sentenced to one year.......

Well I went to see him. He wasnt crying. He is still very decided about the way he wants to live. He still needs his Xanax. He wants to go to NA meetings but not a lock down rehab. He wants to get a job and save money to buy a moped. He asked if he could come home - I did not answer - I said most of the time it did not work and that he needed to find his own place. I wish he could find a cheap apartment somewhere and have a roommate and live how ever he wants. He said he would be alright not to worry about him. I dont believe any of what he said - he still trys to make excuses for the reason he is behind bars. So I am just done and I wont obsess about it. He may die and I know that - I just hate to think about it.
 

witzend

Well-Known Member
Susan, I know that you know that the appropriate answer to his asking to come home was "no". When you tease him with "it never worked out before" you give him permission to wear you down. Are you afraid that he is going to yell at you? Or is it that he might hate you? Or that he thinks you will hate him if you say no? Let me tell you something. He doesn't care about you one tenth as much as he cares about xanax. You are just a means to an end. Look at it this way - if you had said "no", he could have moved on to finding someplace of his own to go to. You prevented that, because he knows there's a chance that he can come home, do drugs in your home, steal from you with little consequence, and not have to get a job. It's the cushiest offer out there, and he's not going to look for anything else when there's a good chance you're going to cave. If you said "maybe" in person, "no" in a letter won't work. You have to have the guts to look him in the eye and say "No."

Did you go to your Al-Anon meeting today? If you had, you probably would not have gone to see him, or if you did, you would have stood up for yourself. I think you need to go. Tell them that you don't want him home and you don't know how to help him. They'll help you out more than we can.

Again, I'm very frustrated that you tell us that we are so helpful and that we have such great ideas as to how to not get sucked in by him and how to help him help himself, and then you go to see him without a plan, and you don't tell him he can't come home.
 

meowbunny

New Member
I truly understand your going to see him. I know that no matter how hard it would be, I would see my daughter. I would want to give her what comfort I could, let her know that I was still her mother and that I loved her. So, I'm probably the oddball on this way, but I totally agree with you seeing him.

I also think Witz is right that you simply should have told him "no" when he asked about coming home. I can only imagine how hard that no would be to get out -- I know how hard it was for me to tell mine that she couldn't come home when her friends had had enough of her behavior. It hurt. I felt like I was tearing my heart out. When I got off the phone, I sobbed for 3 hours non-stop. At the same time, I knew it was what I had to say. She could not treat our home as a revolving door in between "friends." She needed to understand that coming truly meant following the rules and that if the rules were broken, she would be moving out (which is what ultimately happened).

Your son needs to know that so long as he is using drugs, does not complete an in-patient rehab program, he cannot come home. Like my daughter, he needs to hear it. They are two that need things explicity spelled out. Anything less gives them an excuse to interpret things their own way.
 

scent of cedar

New Member
It was hard for me to say those words, too. The reason it was hard to say no had nothing to do with difficult child. It had to do with me. Until I knew in my own heart that helping difficult child was only helping his addiction to destroy him, I just could not make those words, "You cannot live at home." come out of my mouth.

"No, I will not send money." was pretty hard to say, too.

When we were in your situation, I would convince myself that I could allow difficult child home for just a few days. Then, I would convince myself that this time, things would be better ~ or that I was strong enough now to do what needed to be done when the necessity arose.

None of those things were true.

The thing that makes it all so hard is that the child (however old he is) IS serious, some of the time, about wanting his life to go in a different direction. What we have to make ourselves remember though is that it is the addiction, not the child, that is in control.

And the last thing that addiction wants is a different path or a better life.

Once the addiction is beat, your son will not need your help.

Until the addiction is beat, helping is not helping.

So, the only answer any of us can give our addicted kids, however old they are (my son just turned thirty-three) is NO.

Literally, everything we give them while they are addicted serves the addiction.

It is never going to get any easier to say no, Susan.

You have to do it, anyway.

Helping your son stay addicted, sympathizing with him over withdrawal, pretending with him that the addiction is only to prescription drugs ~ all those actions are bad things.

When your son tells you about Xanax, tell him he can never use that ~ or any addictive drug ~ again. Take that opportunity to tell him it was the addiction that got him where he is, and that using drugs of any kind will see his life destroyed.

Then, tell him you love him too much to help him destroy himself or to watch him do it.

He isn't going to like that.

You have to do it, anyway.

Unless we prepare ahead of time, unless (for me, anyway) I envision the worst case and believe that to be true, whatever difficult child says...I get sucked back in, too.

The moped thing is a manipulation, Stands.

A moped is something you might believe would make it possible for a kid to find work and start heading into the right direction in his life.

And that day may come.

But it cannot come until he proves himself, first.

Nothing can come until he proves himself, first.

Nothing.

Because that moped could be sold for drugs, too. Worse yet, it is the first chink in your armor. This isn't about how much to help, it's about understanding that any help we give the kids services the addiction.

I still question how much not to help, I still catch myself wanting to believe that, somehow, difficult child means what he says ~ even if I KNOW he is using.

I agree that "NO" is the word the kids need to hear if they are ever going to take responsibility for themselves.

It's incredibly hard to speak it, though.

Barbara

P.S. We are not hearing so much from difficult child, these days. The last time we did hear from him...the old patterns were becoming increasingly evident.

All we can tell ourselves, like you and your husband may need to learn too, Stands, is that difficult child tried and didn't make it.

He came close, though.

Addiction is a terrible thing.
 
Yes it is hard. I dont want to help his addiction. I did tell him about the Xanax and how that drug helped him get where he is - that it is used to barter, sell, take and who knows what else. I said why do yu want something you are addicted to thatgets you in trouble - he said he would take it as prescribed and that ithelped him stay calm! that is a lie. I cant believe he can still think that - I just stood there thinking he has not changed at all - and that eventually I will have to let him go and do drugs by himself - I cannot help him anymore - what a waste! I will tell him that - unless he stops using pot, xanax and wants to live by our rules - go to a rehab - he cant live at home - I am not going around that merry go round again.
 

Hound dog

Nana's are Beautiful
Susan

My best friend is an addict. She moved from alcohol to prescription narcatics and psychiatric medications. When that wasn't enough, she progressed to heorine. It has been horrible to watch this once bright, funny, intelligent woman turn into a person who only cares about her next fix.

She's not what typically comes to mind when you think of a heroine addict. Not yet, anyway.

She's called me telling me her kids were starving. I took them some spare food from my pantry. I did this a couple of times believing it was ok because I wasn't giving her money. Then it hit me. If I was her safety net to feed her kids when she blew all her money for drugs, what difference did it make? I was still helping her to buy them.

The last 2 times she's called to tell me they're starving I've said I'm sorry but I can't help you. Followed by if you don't spend all your money on drugs there would be plenty for food.

She called me begging for 20.00 for gas to get to work. My answer was No.

It was one of the hardest things I've ever had to do.

This woman is my best friend. I love her like a sister. Once we were very very close. Now the drug and her next fix is the center of her universe. Her husband doesn't matter. Her kids don't matter. (except superficially) And I don't matter. Just getting the next dose of that drug. And if she can't get heroine, then how to get something that is close. She will do anything, say anything to appease those around her. It doesn't matter if she lies, because the drug is all that matters. She will tell you exactly what you want to hear, while doing exactly what she wants to do. Because the drug is the center of her universe. You mean nothing.

This is how an addict thinks while the drug has them in their grip. It's hard for us to get that because we know the person who came before the addict.

Twice now she has supposedly attempted to come off the herione. No go. She might have stopped herione, but smoking pot and chomping down vicodin and percocets by the handful is still using.

I won't fall for it again.

I don't call her anymore. I do answer when she calls. (there is always that faint hope) But I let 90 percent of what she says run straight thru. Until she is clean and sober, she is not the person I used to know as my best friend. She is an addict.

You need to practice telling your son No. Stand in front of a mirror if you have to. But No is the only way you can help him. When I read your post, even I got the impression you might consider letting him return home. Yes, I know you put limits on that. But you have to remember, an addict will do anything, say anything to get what they want.

He won't understand while he's an addict. But when he's clean and sober, he will.

(((hugs)))
 
Right now I feel like I have lost the person in him I knew. I feel he has lost his heart. Sometimes I just dont know if he will ever been clean and sober again. He doesnt seem to want to be. He will be going to prison for about 6 months. I worry about him but I have to give it up. I will go on with my life the best I can and savor the years I had with him and thank God for them. I know I sound sappy but sometimes this whole thing just gets to me. I was strong yesterday when I went to see him and he was strong standing there basically telling me the way he wants to live. I will say to him that no you cannot come home if this is the way you are going to live. You need to find somewhere else to be. Only with the help of God will I be able to do that.
 

witzend

Well-Known Member
Susan, you have indeed lost that person. It's like that addict climbs into your son's skin and speaks to you in your son's voice to try to trick you into helping him stay a junkie. I think you are right to tell him that he can not come home if that is the way he wants to live, but I think that there is a stronger way to word it, because that person in your son's skin will tell you he will change or can control it. Instead, tell him "You can't come back until you aren't living that way any more." Susan, seriously, he can't ever do xanax again.

Saying that he will only take it with a prescription is a lie to himself and a lie to any doctor foolish enough to give it to him. Rush Limbaugh is a great example of this. He had one prescription for oxicodone, and got hooked, so he got 5 more, and that is where he got in trouble. Cindy McCain is another example. She had prescriptions for percocet and vicodin, to which she became addicted. Eventually doctors stopped prescribing for her, and she stole drugs because she had the connections to do so. Just like them, your son got into trouble when he started to have problems getting the prescriptions and using them in a therapeutic way.

You see, really, the legal problems often come when the doctors stop writing the prescriptions, or when the patient needs more than the doctor will write the prescription for. And it's not just people like your son, it's people that we all think that we know and that we all assume would never do anything like that. It's very easy to get into trouble with it, and very hard to get out. But neither Rush Limbaugh or Cindy McCain will tell you that they will ever get a prescription again, or try to tell you that they can keep it under control, because everyone knows that they can't control it. It controls them.
 

Abbey

Spork Queen
Gosh...I wish I had great advice, but you've already received it. It's hard to watch someone be a train wreck, especially if it is your child. But, at some point you need to step back and let them make their way. It could be painful and good, or it could be bad. YOU have to be the one to except the consequences of your choice. I think that is where you are at.

Six months in prison is nothing. He'll get food, a place to sleep and excercise.

I learned long ago I could not deal with difficult child's behavior....drugs, stealing, 3 prison terms, Residential Treatment Center (RTC)'s, etc. I chose to let go, but I also knew that there was a pretty good chance of him killing himself. Is that comfortable? Absolutely not. But, he's scraping the streets to make a new life now. He's still alive at 25, but don't know how long. It's his choices now, not mine. You do what you have to do.

I wish you well.

Abbey
 
Well according to the public defenders office they gave him credit for 10 months and he wont be staying in prison even a month. They said they would just process him in and release him - that means - that I wish he had somewhere to go - I wish the State of South Carolina had a place where people could go to get there lives together but I know what you are going to say - he doesnt want to - he wants to keep living like he did - oh please pray for me - I plan on paying my therapist tomorrow - I am going to see her very soon - thanks
 

witzend

Well-Known Member
They said they would just process him in and release him - that means - that I wish he had somewhere to go -

He does have someplace to go. It's up to him where it is. He can start with an AA meeting, or a Narc-Anon meeting the minute he walks out the door of the prison. They can help him. You can not.

I hope you will see your therapist as soon as you can.
 

DammitJanet

Well-Known Member
This is what I was afraid of for you. Some doctor's do have help available for those leaving prison or jail. He would have to ask but then again, he probably doesnt want to. Look up a place online called the Durham Mission. It takes in homeless people and they have to get jobs, do drug testing...etc. They will help him find a job and then a place to live after a certain period of time proving himself. Its at least something. You may have something like it in SC.
 

CrazyinVA

Well-Known Member
Staff member
Be sure and call your sponsor in the meantime, Stands. I'm sure she can help you come up with some strategies for saying NO . when the inevitable question of living with you comes up again. The sooner the better, once he knows your home is not an option, he will have to figure out what to do next. Better to deal with that now, instead of the on the day he is released.
 

goldenguru

Active Member
(Edited out identifying info- Suz)

Not sure if this is a residential center - but they have many inpatient facilities around the country. They are free of charge - and have very good turn around rates. My brother in law attended one for over a year. It was by far the best drug program he attended.

Stands - I think I shared my brother in law's story once. But, if you ever need to hear it again - I'll be glad to share it. If you don't stop enabling your son, he will be my brother in law's age and still addicted.

I'm sorry for you. I'm sorry for him.
 

Suz

(the future) MRS. GERE
Stands, since we don't post identifying info publicly, I removed it from goldenguru's post above and sent it to you in a Private Message. Please look for it there. :)

Suz
 

witzend

Well-Known Member
Stands -

Remember what Ann Landers always used to say.

"NO IS A COMPLETE SENTENCE."

You don't owe your son an explanation about anything. He's a grown man dealing with his own choices. When he asks if he can come home, if the answer is no, just say "no". If he asks why, you don't have to say anything, but if you feel you must, you can tell him "Because that is what I decided."

It's not about him. It's about you. He gets to choose how he lives his life, and you get to choose how you live yours. If you choose to not live in his drama, he doesn't come home. If you choose to live in his drama, you can do that too, but you don't get to complain or worry, because that is the life you are choosing.

The other thing that I always add to Ann Landers advice is,

"I'M A GROWN-UP and I CAN CHANGE MY MIND IF I WANT TO."

If you want to buy into his lie and let him come home, you can always kick him back out again if you decide that you made a mistake.
 
Well he is in South Carolina Department of Corrections now. He went today. His picture and everything is not posted yet. I went to Alanon and took my youngest son with me. He is very wise. I just cant believe this is happening again. Please pray for me that I will be what I should be. Sometimes I just feel numb. I cant believe he doesnt want to get help. Some people in Alanon sent their son to a place that cost a lot. It is a four week program. Sometimes I wonder if I had sent my son to an expensive place it would have made a difference. Their son is scared of going back to jail = my son acts like he doesnt mind it - it has become second nature to him - it has almost become second nature to me - I am not as torn up as I was the last time = maybe it is because I dread him getting out = I feel like calling someone down there and saying he has a drug problem could you please send him somewhere besides home!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
 

witzend

Well-Known Member
I hope that you will go to Al-Anon again tomorrow, and tell them your concerns.

Perhaps you could start a new thread?
 
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