number one 'prey'.......it takes us awhile to admit that and stop it, but when we do, it all changes. I saw a quote today, "Things don't change. WE change."
You're changing now and in the midst of it, there's sorrow, grief in letting go........it's sad.......be with the sorrow, it's part of all of this.......you will emerge out of it..........
Hang in there, you're not alone, we're all here with you.....
jetsam
Active Member
amann, I know you are feeling sad and missing your grand babies as i miss mine and my heart breaks for both of us. I can tell you that you are doing the right thing for not giving in to your daughters demands because if you do then she will know she has the power and continue to rule you! Don't let her do that to you. you are continuing to be strong and i admire you for that. your daughter needs to know you won't let yourself be brow beat by her nor will you let her hold your grandchildren as ransom. She has to respect your decisions. she doesn't have to like it, just respect that it is your decision.
Many times when i get sad I turn to my higher power. I try to remember that as my higher power watches over me, I know my son and my granddaughter have their own higher powers watching over them. We just have to give it up to our higher power and have faith. thats all we can do. try to be kind to yourself. do something you like tomorrow,something that will make you smile. Hugs going your way
Many times when i get sad I turn to my higher power. I try to remember that as my higher power watches over me, I know my son and my granddaughter have their own higher powers watching over them. We just have to give it up to our higher power and have faith. thats all we can do. try to be kind to yourself. do something you like tomorrow,something that will make you smile. Hugs going your way
Memedixie
Member
Amann, I am new here and have already found strength I wasn't sure I had. We have to be strong in our convictions in order to find the peace we deserve. The kind of pain that we experience from a difficult "lost" grown child is beyond painful. It is heartbreaking and I am going to seek a good support group to help me stay focused. It is so important for us to stay strong so we can protect our boundaries. We will get thru this together. ❤
BusynMember
Well-Known Member
If she is borderline they can be charming when you do what they like. They also get vicious if you don't. It never changes or makes sense.
I'm not sure why you made amends to your daughter. Sounds like she's the one who should be making amends to you. Does she care about you at all? Is she worried about you having money in your older years? If not...thats her being borderline and selfish. Are you okay with this? She's a bit old to expect you to buy anything for her let alone a car. we never bought any cars for our four, even when they were young. They bought their own.
I wish you luck. I hope you realize that your daughters behavior is horrible and that she can't sustain good behavior...it is not your fault. Please go live life aside from this daughter. She will bring nothing but take you on a wild roller coaster ride. Don't know about you, but I want peace now...I have no tolerance for rocky roads anymore. It's up to you to decide the rest of your life.
Hugs!!!
I'm not sure why you made amends to your daughter. Sounds like she's the one who should be making amends to you. Does she care about you at all? Is she worried about you having money in your older years? If not...thats her being borderline and selfish. Are you okay with this? She's a bit old to expect you to buy anything for her let alone a car. we never bought any cars for our four, even when they were young. They bought their own.
I wish you luck. I hope you realize that your daughters behavior is horrible and that she can't sustain good behavior...it is not your fault. Please go live life aside from this daughter. She will bring nothing but take you on a wild roller coaster ride. Don't know about you, but I want peace now...I have no tolerance for rocky roads anymore. It's up to you to decide the rest of your life.
Hugs!!!
Mamacat
Active Member
I made amends as part of working the 12 steps of codependents anonymous. All of the amends were from years when she was young including such things as my reaction when she told me she was date raped. Other situations with her dad. I know in my heart I did the best I could during those early years. Her dad left for another woman when she was 12. I didn't apologize for anything as an adult child. It's been a slow process to me really understanding how destructive her behavior is. I was kept sucked in for many years because of my granddaughters. She kept painting herself as the victim (2 abusive relationships) which I responded to with more help and rescuing. A lot of denial. I'm seeing it more clearly now. And I thank God that she's 1000 miles away and not speaking to me. It's giving me a chance to get off the roller coaster and really understand what's going on.
Mamacat
Active Member
I do want peace now. And you're right, Somewhere out there, she doesn't care. Recently after the last occurrence where I told her no, I finally told her that I'm tired and want peace in my life. And that she's an innovative woman who will find housing for herself (she wanted me to sign for apt.) And her response was "right on mom". To me, that means she doesn't care. Haven't heard from her since!
Mamacat
Active Member
I agree 100%. We are going to get through this. I too am building a support group and I'm so happy to have found this place where others understand. I want a life in my old age. I've been taking care of others forever. Now it's my time. That sounds selfish saying it, but it's true.
Memedixie
Member
I too have been manipulated by my granddaughter's aunt who ended up with custody of two of my son's children. Their mother (my troubled son's wife) died of an overdose and he was too sorry to step up and be there for them. She would akways discipline them by not letting them come to my house for a weekend sleepover. The girls and I were kept apart for so many stupid reasons .....I actually felt she was just plain evil. I could go on and on but just wanted you to know that I understand the pain you are feeling. Stay strong.
Mamacat
Active Member
Thanks for understanding. I know one day I'll see them again. I'm determined to stay strong and get my life back. I want peace and joy in the years ahead and it's in my power to make that happen. I would love to see my granddaughters, but for now that won't be happening.
BusynMember
Well-Known Member
Amman, this is a test to know if they care. And trust me I have one son who never says it. The question is,"Hi, mom, how are YOU doing?"
My son will call then when I answer instantly start a long monologue about his rotten life, never once asking about anyone else. In fact he is angry at and won't acknowledge his siblings because they are all chilly to him for treating them and me like trash. He REALLY abused my oldest daughter but wont admit it. Think the worst thing he could do...makes me ill. My other yjtee ate awesome
My son's child will not know he has aunts and uncles and cousins because he doesn't even know them. My son never tells anyone he has siblings so those St. Louis don't know. They were adopted, except him.
He says,"I should be an only child. You didn't need all those imports."
I shudder to think of my life without my other kids...they are so wonderful. If all i had was him it would be as if i had no children at all. I cherish them. My son...i love him, but I don't like him. Spending time with him is not fun. Imports. Sorry, but what a jerk. I don't feel that close to him, like I do the others.
Son cares about son. Nobody else.
My son will call then when I answer instantly start a long monologue about his rotten life, never once asking about anyone else. In fact he is angry at and won't acknowledge his siblings because they are all chilly to him for treating them and me like trash. He REALLY abused my oldest daughter but wont admit it. Think the worst thing he could do...makes me ill. My other yjtee ate awesome
My son's child will not know he has aunts and uncles and cousins because he doesn't even know them. My son never tells anyone he has siblings so those St. Louis don't know. They were adopted, except him.
He says,"I should be an only child. You didn't need all those imports."
I shudder to think of my life without my other kids...they are so wonderful. If all i had was him it would be as if i had no children at all. I cherish them. My son...i love him, but I don't like him. Spending time with him is not fun. Imports. Sorry, but what a jerk. I don't feel that close to him, like I do the others.
Son cares about son. Nobody else.
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Mamacat
Active Member
When she calls, she will usually start out telling me about what's goingon in her life. Depending on what's happening, I'll either hear about all the wonderful things that are happening, things that MAY lead to a job, wonderful people she's met, etc. Toward the end of the conversation she may ask how I'm doing. The other type of conversation is to tell me the awful things her significant other is doing. Sometimes she'll make a comment about her financial situation. She usually doesn't ask for help, but I volunteer. A friend in the mental health field called it "dry begging". Honestly sometimes she does ask how I'm doing, which leads me to think she does care, but then she'll turn around and not talk to me if I don't give her what she wants. She asked me recently if she could trust me. Her significant other contacted me to tell me that she won't leave him alone at work. She's moved to another state and now wants him to move there, when he's one of the reasons she left to begin with. He has a mom whose had a stroke and a son where he lives so he doesn't really want to move. I did offer him some advice like staying firm in what he needs for himself. By now he's probably told her my advice and that would also make her angry. I really didn't want to see him manipulated by her, which in hindsight was none of my business. It's so confusing because sometimes shedoes act like she cares, but it could be manipulation to get what she wants. Rarely do I have a call or text just to see how I'm doing.
Mamacat
Active Member
Well, I tried. Today was my oldest granddaughter's 8th birthday. First time I haven't been with her on her birthday. I sent a box of presents that arrived there last week. I sent it to her high school friend's house. It's the only address I had. I hope she got the box. I have no way of knowing. So today I sent a text asking to speask to granddaughter to wish her a happy birthday. No response. She may have blocked my number it's been 4 weeks since I said no to her request to sign for an apt. And I also told her how I have felt the last 8 to 10 years as I rescued her time after time, which I never didf. So I don't know what made her so mad, saying no or telling her how I felt.
BusynMember
Well-Known Member
With borderline, sadly they are NOT at all interested or touched by our heartfelt emotions. They are most apt to use them against us. They care that you didn't do what they wanted and that's it. My reading about this disorder makes me believe everyone actually does better when we engage very little and don't expose our raw emotions to them. They do not feel your feelings...they lack that ability. It is so hard on loved ones who keep trying to explain and to elicit normal emotions from our personality disordered relative. But sadly often the more we try to pour out our heart, the more hardened they become. They see it as a weakness and it makes them feel powerful over us. To oppose them or scold them just causes rage and they wont say you are right. More cause for revenge...there is no sane way to interact. They may suddenly be warm for a few weeks or months then implode the first time you oppose anything they say or ask for. It's lose/lose. If they don't admit being sick and try very hard in intensive therapy, the pattern doesn't change.
You have control only over yourself. You can decide to interact in a different way and much less...or the hurts will continue.
If I were you I would stop contact so she doesn't feel she is hurting you, which is the point of withholding the grandchildren. in my opinion it works better to let the latest drama (in her mind) wear off and see if she suddenly has a hot date and forgets about withholding her kids and asks for you to babysit.
in my opinion from reading it is best not to empower borderlines with your feelings. They aren't interested. You just get blamed anyway. You will never come to any lasting understanding with a borderline. They can't maintain stable emotions and when they go off they go off in every way. In a big, drama queen, hateful tornado sort of way.
I am sorry daughter is punishing you by withholding the kids. It is powerful and she knows it. Do read "Walking on Eggshells."
Hugs for all your pain. Do try to go on with your life. Your daughter will drive you crazy if you allow it. Be good to yourself. Detach.
You have control only over yourself. You can decide to interact in a different way and much less...or the hurts will continue.
If I were you I would stop contact so she doesn't feel she is hurting you, which is the point of withholding the grandchildren. in my opinion it works better to let the latest drama (in her mind) wear off and see if she suddenly has a hot date and forgets about withholding her kids and asks for you to babysit.
in my opinion from reading it is best not to empower borderlines with your feelings. They aren't interested. You just get blamed anyway. You will never come to any lasting understanding with a borderline. They can't maintain stable emotions and when they go off they go off in every way. In a big, drama queen, hateful tornado sort of way.
I am sorry daughter is punishing you by withholding the kids. It is powerful and she knows it. Do read "Walking on Eggshells."
Hugs for all your pain. Do try to go on with your life. Your daughter will drive you crazy if you allow it. Be good to yourself. Detach.
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Mamacat
Active Member
Wow, that's a lot to take in. My daughter has not been diagnosed with anything, but having read what you all post, I see a lot of similarities. There's definitely something not right with her. She's now about 1000 miles away from me, but she may be back with the last abuser by now. I don't want the girls to think I've abandoned them, therefore, I want to keep trying. It's definitely about the granddaughters for me. But I definitely hear what you're saying. I've been reading on borderline central and I think I read that, inspite of Borderline (BPD)'s bad behavior, attempts should be made to let them know they are loved. Did I read that wrong? Because i was close to sending her a text telling her I love her. I do love her I just won't be a part of her bad behavior anymore. I'm wiling to try what you said and completely cut off all communication. I know y'all have a lot of experience. I've also met a lady where I live who worked for social security approving people for disability. This is her field and she said the same thing. She may have blocked my number and I read on line how to test that, but I would have to call her and I don't wantto do that.
Mamacat
Active Member
Feeling sad tonight. Wishing my daughter and granddaughters were coming for Thanksgiving. Instead I'm not sure where they are. Haven't heard a word for almost 2 months. Not since I said NO to her request. So, there it is. I don't like it, but can't change it. I'll get off my pity potty soon
