Adult son back in jail for the nth time

[detachingmother]

Here, man, have some Seroquel. Please! You need it more than I do.

That's what I was visualizing.

Or, "Damn dude, WTF, take this, lay down, and shut the Heck up!!"

His rants are insane, literally! Everything from how he will write a new world order to how he will become the next president. Then, quickly reverting to "what the hell, come on guys, help me take the vent out, there's a camera in there, the FBI is watching us...studying us like monkeys!" -- then he will look at bumps on skin, etc to see if there's a possible "chip"....ughhhh

"Come on dude!! Take the damn Seroquel and shut the heck up!!"

The poor guys in his cell, I actually feel for them...If I dont find the humor I would cry...***sigh***

 

[Sister's Keeper]

Oh, I don't doubt for a moment that your son has schizophrenia. It is probably what came 1st, unfortunately family history and your son's own history considered. The street drugs probably exacerbate the symptoms.

Jail is horrible from any healthcare standpoint. Mental illness or otherwise. Just something to think about is that we couldn't even evaluate a patient if they were thought to be under the influence of any drugs or alcohol. I was just wondering if the jail declined to put him on psychiatric medications based on the fact that he has a history of substance and they wanted to evaluate his mental state at baseline without the influences of street drugs.

Meth, in particular, can cause psychosis, and, let's face it, jail docs aren't, exactly, the cream of the crop, so so their evaluation skills may be lacking.

Another thing I know, and I know each jail operates differently, is that a lot of time they "charge" for medications in that they deduct the cost of them from their commissary account. My sister will go without medications if her account is limited.

Sadly, I have accepted that my sister will never get better, though her issue is purely addiction. She, obviously, has no desire to get clean and give up "the life." She has had ample opportunity, and has, yet again, passed up another.

True confession, I wish she could stay in jail for the rest of her life. As sick as it sounds, she thrives there. She is off drugs, she works and is very productive at whatever prison job they give her, and, honestly, seems happier.

I used to have so much anxiety when she was in jail. Now I actually worry less. She is warm, dry, fed, safe from the predators on the street, and sober.

It's a messed up life for all of us.

 

[detachingmother]

True confession, I wish she could stay in jail for the rest of her life. As sick as it sounds, she thrives there. She is off drugs, she works and is very productive at whatever prison job they give her, and, honestly, seems happier.

I used to have so much anxiety when she was in jail. Now I actually worry less. She is warm, dry, fed, safe from the predators on the street, and sober.

It's a messed up life for all of us.

Yup! Me too for him. Often. This is the last hurrah. Only because of child on the way and faith that he can overcome this.

Psychiatrist came to see him three weeks ago, supposedly said he was putting order in for his medications. Still hasn't happened.

Yup! They charge him in other jails, and probably will here too. Not much, $10 last time.

My sister has this problem too, just not near as bad as Son or Mother. Hers is all paranoia. We haven't even spoken in about 4 years. Thank God, at least two of her children are well adjusted, however, three are not. Sister is on Disability. When she tries to reach me, my skin crawls. I stay away at all costs. She has physically hurt me, many times. All kinds of crazy. Why I got the useless degree. LOL---I know i will never figure it all out...

Sure is a messed up life for all of us...I only do what I can handle and discard the rest...still leaves scars.

I didn't think you were doubting me... Your posts are very helpful.

When I'm writing here the past few days, I am writing as though it was a journal, only better because of the feedback. I'm a little raw as the birth of Son's baby approaches. It's a very cathartic experience and helps me sort things out. Also, I remember things that have long been forgotten, i.e., the above post about my mom.

 

[detachingmother]

I mean, I want Son in jail for a very long time, if he cannot go to a long term intensive inpatient treatment. That hasn't been tried yet. And In my fantasy land, I would like all avenues explored, before I close the gate, and just continue to keep phone contact only.

 

[New Leaf]

Detaching my eldest is on meth. I don't recognize her anymore. She has targeted me in her triangulation game, with her dad and has gotten more threatening. Its rough. Is your sis on meth?
I have wished for my eldest to go to jail in hopes that she would get clean. Pretty sad.......

 

[detachingmother]

Detaching my eldest is on meth. I don't recognize her anymore. She has targeted me in her triangulation game, with her dad and has gotten more threatening. Its rough. Is your sis on meth?
I have wished for my eldest to go to jail in hopes that she would get clean. Pretty sad.......

No, I don't think sis ever did meth. I wouldn't put it past her though. I'm not even sure what her diagnoses are.

I don't talk to her AT ALL. I'm pretty sure it's a combo of schizoid affective with paranoia, but her's has an added element of PTSD.

Last I knew, she was doing cocaine, xanax, and smoking crack.

I have heard through the grapevine, she actually cleaned her act up, and I see an occasional photo on her daughter's fb, but don't see myself talking to her again. I will not say never, but very doubtful. I don't miss her.

I don't want to digress here, but she hurt me fast, hard, and often in every way, stone cold sober, while majorly paranoid. I finally had enough, and while protecting myself, I used every ounce of strength I had, and broke her jaw. It was wired shut for a long time. I think 6 weeks. Well, I didn't have to hear her talk for awhile, and I closed the door altogether. Very sad, I never want to be brought to that level of anger again...fortunately I didn't go to jail...came pretty close.

For me, it's not that hard to walk away from people who are this way and refuse help and abuse the help, which sis does get, but she abuses the hell out it...Just not my Son without trying every last resort. When I am out of energy I stop and rest.
I love him so very much.... always from a distance (talk often on the phone when he's not in jail, and see him very little unless/until he totally accepts treatment 100%).

 

[detachingmother]

Meth is nasty nasty nasty on the mind.

One thing to do is inpatient long term intensive...if it's at all possible.

When she's having an "episode" you can take her to the hospital and have her involuntarily admitted.

I did this with Son, and had to try varying counties, until I found one that took him. Some took him and released him the next morning...finally found one that took him for 5 days in a locked facility. It was this that started a turning point at least.

I have also had cops come take him to jail if need be...necessary to protect one's self sometimes as painful as it is.

I look at where son is now as a "relapse"...addicts, mentally ill go through relapses. as I am sure you know.

Son was doing very well... even so I kept him at a distance, because he wasn't taking treatment and medications seriously enough...he just took 10 steps forward and 20 back this time. It will never be normal until later down the road for us....but I'm just hoping for "controlled" or "mostly adjusted".

Meth does ever-lasting damage to the brain...lots of info out there if you haven't already checked it out. If she's to the point of unrecognizable, she is being badly affected.



Geeshhhhhhh. I wrote a darn book again. Sorry....

 

[New Leaf]

Meth does ever-lasting damage to the brain...lots of info out there if you haven't already checked it out. If she's to the point of unrecognizable, she is being badly affected.

Yup. I don't see her that often, but each time I have she seems worse. I am her main focus for her problems, she has gotten more vicious towards me. Can't talk with her, circling conversations and all that. She has never admitted to using meth, but associates with people who do. Who would hang out with meth addicts if they are not using themselves?
Nobody.
It is a crazy situation.....sad.

Geeshhhhhhh. I wrote a darn book again. Sorry....

LOL, no worries, I write books all of the time. I am at the point where I don't wish to see my two, or speak with them. It is too hard on me.
What a mother, huh? Well, I have to do what I have to do to protect myself. They can say what they want.....it has been a long hard road.
Only time will tell. I just don't want any more chapters of the same ole, same ole........
Thanks Detaching.
Prayers for us all to be strong.
(((HUGS)))
leafy

 

[pigless in VA]

Who would hang out with meth addicts if they are not using themselves?

I did. My first husband was a meth addict. They call it "crank" in the South. I knew he was an alcoholic. That is what I thought I was dealing with. He didn't confess to the meth addiction until after I left him.

Living with him was a nightmare. We lived way out in the country, but I was not allowed to talk to anyone out there. He stockpiled weapons. He would stay away for days at a time, which was actually better for me. Then he'd come home, rage at me, and pass out cold.

He became paranoid, delusional, irrational and super angry. I lived that way for 5 years, because I knew that if I left he was going to kill me. He told me he would. Once you "fall in" with that crowd, it takes a plan and a lot of courage to make a run for it.

 

[BusynMember]

Pigless, you are so brave. My daughter had the same problem. She was so steeped in drug land that rvery time dhe tried to quit, she was threatened. Ultimatrly she.had to leave the state without telling any of them...then she wuit and never visited drug land again. I salute both of you.
Pigless, brave escapes like yours are the stories that give others hope.
However if a person does flee yet continues hanging out with many drug users it is unlikely he is sober, either by choice or fear. And if your child does leave to get away, the best way of gauging if your child got clean is if he/she stays away from druggies in the new town.

 

[pasajes4]

My son was first diagnosed when he was 8 years old. He heard voices and saw shadow people running past him all day long. Medication was a crap shoot. Things that should have worked made things worse. Those that did work almost destroyed his liver. This was all before he reached the age of 13. He began smoking weed at the age of ten just to shut the voices in his head up. He has some paranoia, but he has been able to "reason" it away ( with help) some of the time. He has said the worst is when he has to cling to a pole or a tree in terror because the ground is dissolving beneath him. He is now in his late teens and has suffered a stroke. The trauma of this incident has thrown his brain into high gear and now he is fighting not only the effects of the stroke, but also an extreme schizophrenic episode.

I understand your turmoil and the PTSD that comes with living with a person who is going through this. Take care of you FIRST. You matter too. You deserve peace. You deserve to breathe in and out without the catch in your throat of what's next. We matter.

 

[detachingmother]

Pasajes,
Definitely younger people get it. Just not near as often. Early onset Schizophrenia, and very early onset.

I would have to agree with your son that the worst would be seeing the ground dissolving beneath him.

I wish we could all figure out a way to fix these things.

I am currently watching Dr. Drew talk to parents of an autistic teen who is in prison for arson that killed his baby brother. My oh my...what in God's name can be done to help these people.

When I get time I am curious to read more of your story. Is your son's schizophrenia regulated at times? If so, with what? I also wonder what caused the stroke? Do docs have any idea? Fear? medications? I am very interested.

SWOT, yep, Pigless sure is my hero!! I agree with you up there. Very brave, indeed.

New Leaf, first, you're a good mother. Enabling is uneducated mothering, in my opinion...does more harm than good. I've read many of your posts...I know you know this, but it's always worth repeating, right? It's your choice not to talk to your two...if they can't be respectful.

One tell-tale sign is teeth that are beginning to rot. That is a given. I've also seen Vicodin rot out teeth, and a few other drugs, though too, so...With long term meth use too, there's almost always paranoia, hallucinating, mania...

I know the circle talk all too well. I feel for ya...I try hard these days not to get caught up in those talks. Doesn't happen that often these days. Son knows if he wants to talk to me he cannot get away with that.

However, he most certainly will try to engage the circle talk with me, but I quickly "redirect" him by telling him, "No, don't waste this phone call on nonsensical talk, I will hang up", and I follow through if he does and say first, "I am going to hang up now, please know that I love you, but do not call me back unless you can be rational. I am not trying to rationalize with an irrational person today." Click. He used to need constant reminders and follow through on my part, now he mostly gets it, unless he's far off in lala land, then I simply hang up... I've also reminded him the definition of insanity...lol...we've all heard this one too, I am sure..."doing the same thing over and over again, and expecting different results". He doesn't like me saying this to him, but he quotes it himself now. LOLOLOL, when he catches himself being "crazy". When he's on his medications, he's quite regulated and actually a joy to be with, just the past two years, he's been on major intervention mode.

I use positive reinforcement with Son when he is having good conversation, I tell him, and continue on...but when it's "bad" conversation, I use a basic "extinguishing" technique. I hang up, and stay hung up for days. Of course lots of us do this.... I simply will not engage if it's negative on his part. I have done this so long with him, I do it without realizing it...it does help. It's the basic premise really of "detachment" for me. At least this is how I see it. My goal is that he will be positively reinforced into therapy and treatment and his bad behavior will hopefully be extinguished so we can come back together as a family unit. It's a constant battle of the wills, I suppose. Sometimes I feel like I am re-teaching basic communication skills over and over again....As I am sure many of us feel. Trying to rationalize with Son is like trying to pull my own teeth. Just doesn't work, but these very basic techs do work most of the time to make future discussions with him easier. The ol' hamster wheel. That just might be my favorite emoticon.

 

[savior no more]

I needed to hear everything that has been written thus far in this thread. Though I have never posted my story, I have finally gotten a name after a year of reading these posts. I could not have survived without the sharing of you all - no one else understands it. I will be working on an initial post but for now just let me say my 19 year old mentally ill son is in jail for the fifth time and hopefully he will stay there for quite a while. This last was for armed robbery - before was burglary of a habitation. Asperger's, Tourettes, bipolar and mood disorder now coupled with substance abuse. I had prayed today for a sign of whether to cut off all communication and not give commissary. Detaching mother I concur with you - I have to maintain some sort of connection lest he will easily and willingly slip into the unaccountable and homeless never to return. If this is for me, so be it. I needed to hear how you handle the negative talk with no communication. Thanks.
I don't know how to do the signature - but I finally made my username as saviornomore - at least I'm trying to be.

 

[detachingmother]

Savior no More. My heart goes out to you. It's good to hear you are getting some relief by reading. I am brand new here, but like you, no stranger to this mess we find ourselves in.

I feel for you and encourage you to write your story. It helps us greatly to put it out there. As I am learning writing also helps others. Thank you for letting me know my post did help you.

Just know for now, you are not alone.

I will clarify though,...I do offer commissary, but through a site his jail uses called icare.com. I only send a few things. I have sent books in the past, but only educational, or self help books. I actually just sent a few books. I noticed he does get something out of these types of books--they do help my Son and he likes to read. So, I send some here and there. I will also put some money in account to cover his medications, as well as some phone calls. So, I am not good at not helping him there, somewhat. I do NOT however put money in his account bc he wants me too or asks me too. I probably do it, bc I know he doesn't expect it. I only do what I want, when I want, on my own terms.

With that said, I have gone weeks and months without talking to him. If you haven't done this yet, you should definitely do it now. At least for awhile.

What I am good at is NOT letting him in my home, unless he is in active treatment, and unless he is respectful on all levels to myself and other family members. I also talk to him on the phone often as long as he's respectful.

Given your son's crime, he sadly, will most likely be there for quite some time.

I wouldn't talk to him until he stews at least for awhile. And, until you can calm down and be able to hold your ground firmly with him. And when you do talk to him, definitely command respect. OR, click, another week. That's my opinion. Meanwhile, that doesn't mean you can't contact the jail counselor to get the ball rolling on treatment, bc as you probably know, that takes forever in most jails. But again, just do what you want to do.

I know how hard it is though, because initially there will be all sorts of things to sort out. Court appointed attorney, court dates, etc.

All you need to know is that he's safe, your safe, society in general is safe. That's all you really need to know right now. I am not in the boat the of extreme no contact, but I am not against it either. For me, talking to son or any of my kids is a given, unless I am being disrespected. I've taught them always that I am only a phone call away.

You do whatever is right for you. Only you know your limits. But, in your son's case I'd wait at least a week. And don't spend more than you can afford on phone calls. That should be a given.

BIG HUGS to you Savior no more. We will never be able to just fix them, so all we can do is hope the try to fix themselves.

 

[detachingmother]

I do also believe that when we set our own boundaries, and all of us probably differ in our boundaries, we need to first verbalize it clearly to them. Loud, proud, and clear. IF it's already been clearly laid out then they cross the boundary, then you have to be firm...there is no other way on this one. OR it won't work.

That way there's no misunderstanding (well this is almost subjective with mentally ill, but even the mentally ill can figure it out with enough reinforcement and repetiveness, even our animals can figure it out).

 

[savior no more]

I have come to the conclusion that my son will be instiututionalized at some point for a long time. The sad fact is our society has jails and in Texas State Schools for the severely mentally retarded and criminally MR. My son's processing speed is severely MR - 56 - however other functions aren't so bad. I have to advocate on his behalf in dealing with the judicial system insomuch as to alert them of his diagnosis and need for medication. They have always been very helpful and understanding. I think this time they were hoping he would get killed before they had to deal with him again as I had written letters to probation in desperation asking for them to revoke probation - that was back in July 2015. Much of that was done in the event of a tragedy and if the lens of society was turned on me to sow what I had done. Believe me I have lived the isolation of a struggling parent with a difficult child only to be judged and scorned by school officials and also the legal system.
I have a certain budgeted amount and not a lot to give him - and yes I do put it directly on his books and not much. The system is a racket and I could go on for hours about the discriminatory nature of our judicial system. Suffice to say I am grateful he is alive as he was getting beat up on a regular basis since July while out on the streets. He now is saying he did me and my poor dear mother who is 81 a favor by turning himself in and just not letting the cops shoot him. In a way he did, but he mainly says that to manipulate me into feeling sorry for him. Basically I've felt sorry for him his whole life. It's me I need to feel sorry for and attend to - not him - as it hasn't done him one bit of good. Thanks for responding and the direction - some days I just wish someone would PLEASE give me the handbook on how to raise this child.

 

[New Leaf]

I did. My first husband was a meth addict. .........He didn't confess to the meth addiction until after I left him.

He became paranoid, delusional, irrational and super angry. I lived that way for 5 years, because I knew that if I left he was going to kill me. He told me he would. Once you "fall in" with that crowd, it takes a plan and a lot of courage to make a run for it.

You know Pigless, this helps me to understand a little more about Rains predicament. With meth I mean. Your description of your ex fits her. Also her ranting about this man she lived with she couldn't leave, he would kill her. But, supposedly he is in jail now, so I don't know what she is doing.
I have seen her highs and lows. Sleeping for days and then up all night. Scrubbing one spot in the kitchen for two hours. On and on. It's a sad thing. Hopefully one day she will get out.
Pigless, no wonder you say you have lived seven lives.
You are my newest super hero.
(((hugs)))
leafy

 

[New Leaf]

Hi Savior no more, welcome to the forum. So sorry for your need to be here. You have had a rough ride and I agree that it is you, you need to attend to. There will be more folks to come along and second, third and fourth that.
You matter, you have value.
(((hugs)))
leafy

 

[Sister's Keeper]

Savior,

With me it is my sister, not a child, but I'm raising her kids in the wake of her addiction.

Same story, in and out of jail. Never violent crimes, always shoplifting and parole/probation violations. I, too, have felt sorry for her most of my life. My sister is now looking at a 5 year sentence in state prison.

I think Detaching is right. We all have a level of enabling that we allow. I only contribute to commissary on Christmas and her birthday. Never anything else. Where she is they have the ability to earn commissary money through different jobs. If she wants things she can earn them. ....but here is my level of enabling. When she is out and on the street, and she is usually some level of homeless, I have bought clothes, long underwear, coats, and in a code blue weather situation I have paid for 3 nights at a really crappy hotel and even had pizza delivered there. On the occasions that she has a phone and be contacted (usually when she has a pimp, sad to say) and she calls and asks to see the kids, I won't allow her to, but I will pick her up from the bus station and buy her lunch.

She isn't allowed in my home, ever. She stole from me when I opened my home to her. She isn't allowed to see the kids unless she has completed a recovery program and has maintained a period of sobriety. I will not visit in jail, the kids will NEVER see her in jail, I do not accept collect calls.

I think, as many have said, we have to love from a distance. I have the fortunate situation, here, where my sister is not mentally ill, just an addict, so she is more than capable for advocating for herself.

I think that our enabling is for us. We need it, somehow, to feel at peace. Sometimes I need to see her face to know that she is okay and alive, not really living, but alive. It gives me some peace.

 

[New Leaf]

I think that our enabling is for us. We need it, somehow, to feel at peace. Sometimes I need to see her face to know that she is okay and alive, not really living, but alive. It gives me some peace.

Hi Sister, for what it's worth, I do not call what you do for your sis, enabling, it is called loving detachment. I remember one post a while back explaining loving detachment. It is not a cold cutting off of contact, not an expectation to not help at all.
These are still our people who we love.
You have some good solid boundaries.
God bless you for taking care of the kids.
You are an awesome person.
(((HUGS)))
leafy