Update on 28 yo son

[Beta]

J has called us a couple times lately to berate us and blame us for not being willing to co-sign on a car loan for him. His mind seems to be on a "track," where he goes on and on about how the times we moved from one place to another (my husband is a pastor) and how selfish we are, how cowardly we are, etc. etc.

He works temp jobs because he can't hold a permanent job. Now he just lost a temp job the other day because he got into a fight with someone and he can't work there anymore. I have pleaded with him over and over lately to either get help in Denver at their mental health center or come here and let us find some help for him. He just goes back to the same rants, over and over, blaming us for his life problems. I asked him by text message this morning what he will do for work if no one will hire him. "I'll commit crimes," was his response. When I told him that bad things happen in jail and prison, he just said that he "doesn't care about jail but he's trying to avoid prison".

I am so frightened that he will either get hurt or he will hurt someone himself in a fight. I told my husband last night that everyday I'm just "waiting for the boom to fall." That's what everyday feels like. I have some intermittent days when I get busy and distracted and can be emotionally detached, but then there are days like today when I feel like I just can't deal with it anymore. The pain just keeps going on and on and I don't see any end to it. We could change our numbers and turn off his cell service, but I just can't bring myself to do that--it's too final. Sometimes I wish he would just go away, or even that he was dead, which is a terrible thing to think because once someone is dead, there's no hope. As long as they are alive, there is hope that they will change.
I just needed to tell someone how I'm feeling right now. Thanks for listening.

 

[BusynMember]

You did nothing wrong. A lot of kids move around a lot. So what? They are not all living a bad life. Dont let him guilt you. They try that to guilt us into giving them money. Dont help your son get a car. He can kill himself or someone else if intoxicated. He doesnt need a car. At his age he can work more and buy his own used car.

Your son needs in my opinion to find his own mental healthcare if he wants it. You may want to tell your son that jail is a step to prison. My daughter is a Corrections Officer and at least here jail is worse than prison. This probably wont deter him but you can try. If he doesnt mind breaking the law and wont go for help.... sadly your hands are tied.

Have you done anything for yourself lately? Do you have other loved ones to hang out with and lean on? Good friends from church? Hobbies? Have you ever been in therapy for just yourself or you and your husband? Any other children?

You matter. Please dont let this stress you out to the point that you get ill. Remember the Serenity Prayer. So powerful in its content.

God grant me the serenity to accept the things I can not change,
The courage to change the things I can,
And the wisdom to know the difference.

Love abd light!

 

[Beta]

Thanks SWOT. He just called again a moment ago to harass me, calling me a "F---ing moron. I bounce back and forth emotionally between wanting my son back and wanting him to get out of our lives forever. It's such a rollercoaster.
Yes, we have friends from church to lean on and I have many hobbies. I would love to see a therapist, but it's not in the budget. We have a younger son who is doing well and with whom we have a good relationship, praise God for that. I know I need to get a handle on this because it is emotionally draining and disabling. I would never commit suicide because it goes against what I believe and I would never want to hurt my family, but there are moments I just want to be dead, just to make it stop. It's hard to believe that the person who we once thought was the greatest blessing in our lives has turned into a stranger who is a nightmare. It just makes the years of love and sacrifice seem meaningless. Anyway, just some thoughts in my head today. I'll be okay, just needed to write it down and express it with people who really understand it well.

 

[Elsi]

You're doing the right thing holding firm. I will NEVER co-sign on anything for any of my kids. (My one exception was E's undergrad student loans, which were not large since her scholarships covered most, and she is a responsible kid.) For my wayward ones, I know co-sign would mean I'm going to either end up paying for all of it, or accept that my credit rating is going to be trashed. Their dad already did that to me once and I've worked way, way too hard to rebuild to let that happen again. I don't do loans to my kids, period. If I can't afford to make it a gift outright, with no expectation I'll ever get it back, I don't do it.

I'm so sorry he's treating you so poorly. There is no excuse. Military kids and plenty of others get moved around a lot and do fine. If that's the best he's got to hold over your head, he's got nothing. And as an adult, he is responsible for his own circumstances, regardless of what kind of upbringing he had or what you did or did not do for him growing up. It sounds like you gave him a loving home and did everything you could for him, but even kids growing up in abusive households or extreme neglect eventually must learn to take responsibility for their own lives. His thinking that you somehow "owe" him a car, or anything else, is extremely entitled and off base.

His "well, I guess I'll go live a life of crime, then" response sounds to me like more manipulation. Something to try to shock you. He wants you to feel sorry for him or feel shocked into giving him what he wants to try to prevent this outcome. And if he is serious and goes down this path, it is his decision and not a reflection on you or your husband.

terrible thing to think because once someone is dead, there's no hope. As long as they are alive, there is hope that they will change.

I know it feels shocking to have this go through your mind, but I understand. Hope is a double-edged sword. It can keep us going, but it also can keep us in limbo and keep us from moving on with our lives. When we are still holding out hope, there is no closure. Each tiny move towards progress rekindles our hope and sends it blazing, and then we find that hope dashed over and over and over again as they keep making the same bad choices. It can be excruciating.

I would never commit suicide because it goes against what I believe and I would never want to hurt my family, but there are moments I just want to be dead, just to make it stop.

I think this gets to the heart of the work we are doing on this board. Learning to live, and to want to live, regardless of what is happening with our children. To learn to let go of the pain and find joy in our own lives again. This is what I want for you, Beta.

I think for me I've had to bury my hope to let go of the pain. I have to live with no expectation for my two wayward children, and accept that I have no control over their choices or their outcomes. One or both of them may end up in prison. One or both of them may precede me in death. I can't control it. Burying myself in worry or pain does not change it. I have to give myself permission to live, regardless of what is or isn't happening with them. I'm better at this some days than others. Some days, like yesterday, something knocks me out of equilibrium. Some days one of them gives me a reason to rekindle hope and I find myself back in the FOG again.

I hope you can find a way to make therapy happen, even if it is only a few sessions. If you had a broken leg, you would see a doctor, even if it isn't in the budget. Our mental health is no different. If you are feeling this sad on a regular basis, you need to make yourself a priority. If you have insurance, see what it will cover and what your copays would be. If you don't have insurance that covers mental health (as a freelancer, I don't) see if there are low-cost options that charge on a sliding scale or allow you to make payments. It doesn't have to be an indefinite time with lots of sessions. I found a half dozen sessions with a therapist trained in Cognitive Behavioral Therapy (CBT) helped tremendously. I don't go regularly now, but can go in for an occasional "tune-up" if I am having an especially tough time with something.

It just makes the years of love and sacrifice seem meaningless.

I know. I have, for years, described parenting my wayward ones, most especially S, as pouring love into a bottomless cup. It feels sometimes like everything I have done is useless and wasted. But I don't really believe that. I can't believe it. I don't think love is ever wasted, even if we don't see the fruits at a given time. I have to believe that the seeds are still there somewhere, waiting to grow at the right time, when they are ready. And if they never grow, love is still valuable for itself, even if there is no visible result.

Big hugs to you, Beta. Take care of yourself.

 

[Tanya M]

Hi Beta, I'm so glad you reached out to us.

J has called us a couple times lately to berate us and blame us for not being willing to co-sign on a car loan for him. His mind seems to be on a "track," where he goes on and on about how the times we moved from one place to another (my husband is a pastor) and how selfish we are, how cowardly we are, etc. etc.

Your son is using guilt as a manipulation tool. He is counting on making you feel bad and responsible for the poor choices he made. He's counting on you caving in and giving him what he wants.
My son has done the same thing with me and my husband. This is just what our difficult adult children do. They refuse to take responsibility for the poor choices they have made. They never see their role in what they do or the consequences that follow.
Your son is an adult, he is no longer your responsibility. I know it's hard but you need to stay strong and keep telling him no. I and many others here have actually written down simple responses to offer when under attack from our child.
Son: You and dad are so selfish. You never do anything for me.
You: I'm sorry you feel that way.
Son: Why won't you help me!!
You: I am not able to help you.
Son: You're not answering me, I asked you why you won't help me!!!
You: I am not able to help you.
At this point in the conversation simply tell him "I have to go now, I love you, bye" and hang up.
My son always tried to get me in an argument where he would just start talking in circles and I was left feeling dazed, confused, hurt, guilty, etc.......
You have the power over how you communicate with him by setting boundaries and sticking to them.

I am so frightened that he will either get hurt or he will hurt someone himself in a fight. I told my husband last night that everyday I'm just "waiting for the boom to fall." That's what everyday feels like. I have some intermittent days when I get busy and distracted and can be emotionally detached, but then there are days like today when I feel like I just can't deal with it anymore.

Beta, you are in the FOG (fear, obligation, guilt) I too was once lost in the FOG. I lost many nights sleep worrying and wondering where my son was. When he would go to jail/prison I would worry. The only way I was able to move past this and come out of the FOG was through acceptance. I had to accept that yes the very worst could happen. I had to accept that I have no control over any of it. I had to let it go and was able to come out of the FOG.
My son will be 37 in a couple of months. He has lived the majority of his life being homeless. He has been in jail and prison more than a few times. He was just recently released from prison. I'm sure he has been in many fights - I don't want or need to know. This last time he went to prison was assault with a knife. He very well could have killed someone. I would be horrified if that were to happen but I also would not wallow in it or let it consume me. My son makes his own choices just like your son does. I nor you have any control over what they do.
We do have control over how we respond to them.

Sometimes I wish he would just go away, or even that he was dead, which is a terrible thing to think because once someone is dead, there's no hope. As long as they are alive, there is hope that they will change.

Oh dear lady I too have had those exact same thoughts!!

Your son just like mine, just like so many others will weave in and out of our lives. They are our children and we love them but we cannot save them. Only they can save themselves and only if they choose to do so. We as parents are not getting any younger and need to be living our own lives for ourselves. That is not selfish, that is healthy.

As for hope, I allow myself to hold onto 1% of hope for my son. I will always have hope that he will start to make better life choices but I will not pine over it, I will not let it consume me. I will live my life and I have released him to live his life. I don't like the way he lives or the choices he makes but I accept them.

I hope you are able to come out of the FOG, there is so much life for you to live without the fog surrounding you.

((HUGS))

 

[Despairing Mom]

I'm so sorry your son is putting you through the emotional wringer. When you hope you die so you don't have to have contact with your abusive son, it's past the time to stop his ability to hurt you.

He's not going to get better quickly regardless of what you do. You can't coerce him to change and stop abusing you. In order to feel better, you must change your behavior and your thoughts towards him.

The first thing to do to feel better is to set up boundaries. Protect yourself from his abusive behavior. You don't have to answer the phone every time he calls. You don't have to listen to his verbal abuse in person. You don't have to return his phone messages. You can hang up on him when he becomes abusive on the phone. You don't have to share your assets with him. You don't have to feel miserable when he is miserable. You don't have to provide an explanation for anything you tell him or anything you do.

You will likely feel guilty after establishing boundaries to stop your son from verbally abusing you. After some time, you will begin to give up this guilt and begin to have a more pleasant life.

Until you find a therapist, I strongly recommend Marsalis Fjelstad's book Stop Caretakeing the Borderline or Narcissist- How to End the Drama and Get On with Life.

I'm sending you a long ((hug)).

 

[Smithmom]

From one who's son is in prison for a long time... Its not the worst. Not the safest place but better than on the streets to me. Better than dead. Better than using. Better than selling drugs.

It helps me to quantify my fears, pain and grief. Why are you in such pain? Because he is suffering? Because you feel harassed? Because he has an uncertain future? Because he is in pain? Because you feel guilt? I find that I can then deal with each of the components of my pain which helps. Not cures. Not ends my pain. Just sometimes I can make one component end.

 

[Tired out]

Beta, I agree with what others have said. He is using guilt to try to manipulate you into giving him what he wants. That won't make anything better. You said you can't afford a therapist, what about going to a support group for parents of alcoholics or drug abusers, maybe that would help you with some coping strategies? As for the phone.. you said you don't wan to change your number..what about just giving yourself a timeout and blocking his number for a week or two?

 

[Beta]

Thank you all for your comfort and insights. I have copied and pasted many of them and printed it out to read and re-read when I'm struggling.
I blocked J from my phone yesterday after his second call, and I feel much better already. Maybe it's just the sense of not being at the mercy of his angry rants anymore. And so I continue on the road toward acceptance and peace. I know there will be days when the FOG hits again, but I do think I'm moving toward knowing and believing the truth of the situation.

Elsi, your words: "I know it feels shocking to have this go through your mind, but I understand. Hope is a double-edged sword. It can keep us going, but it also can keep us in limbo and keep us from moving on with our lives. When we are still holding out hope, there is no closure. Each tiny move towards progress rekindles our hope and sends it blazing, and then we find that hope dashed over and over and over again as they keep making the same bad choices. It can be excruciating." This really hit the mark for me. You are right--the very hope that keeps us going also keeps us tied to them and in limbo. That was an "ah ha" moment for me. I need to keep hope I think but it needs to be tempered with a good dose of reality, that he may never come around and he may very well end up in prison or dead, and I think I need to put away any expectation that things will get better. I need to focus on being a good steward of the life that God has given me and not waste it in anguish over what has become of his life.
By the way, one question: How do you do create the excerpts from other posts as some of you did above, the ones where you quote something someone has said in order to comment on it?

 

[Despairing Mom]

I'm glad to read that you protected yourself from more abusive phone calls yesterday.

To create excerpts from other people's posts, click the "reply" at the bottom of the person's post. Then delete the sentences you don't want to highlight. Be sure to not delete the [ QUOTE= SOANDSO ] at the beginning of their words. Also do not delete the [ / QUOTE ] at the end of their words.

 

[Copabanana]

To create excerpts from other people's posts, click the "reply" at the bottom of the person's post. Then delete the sentences you don't want to highlight.

There is an easier way. Highlight. Then click Quote. A box will come up with the quotes. Then you confirm. The text will appear in your response box. Like DM says, be sure to not interfere with the quote box and the parens on either side. That is what programs the command.

 

[Beta]

I'm sorry, but I tried both above methods, and I'm just not getting it. I'm sure I'm doing it wrong, but I don't see a "reply" button at the bottom of the posts above, and when I highlight someone's comment, I don't see any "Quote" to click on. Clarification please? I'm not a techie person, I'm afraid.