I think I am ready now

[hearts and roses]

I think I'm ready for my fledglings to leave the nest now.

With all this practice I've had with detaching, I feel I'm truly ready for them to get out of our house!

Seriously, easy child is 22 and will be 23 come fall and she is such a b**ch and no help really around the house at all. She does work and go to school so she's not a slacker. difficult child is 20 and will be 21 come fall and while she IS helpful, she is unemployed and H and I are finding it just intolerable for her to be doing nothing with herself.

I don't want to toss them out or force them into a situation where they move in with their not so fantastic boyfriend's, but I do believe it's time to make it so miserable here that they want to leave and get prepared to do so.

Any ideas besides the obvious of giving a deadline? My parents just made it so hard to live at home we all fled!!!! Lol

 

[Karoline2010]

I think you are right!

 

[Doddlin]

Find some rooms for rent, maybe 3. Sit them down and let them choose one. Offer to pay 1st month and move them in.

 

[Hound dog]

Jo, make it uncomfortable enough and they will leave on their own. For the one who isn't working, give them LOTS of work to do around the house..........LOTS. When the complaints come, and they will, simply state that there is no such thing as a free lunch, someone has always got to pay the tab......... As for the other......pretty much the same thing. If that doesn't work, you'll have to set that deadline.

I set it with Nichole. When she went off the deep end I regretted it. But when I forced myself to look at it objectively, it would have happened if she had been living here........her being on her own didn't matter. And seriously, I don't think she'd have ever moved out if I'd not set the date.

And as for the deep end part that made me feel so guilty............Has turned out to be one of the best life learning experiences for her. She has grown up by leaps and bounds and finally left teenhood behind. She has finally "got" that her behavior affects everyone she cares about, not just herself. And she is no longer ruled by her moods or feelings. She now stops to think things thru and look at the potential consequences of her actions. She is a better mother to Aubrey, and a better partner to boyfriend. And she has become a joy to be around.

Nichole needed me to draw the line in the sand. The adult world frightened her too much to step out into it on her own.

Hugs

 

[susiestar]

Time to turn off the cable and internet except to rooms and times you and husband want them in. You can set up a router through a computer in your room such that internet is ONLY available with a password or at certain times. Stock the house with foods they are not fond of, esp foods you LOVE that they HATE. The stronger the smell the better.

Pile on the chores. Leave detailed lists daily. Include gross things like scrubbing the trash cans, cleaning the toilets, poop detail for the furbabies, etc... If you have cats, bathing them is an AWESOME chore if you want to drive the kids out. NO ONE likes bathing a cat. You can use your own allergy problems, say it was recommended to help with flea control, whatever.

Do you like music that they despise? Play it often and LOUD. Esp when they are trying to watch tv or have friends around or are sleeping.

Neck on the couch with husband. You probably won't have to do more than kiss to make them VERY uncomfortable. They are still young enough that the THOUGHT of you and husband being intimate is "gross" -- seeing you kiss will creep them out. Do it often. When they say something tell them that they are old enough to either get over it or get their own place.

Do either of them have pet peeves like seeing/hearing someone chew with their mouth open, hearing someone suck on their front teeth, certain smells, etc...? USE THEM!!!

What do they find gross? Certain shows? Hearing you talk about sex? I have one friend who just could NOT handle even hearing her mom talk about sex in general. Even talks about birth control, etc... upset her. When her mom felt it was time for daughter to move out or grow up the mom started taping Dr Ruth and that show with Sue somebody - Canadian lady - who is very frank about sex, toys, etc... - and the mom would make a point of watching them whenever daughter settled in to watch tv. Esp since the daughter would sit and complain through anything else. (The mom said that the upside of that was that she and her husband tried some new things talked about on the show, LOL. The mom is a good friend of mine also.)

Do your girls have their stuff all over the house? Box up whatever is in the common areas. Have them keep their stuff in their own rooms - and leave much of your stuff alone if possible. Do the girls ever go on trips? Gfgbro used to come "home" to my folks every Christmas. And stay until sometime between March and May. He did like to take off for a few days (meaning 3 days to 3 weeks with NO notice of when he was returning). My mom packed all his stuff up a couple of years when he would do that.

If they like to sleep in a room that isn't their bedroom, use it! On another thread I described some stuff my mom did to curb that when my bro did it as a kid. Painting his feet with tuna juice and locking the cat in was one thing. Painting his nails with a frosty champagne color and tossing all the remover was another. She did make sure his best friend told ALL gfgbro's friends about the nails. AND the guys on the construction crew he was working on. Another time she put strips of duct tape all over his hairy legs.

If you REALLY want to make someone mad put RIT dye in their shampoo. If they use strawberry shampoo add red dye. Blue dye is great in head and shoulders, etc... This works best if they have light or bleached hair. If their job would object it could be a HUGE deal. Or if they wouldn't handle it well. You want them out of the house, not your life after all.

You can wash all their clothes on HOT, or add bleach after the clothes are in. Make off the wall comments to their bfs and friends.

Have you ever seen the movie "How to Lose a Guy in 10 Days" with Kate Hudson and Matthew McConaughy? Some of those ideas might work. Esp the one where she walks into poker night and makes the guy blow his nose because no one likes mr sniffles.

I am willing to bet that looking over Step's house rules, thinking of the ideas in this thread, and pulling in your own creativity will work together to achieve your empty nest fairly soon. If you need other ideas you might watch the movie "Failure to Launch".

Many hugs!

ps. Start making them cover their phone bills, insurance, anything else you pay for and want to change. Just watch HOW you do it.

 

[hearts and roses]

Thanks Lisa,

I leave lists for difficult child to do everyday and she's usually pretty good about doing them. I just read in this morning's paper that the unemployment problems in our state are worsening. People are applying everywhere and still not getting hired. Places of business have Help Wanted signs up but then after difficult child applies, still nothing. And she's not alone. Apparently, this is all over the place - why? Because everyone wants employees with experience! How are they supposed to get experience if no one is willing to hire them? Argh. Makes me mad. If I owned a business, I would rather hire someone with minimal experience so I could train them to work as I want them to work, Know what I mean??

With easy child it's just pure frustration. The other day she asked if we would foot the bill for first and last month's rent if she found something. Um, that would be a NO. WTH? She should stop shopping at American Eagle for a month and she'd save over $300!! Her problem is she's never had it tough and now that she works, she thinks it's all easy street and tries to find ways in which she can say she's independent to us. H asked her when she's moving out after she made the crack about the apt. Seriously, if I had the money, at this point, I would put up the security for her to move out and never expect to see it again. And it's not because she's so difficult to live with - it's just her overall attitude that stinks. And she's mean to difficult child! I have actually been coaching difficult child on comebacks. difficult child has always looked up to her sister and when easy child asks her a favor with ridiculous expectations, difficult child is tongue tied. So we've been practicing reasonable responses and so far so good. It's taking easy child off guard, which is good because easy child is so used to getting her way with difficult child.

I am so impressed with the way things turned around for Nicole - and she has a baby!

Anyway, my original post was more or less a vent and as you can see, it's continued! easy child leaves for a week away to go visit her aunt in Virginia...and H and I can hardly wait for her to leave. We love her dearly, but the girl is spoiled. Thanks for listening to me. lol.

 

[Doddlin]

Ok.... here is what I did with difficult child#1. Make them pay you rent. Take the rent money for a few months and put it away but don't tell them. Then, when you have enough for first and last, help them find a room for rent outside the house. Tell them, "yes, I'll pay first and last". You have it and it came from them???

 

[hearts and roses]

Both of them already pay rent-measly $35/wk. At their ages and with how wasteful they are with my oil and electric I need their rent.

When they were in HS I used your plan of them giving me
money, I'd set it aside and when graduated or bought a car or went to college the money was theirs. But in my humble opinion those days are over.

easy child left for a weeks vaca and conveniently forgot to give me her $$, but I texted her and she said she will put it aside- she pays every 2 weeks so that's $70, nothing to sneeze at. She also went and blew another $100 at American Eagle today!! No, they have to figure how to budget on their own. With freedom comes responsibilty, you know?

And difficult child applied to 3 more jobs today. Fingers crossed!

 

[susiestar]

If you want easy child to ever move out you may have to insist she either pay more rent or she sit down and work out a budget and then stick to it. If she has a good job and can drop that kind of money on clothes on what sounds like a whim then you are doing her NO favors by allowing her to run up the household bills and pay none of them. I am sure she thinks she is WAY better at managing money than you are because she pays her "bills" and has all that money left over. You don't have any left and don't do all the luxury things she does so surely she is a better money manager than you. And if at her age she is better with money then SURELY she is just a better adult than you are.

I do NOT believe that nonsense, but I would bet dollars to donuts that on some level it is what SHE thinks.

It is time to figure out which bills she contributes to. She uses water so she should pay 1/4 of the water bill. She uses the electric so she should pay 1/4 of that bill. It is not unreasonable to insist she chip in for groceries, etc.... While you ARE her mother, she is STILL an adult who is working full time. As she clearly is not saving to move out, and she is telling you she is so independent of you, well, it is time to really let her have the independence. She can be independent of your budget by paying her share.

This moves her to more of a roommate status. It does NOT mean she gets to tell you what to do, or gets to trash the house (unless she chooses to pay for a cleaning service) or disrespect you. It is still YOUR house. You are just letting her have the independence that is healthy for her to have and that she is trying to get by her attitude.

Your financial arrangement with difficult child does not have to be the same. difficult child is several years younger, is not working but is actively seeking work, and quite frankly, difficult child's arrangements and rent are between you, husband and difficult child. They are not easy child's business. When difficult child is working and frittering lots of money away then you will do the same with her. Until then, easy child can be told to butt out.

It may sound harsh to charge easy child so much. You are her mother, supposed to take care of her, etc... All the stuff we do for them because they are our kids. It is not harsh at all. It is teaching easy child how to survive financially. It will be a huge help to her in the long run if you can teach her financial responsibility asap. Spending hundreds of dollars on clothing a month while you are living at home with mom and dad is NOT responsible. There is no way she should be taking nice vacations and buying lots of new stuff when I am pretty sure YOU are not in a position to do that. You have scrimped and saved for a lot of years to provide for her and to establish your career. YOU should have those nice things while she adjusts to living on what she earns.

Off my soapbox, hope that it made sense to you.

Hugs (and support even if you ignore me or tell me to blow it out my ears!)

 

[SearchingForRainbows]

We had to make all the arrangements in order to get difficult child 1 to move out. While he claimed he hated us and wanted to move as far away as possible from us, in reality, he had no intentions of leaving. He had no plans, no job, and just wanted to game 24/7. difficult child 1 had put us through so much HE77, was so headstrong, refused to accept responsibility for any of his actions, refused to help around the house, etc... that we knew the only way to help him and save ourselves was to get him into his own place. Natural consequences are the best teachers!!!

Anyway, he enrolled in our local community college and he took out student loans. We gave him first and last months rent. We found him a small apartment on a bus line not far from campus. husband cosigned his lease. We helped him move in. We told him he was on his own - better find a job!!!

To make a long story short, he did really well for almost a year. We were pleasantly shocked!!! He became polite, considerate, and believe it or not, fun to be around, lol... However, he has been headed in a downward spiral for the past several months. Still, sometimes we see glimpses of the responsible, considerate, fun to be around person he seemed to become. While we're concerned, there is NO way he'll be moving back in with us!!! ( I hope I'm just strong enough to stick to this if he becomes "homeless" at the end of the summer!!! DETACHMENT, DETACHMENT, DETACHMENT, etc...!!! I have to keep repeating this over and over again!!!)

I think that you should either make life so unbearable in your home that they voluntarily leave, or give them a deadline to move and stick to it no matter how tough it is for you to do this. You deserve to be able to relax, to be happy in your own home!!! ( I hope I can follow the advice I just gave to you, lol...!!!)

Thinking of you... SFR

 

[hearts and roses]

If push comes to shove, we of course would have to ask them to leave. To be honest, it is sometimes convenient to have them around, lol, to help with the dogs. I think things will naturally progress with easy child and she will likely move out sooner rather than later. She's ready to be on her own, she really is. It's finances. And I won't co-sign a lease ever again. I did that for her when she was in college and she ended up breaking the lease and I had to be really really nice to her landlady to make up for the immature way in which easy child and her then boyfriend handled things. It all turned out okay, but never again will I co-sign a lease whether for a car or apt. Mmm-mm, no way.

I think part of the reason I was at my wit's end when I originally posted had to do with what I realized was resentment I am carrying around towards easy child. You see, since she was 14 she'd had her sights set on attending the CIA to become a pastry chef/baker chef. We tried to get her to at least visit other schools where she could get a liberal arts degree with a major in culinary, but she refused. We allowed ourselves to be blinded by what was then her true easy child-ness and wanted to help her realize her dream, so I took out a parent plus loan for her freshman year ($20,000) and her dad (exh) took out one for her sophomore year ($25,000), not to mention all the out of pocket expenses totalling an additional $10,000. She acquired her associates and graduated. The original plan was to go back for her bachelors, but due to issues with then boyfriend and HS sweetheart, she moved back home. Since then she worked in the baking industry for a total of 9 months and then went back to her HS job as a daycare provider and has decided she wants to be a teacher. Fine, I guess. She enrolled in school and is now pursuing that teaching degree. What peeves me is that I will be paying off her original student loan for the culinary school until the year 2016 - $255/month; I'm paying on a dream long gone! I'm more upset with myself than her over this. The other day she said something about being independent and that we don't cover any of her expenses (I think I said this in my original post). Well, she's not exactly being honest there, is she? We are still paying for her education. And exh is still paying too (though I don't know how that's going since he's not working in over a year).

Like in the entitlement thread, she has this attitude that she owes no one. It's true that she pays her own car lease, insurance and pays me her measly rent, she is still living very cheaply and a little gratitude would be nice. Someone mentioned taking her money and putting it towards the student loan. In reality all the money I make and what the kids contribute just goes into the monthly pot and bills get paid. It's not like I'm using that money to go by myself clothing or out to eat, Know what I mean?? In fact, I usually hold aside their money and use it towards groceries.

And with difficult child, I don't mind her, she's actually pleasant to be around and we enjoy her a lot these days. We just want her to get a job so she can get a better car or go to school or both. Niether H nor I can stand laziness and that's what's up with her. What she needs is a job where they pay her to sleep! lol.

Again, just venting and thinking out loud. Thanks for all the input, it certainly helps me to reflect on things. I am thinking of raising the weekly rent to $50 beginning in August.

 

[witzend]

I'm with you on not co-signing anything. They're not responsible enough for that. Better to have them in your home than to be paying rent on a lease they have broken AND have them staying in your home!

 

[SearchingForRainbows]

I definitely agree with both of you about not co-signing a thing!!! In difficult child 1's case, he had NEVER held down a job or lived anywhere but in our house. No one would in their right mind would let him sign a lease by himself. We knew we were taking a big chance financially by having husband co-sign the lease, but at the time, it was one we were willing to take. Fortunately, his lease expires at the end of July. Although he has managed to pay his rent by himself to date, we will NEVER co-sign another thing!!!

hearts&roses, I'm just so sorry about all that money you wasted on easy child's education! I can understand why you did it. Don't beat yourself up over it. I know what a terrific mother you are from reading your posts. You want all the best for your easy child and you did everything you could to make her dream become a reality. You had no way of knowing she would change her mind about her career. It just bites that you're still paying on this loan!!! It gets me angry that your easy child doesn't appreciate the huge sacrifice you made for her. Well at least you know NEVER to help her financially like this again... Hugs... SFR