Newcomer to this site.

[HighlyStressed]

Suppossedly her DAD molested her, not her step dad.

I am sure she has neither prosopagnosia or autism. Unless there are types of autism I don't know about which is possible, I guess.


My current plan is as follows;
She has just recently seen a Psychiatrist and goes back in 2 weeks. We are waiting on teacher evaluations.
she will continue to see her counselor and I will continue to avoid ringing her figurative neck. I will try to obtain the
new cell phone I just found out she got. I will be putting a lock on my bedroom door. I will be speaking to her counselor to see if HE will try to make her understand that if she runs away again and won't come home that she WILL go into foster care and that would be of HER choosing and not MY choosing. I want her home. I also want him to point out to her that runnig away is rediculous. If she wants to leave she should get a job and a place and move out. Not run away. I am hoping he/we can change at least her mindset. She is not a fugitive. She doesn't need to e a runaway.

And yes, I have extensive documentation of her abuse by her dad from therapists to dss workers to doctors.

 

[klmno]

Is this a psychiatrist who actually spends a little time talking to you and her or one of those who only spends 5 mins with you? If he/she is a good one, I'd try talking to that person. While I wouldn't tell the people at school, I would make sure that any mental health professional who's dealing with you- as long as you are comfortable that they are competent- knows about the sexual abuse 'possibility'.

ETA: I forgot to say- your plan sounds pretty good to me. Others may have other ideas because my ideas didn't work with my son and I still haven't figured out what I should have done differently.

 

[buddy]

Well, klmno, we all have made plans that seemed great but for some reason just didn't pan out. We can only control so much, right? Your ideas are wonderful.

I think yours are too HS, you are thinking things thru and the DAD's abuse (if it happened before age 4 especially, but at any age) really explains a part of all this, doesn't it.... that easily can make a child lose all trust and confidence in the adults around them...even when surrounded with love from some of the adults.

Hang in there, you are doing well given the situation. Keep posting away..... many of us check the site a few times each day.

 

[HighlyStressed]

Both the psychiatrist and councilor seem ok at the minimum. The psychiatrist spent like 2 hours with us and seemed empathetic to what I was contending with and M was at peak mom-bashing so she (doctor) saw it firsthand. Actually had M leave the room so she could actually TALK to ME. the councellor at least was receptive/understanding wrt MY issues. I am guardedly optimistic but at least plan to give them a chance and see how things go. I told them of the ossibility/liklihood of abuse and will be bringing the documentation next meeting for them to review. She has only had 2 sessions so far with- this councelor and 1 with- doctor.

 

[klmno]

That all sounds good but what I'm not understanding is why they aren't recommending and getting her to someone who specializes in sexual trauma- ok, do an evaluation for it first but even that should be done by a specialist in childhood trauma. That is the part that isn't adding up to me.

 

[InsaneCdn]

Molested at a very young age?
That alone throws all the other dxes out the window.
Until this can be dealt with, there's no way to really know if there even IS anything else.

And then... then change in school results when older sister left?
There may have been more going on than you know about.

UGH. Parent's worst nightmare.

Wish I had more words of wisdom, but all I have is...
{{hugs}}

 

[JJJ]

And then... then change in school results when older sister left?
There may have been more going on than you know about.

UGH. Parent's worst nightmare.

Wish I had more words of wisdom, but all I have is...
{{hugs}}

This jumped out at me as a huge red flag. I suspect that dad/stepdad molested at least the older girl if not both girls and the older girl molested the younger one, likely for years.

I think an evaluation and counseling with a therapist that specializes in sexual abuse is critical.

 

[ksm]

This isn't thru the school. It is through a county subsidized mental health agency. There are places within a days drive but money is an issue. No insurance. Job hunting. She is on medicaid tho.

In our state, Medicaid will help pay for travel expenses for medical care. If that is the only reason that is stopping making the appointment out of town, please check in to it. KSM

 

[BusynMember]

If s he wets her bed and has killed animals...has she ever played with fire too?

Some horrible stuff has happened to her, but she seems like she has some antisocial personality traits too. Killing animals is very serious. You are probably best to get her treatment in an Residential Treatment Center (RTC). She needs very intensive treatment on many fronts and in my opinion it is better she get it away from home before she really goes off the rails and hurts somebody or ends up in jail. She could accuse your husband of sexual abuse even if he didn't do it both because of her past and the way she is... and then things will get very serious. Boys who were sexually abused tend to act out. Girls tend to falsely accuse. (((Hugs)))!!!

 

[HighlyStressed]

Molested at a very young age?
That alone throws all the other dxes out the window.
Until this can be dealt with, there's no way to really know if there even IS anything else.

And then... then change in school results when older sister left?
There may have been more going on than you know about.

{{hugs}}

I have wondered along those lines. Older daughter was 'the perfect child' for 15 years. Straight A Student, full scholarship to Emory, beautiful, athletic, extra curr activities, Til 15 or 16 then got a bad news boyfriend and changed almost overnight. Her prom was her, 4 guys and alcohol. i LaTER FOUND OUT SHE SNUCK HIM IN AT NIGHT AND HAD SEX with- HIM IN TOP BUNK WITH SIS BELOW. sHE CONTROLLED YOUNGER ONE AND YOUNGER ONE BLOSSOMED WHEN SHE LEFT. I found all kinds of kinky sex toys in her room. More recently, last year or 2 she has been calling M and telling her she doesn't have to listen to me and encoutraging her to run away. She did already once, ran to her sister her promptly called DSS to say I never worked a day in my life, I am mentally ill, I never filed police report for M missing an I beat M almost daily. And M's attitude towards boys just seems a bit off to me. NOT boy crazy. Criticizes almost all men amd the women who date them. Has had a major infatuation with- my friends son for about 3-4 years but he is not interested.

 

[DaisyFace]

Hello and welcome--

Yes, I also see big red flags for sexual abuse. I can't necessarily point the finger at a parent - but something is definitely off with big sister. Big sister having sex toys around, having sex with younger sis around, taking 4 guys to the prom - and all before the age of 17???? That's just not right...

I'll bet M has been exposed to things that would make your hair curl.

 

[HighlyStressed]

Actually, big sis was 18 at prom and took the guys to a motel room. But yes, I can't begin to imagine what Molly has been exposed to - no pun intended.

A big problem I have is my mother believing the girls are perfectly normal and that I just don't get teens. My brother is with her. They live 3 states away and interfere every chance they get. Both are teachers (mom is retired) and
and both are pushy in what they think is right.

Is it 'normal teen' to wet the bed at 16? And lay on it by choice?
To steal my jewelry and tools (I am a contractor and need them to make a living).
To hide dirty dishes and used san. pads in a hole in the wall where she peeled back the drywall?
To steal money from the bank and deny it to the cops when they say they have her on camera doing it? (It must be some other little girl she said to them.)
To tell me she will lie to me/steal from me whenever the urge strikes her because her wants and needs are so much more important to her than mine?
To call DSS in every county in this part of the state and lie on me?
To kill/steal my pets?

There is so much more....

When she robbed the bank I considered allowing the cops to put her in JDC. Among other options. My family classified me as 'despicable' for even considering that an option and I have been the bad guy ever since. My own mother has $$$ and has gone so far as to threaten to go to court to take my kids if I don't follow her advice on a perenting issue and/or disinherit me. She has told me they are materialistic enough that she can 'buy them right out from under me." They text her to say I am mean cause they have to clean their room and want to go to a friends or something and mother would call me at work screaming and yelling. When it would be my turn to talk she'd just hang up. REAL piece of work. Thankfully, I am adopted.

After all these years of M's defiance, disrespect, sense of entitlement and meanness I am hopeful to make some rogress with her in therapy. I am afraid I will wind up resenting her. I must admit to resenting J. Thankfully I didn't feel that way until after she left.

 

[InsaneCdn]

Is it 'normal teen' to wet the bed at 16? And lay on it by choice?

Short answer, is the answer you already know: no.

However... may not be that unusual given the background...

The rest of it?
Maybe some attachment/relationship issues?
Not the "abused/neglected from early childhood" kinds of attachment issues.
But...
If relationships got damaged at around age 4... you didn't know and so couldn't help...
The disconnect can be disasterous.

There's been several good discussions on the board lately about "insecure attachment".
Perhaps...
Because of events beyond YOUR control, she is hurting badly.
SHE has detached herself to some degree from you, because she (naturally, at that point) expected you to be able to keep her safe. And you couldn't. This is NOT cause for guilt - it isn't your fault either. But the "little girl" doesn't see that. So... she decides the only way to survive is to look out for herself... "its all about me". So much of the behavior is things that would go with this scenario.

For us - it was school problems.
It can be lots of things.
But... while you're getting to the bottom of things, it might pay to look at the relationship, the degree of attachment, and ways to re-build bridges.

 

[buddy]

My own mother has $$$ and has gone so far as to threaten to go to court to take my kids if I don't follow her advice

If anyone in my family said that my kid would be packed and plopped on their door step voluntarily! HOW long do you really think that would last??? BWaaaaahhhhahahahahahah

 

[BusynMember]

There is nothing typical teen about your daughter at all. I am wondering if she is still being abused by somebody since she is still wetting the bed. in my opinion even wondering about if she is typical teen shows that your mother is not in touch with reality and maybe had a hard life herself.

Your daughter is getting older and her birthfather has some serious issues and did bad stuff to her and likely also passed along some bad genes. You don't even know what she has gone through. I'm going to share a horrific story that our family went through because I think there are parallels between your daughter's behavior and THIS child...

Years ago we adopted an eleven year old boy who acted normal to adults. He was actually sexually abusing (not molesting...as in having sex) with my three year old and molesting my six year old son. He admitted it. He also admitted he had been doing it to other younger kids for years, although he had no memory himself of being sexually abused (obviously, he had been). He killed two of our dogs. He peed and pooped all over (we thought it was a new dog we had adopted). He set little fires in his room that the kids saw but that we didn't know about until after social services took him away. Our kids were so afraid of him that they said nothing as he promised to kill us all and "burn the house down" if they tattled. We found out when my daughter kept getting urinary tract infections and when our second dog was suddenly killed (we got suspicous of him...before that, we thought the first dog had been killed by "bad" kids who lived near us). It is painful and hard to type this and my fingers are shaking, and I only disclose this because this is what a life of abuse can do to somebody. It can make the victim an abuser and force him to have no conscience and no caring for what he does to others. This boy, after he was prosecuted in court for sexually assaulting a minor (he is a lifetime sexual predator and has to sign in, although he was only thirteen when he was prosecuted), went to a home for young sexual predators and, from all we hear, is out now and still causing trouble. Worse, he is married with two little girls and it scares me. He was diagnosed with Severe Reactive Attachment Disorder, Conduct Disorder, Emerging anti-social personality disorder. His hard life had made him dangerous to himself and to others. I don't want your daughter to get that bad or to get into so much trouble that she ends up in the k ind of trouble this young man is now in. When I read somebody's post where the child sounds a lot like this boy, I comment on it because I know how horrible it can get.

With lots of t herapy, my two kids that were abused by him are doing very well, BUT they got to see this boy punished and found guilty. He had to tell them it was his fault, not their fault (although I'm sure he didn't want to). My daughter feels like justice was done. There has to be therapy and closure. I don't know (nobody here does) if it is too late for your daughter to live a normal life and not hurt herself and maybe others (killing dogs is not a good sign). But maybe it is. I think she needs to be in an Residential Treatment Center (RTC) so she can be diagnosed, assessed, treated, and maybe medicated. Her sexual abuse MUST be addressed intensively. And if she is going down the road of her father, you really need to know for your own safety and those of others in the community too.

I am emotional about this, I know. but living through it is a nightmare. That is what first brought me to this board. So take what is useful in what I said and leave the rest, but please, please, please take her behavior as very serious and try to get her help. Does she still see this father? If so, he may still...please, find out all you can.

I apologize again if this was too emotional. There are three BIG RED FLAGS for a person who is at risk to become antisocial as an adult. We learned all this in therapy after this child had left. The three big red flags are a combination of peeing/pooping inappropriately, fascination with fire, and cruelty to animals.

((((Huggz))))) Please take care.

 

[HighlyStressed]

I agree and we have also started family counseling.

 

[HighlyStressed]

That's what my friends say! But Mom doesn't want her. She wants her to go to my brother and his wife. They don't have kids. They'd put up with her the year or 2 til she goes to collage. They are also 3 states away and I don't want her so far away to be more poisoned against me by these warped people.

 

[buddy]

Given what you are saying she is doing...the peeing etc.... i HIGHLY doubt they woudl put up with it for two years.... Funny how people change their tunes when they experience it themselves. But I do believe you that they are ugly and mean toward you and they still could turn it all into they only got that bad because of you..... I was not serious about it but you do get the craziness of the statement!

She does need help, and you will have to decide if YOUr need to have her close is worth the risk (and I dont mean this mean at all, really... i weigh things all the time and i choose many things others would not choose) .... risks being that in future she will do something that is really really serious and you will not be able to see her at all or very very rarely. i am in a big city but still had my son in a hosptial that was nearly an hour away.... i went daily and I had NO money for that but people helped out.... I know that was much shorter term... but there is money through medicaid for travel to medical appointments etc... so especially when they order you to go for family time etc.. you should bet expense money for that.

 

[HighlyStressed]

Yes, the McDonald triad. Her father has NO contact but she is in constant touch with- her sis. I live in a good old boys area and am an outsider. Despite DSS and therapists saying he abused them the judge ordered visitation to continue. He finally left the state when his b/f (also his divorce lawyer) died of a brain tumor.

ALL of it is useful. If not directly relevant, a referance at least.

I am glad your 2 are doing better. How horrible.

I notice alot of animal lovers here. Shows the compassion. It is weird that M doesn't actively enagge in cruelty to the animals, more passive. I tell her don't do something and tell her why - don't tie it up by it's chain collar, it can hang - she does it behind my back til something bad happens. Don't leave it loose outside, it'll get hit... that type of thing.

Thank you for sharing. I understand the emotional turmoil and difficulty firsthand.

 

[BusynMember]

This child acted as if he loved animals to our faces. He killed them behind our back. The first one he killed and found, he was hysterical with screaming and screeching like he was in agony at the loss of our dog. The second time he "found" it again...and we called the cops and he made us face the fact. Later, in the Residential Treatment Center (RTC), he admitted it.

I am so sorry. I do agree with buddy. The need to be close to your child may not be as important as her need to get help. Otherwise, you could lose her against your will. Please keep us posted.