At My Witt's End

[Copabanana]

My daughters response when I asked her about trying to use my debit card.

Good for you Overwhelmed!

You handled that perfectly, no matter what she said. The response of your daughter was 100 percent gaslighting. You don't need to open yourself to that. You don't need to justify yourself or give either ADULT child a rationale, justification or explanation. It's like they say in Al Anon. "No. Is a complete sentence."

telling my son

This is what I suggest with him. First, keep it simple. All he needs to know (and the best thing for you) is to tell him the bottom line. At the end of the lease in May I'm not renewing. I will be moving out and terminating the lease. I am letting you know now so you have as much notice as possible to find a place.

You don't need to comment upon your mental health, his behavior, the cumulative stress you've endured, or any other thing. That's your business, not his. No good thing can come about talking about this with him. He is not in a position right now where he can appreciate or take responsibility for what he does to you (and to himself). You are the last thing on his radar except for a target and somebody to extract what he wants.

But more than this, he will seek to use every single thing you say against you and to advance his own interests. By that i mean, to seek advantage, either materially, emotionally, and in terms of dominance and control.

If he begins to insult and attack you (and he will) you need to be prepared. You have told us he's violent to you. There is every reason to anticipate that he will try to scare and target you. For this reason I would think about all of this very seriously in advance. Because if he has threatened you or actually physically hurt you you could very likely get a restraining order for the District Attorney's office, and in this case you would not owe him any notice at all, as far as I know. He would not be able to enter or come near the premises. Immediately. (But I am not an attorney.)

I would think some about how he is likely to respond. And base your plan of attack on what you think is his likely response. The middle ground strategy might be to tell him about the move when you are on neutral ground, with other people around, like strangers in a Starbucks. That way you would see what his response is, not in a situation where you were as vulnerable to him.

However, if he has physically attacked you before (or threatened violence), or there is a pattern of emotional abuse (or all of the above) you might want to contact a Domestic Violence Program before you do anything, and with them plan what to do. One option might be (if these conditions are met) that you leave the house now, and terminate the lease early.

In my state landlords are obligated to show good faith to try to find a tenant, and they can only obligate you to pay rent for the time the place is not rented. They can't just let the clock run out on the lease, and have you hold the bag.

It can be difficult to make these kinds of decisions, about our children, because our default is to be the shock absorber for the situation. To not be the source of their suffering and to not feel as if we are the cause of their suffering. Let alone try with all of our might to control the situation so that they don't suffer, from whatever the source. Even (or especially) at their own hand.

Many of us have had to involve authorities to keep ourselves safe.

The important thing here is to be safe. You are working very hard to create emotional safety for yourself. But before emotional safety comes physical safety. Maybe before you speak to your son it makes sense to make a realistic assessment of his harm potential towards you, and to have your strategy take this into account.

I took some big steps today and feel strong and I have to admit, proud of myself.

We're proud of you too!! The thing is a central element of domestic violence is seeking to re-assert dominance and control when the victim stands up for herself, and/or seeks to leave the situation.

You are doing fantastically. Let us together think through how to do this.

 

[Overwhelmed1]

Good for you Overwhelmed!

You handled that perfectly, no matter what she said. The response of your daughter was 100 percent gaslighting. You don't need to open yourself to that. You don't need to justify yourself or give either ADULT child a rationale, justification or explanation. It's like they say in Al Anon. "No. Is a complete sentence."
This is what I suggest with him. First, keep it simple. All he needs to know (and the best thing for you) is to tell him the bottom line. At the end of the lease in May I'm not renewing. I will be moving out and terminating the lease. I am letting you know now so you have as much notice as possible to find a place.

You don't need to comment upon your mental health, his behavior, the cumulative stress you've endured, or any other thing. That's your business, not his. No good thing can come about talking about this with him. He is not in a position right now where he can appreciate or take responsibility for what he does to you (and to himself). You are the last thing on his radar except for a target and somebody to extract what he wants.

But more than this, he will seek to use every single thing you say against you and to advance his own interests. By that i mean, to seek advantage, either materially, emotionally, and in terms of dominance and control.

If he begins to insult and attack you (and he will) you need to be prepared. You have told us he's violent to you. There is every reason to anticipate that he will try to scare and target you. For this reason I would think about all of this very seriously in advance. Because if he has threatened you or actually physically hurt you you could very likely get a restraining order for the District Attorney's office, and in this case you would not owe him any notice at all, as far as I know. He would not be able to enter or come near the premises. Immediately. (But I am not an attorney.)

I would think some about how he is likely to respond. And base your plan of attack on what you think is his likely response. The middle ground strategy might be to tell him about the move when you are on neutral ground, with other people around, like strangers in a Starbucks. That way you would see what his response is, not in a situation where you were as vulnerable to him.

However, if he has physically attacked you before (or threatened violence), or there is a pattern of emotional abuse (or all of the above) you might want to contact a Domestic Violence Program before you do anything, and with them plan what to do. One option might be (if these conditions are met) that you leave the house now, and terminate the lease early.

In my state landlords are obligated to show good faith to try to find a tenant, and they can only obligate you to pay rent for the time the place is not rented. They can't just let the clock run out on the lease, and have you hold the bag.

It can be difficult to make these kinds of decisions, about our children, because our default is to be the shock absorber for the situation. To not be the source of their suffering and to not feel as if we are the cause of their suffering. Let alone try with all of our might to control the situation so that they don't suffer, from whatever the source. Even (or especially) at their own hand.

Many of us have had to involve authorities to keep ourselves safe.

The important thing here is to be safe. You are working very hard to create emotional safety for yourself. But before emotional safety comes physical safety. Maybe before you speak to your son it makes sense to make a realistic assessment of his harm potential towards you, and to have your strategy take this into account.
We're proud of you too!! The thing is a central element of domestic violence is seeking to re-assert dominance and control when the victim stands up for herself, and/or seeks to leave the situation.

You are doing fantastically. Let us together think through how to do this.

Copa, actually the lease I am talking about is for my daughter's apartment I pay for. I have a home and that is why I am nervous about my situation with my son.
My son and his girlfriend will cause problems and I do need to be prepared for that.
I thought about if he gives me trouble I can call the police and show them three holes in three different doors where he punched them instead of me. Maybe that will help me get him out.
My daughter on the other hand may leave before the lease and go back in hiding with the kids.
Those poor kids, they are such good, loving kids and it is breaking my heart to do this to them.
I wish I could take them but she would run with them before she would let that happen.
I feel good about taking this step but at the same time I am having horrible emotions running through me because of my grandkids.
Might be another sleepless night.
I am so scared for them.

I will fight to stay focused. I need to follow through with this. I can't cave in again but those kids are going to suffer.

God be with us all....

 

[Copabanana]

I have a home and that is why I am nervous about my situation with my son.

I'm sorry OW that I leaped to conclusions about the situation. So, they're separate. That makes it easier.

them three holes in three different doors where he punched them instead of me.

My son did this too. Walls, Doors. Refrigerators. In our situation I don't believe my son was using the walls, instead of me. I think he was full of anger that he could not contain, about himself, his situation, his own inability to make things work, to make his life work. Of course that may be different in your son's case. And that is not to say there are not dangers from violence against property. I ended up terrorized. Years and years of this, led me to be triggered by everything, with respect to my son. So. I do understand.

good, loving kids and it is breaking my heart to do this to them.

You're not doing this to them. Your daughter is. These are her children. Not yours. Did you have a part in their conception? Was it your idea? Of course not.

The best hope for these kids is that their mother steps up. What you're doing now is giving her space to do that. If you support her and take responsibility for her, she won't step up. You're giving her that opportunity and you're giving those kids a chance to have a real mother. Anyway, are you willing to be submit yourself to be destroyed? Of course not. How is it ever good for the cost to one person in a relationship, to be everything? That was the price you were paying, and me too.

So. Am I understanding now? Your son and his girlfriend live with you in a house you own? And that he has not physically hurt you directly or threatened to hurt you physically, to cause danger to you?

I'm a little concerned about your son. In my own situation things have gotten sticky around having to move out. I've had to have the cops come a number of times. I had to do a notice of trespass. I thought about a restraining order. Even with all of that, my son squatted in the backyard a number of times and I could not get control over the situation. This went on, off an on more than a year!! I don't recommend this. Like I wrote above (though I got the situation mixed up) I suggest a plan, with plan A, B and fallback, and maybe even understanding your legal situation first.

Other people here will know way better than I do, but I'm coming from the place of thinking things through up front.

 

[Overwhelmed1]

I'm sorry OW that I leaped to conclusions about the situation. So, they're separate. That makes it easier.
My son did this too. Walls, Doors. Refrigerators. In our situation I don't believe my son was using the walls, instead of me. I think he was full of anger that he could not contain, about himself, his situation, his own inability to make things work, to make his life work. Of course that may be different in your son's case. And that is not to say there are not dangers from violence against property. I ended up terrorized. Years and years of this, led me to be triggered by everything, with respect to my son. So. I do understand.

You're not doing this to them. Your daughter is. These are her children. Not yours. Did you have a part in their conception? Was it your idea? Of course not.

The best hope for these kids is that their mother steps up. What you're doing now is giving her space to do that. If you support her and take responsibility for her, she won't step up. You're giving her that opportunity and you're giving those kids a chance to have a real mother. Anyway, are you willing to be submit yourself to be destroyed? Of course not. How is it ever good for the cost to one person in a relationship, to be everything? That was the price you were paying, and me too.

So. Am I understanding now? Your son and his girlfriend live with you in a house you own? And that he has not physically hurt you directly or threatened to hurt you physically, to cause danger to you?

Copa, you got it right.
My son gets in my face screams and yells following me around the house. He puts his fists in my face then punched a wall or door, what ever is close to me but his fists have not made contact with my body.

 

[Copabanana]

I fear I am running my issue into the ground and I need to refrain myself from coming here to often.

Stop that please! Nobody ever thought that. Sometimes we can inadvertently cause pain. I know i have been thoughtless at times. I try not to hurt people but our stories are all so similar, ti's so easy to be triggered, or to act like a know it all, because in our own lives we feel totally clueless and out of control.

He puts his fists in my face then punched a wall or door,

OK. This scares me. This is a threat. My son did something like this years ago. I should have called the police and filed a police report. It would have been better for me and better for him. I'm not saying to do this. I'm saying I should have done it.

I added a few paragraphs in the post above, that I don't think you saw.

The only way to work things through and to get a handle on our situations in my view, is to post a lot, and to put it all out there. There is no other way to do it, in my view. It's never pretty. I know I felt very vulnerable and still I sometimes do here. I recognize now that nobody here ever meant to hurt me or to judge me.

 

[Overwhelmed1]

Stop that please! Nobody ever thought that. Sometimes we can inadvertently cause pain. I know i have been thoughtless at times. I try not to hurt people but our stories are all so similar, ti's so easy to be triggered, or to act like a know it all, because in our own lives we feel totally clueless and out of control.
OK. This scares me. This is a threat. My son did something like this years ago. I should have called the police and filed a police report. It would have been better for me and better for me. I'm not saying to do this. I'm saying I should have done it.

I added a few paragraphs in the post above, that I don't think you saw.

The only way to work things through and to get a handle on our situations in my view, is to post a lot, and to put it all out there. There is no other way to do it, in my view. It's never pretty. I know I felt very vulnerable and still I sometimes do here. I recognize now that nobody here ever meant to hurt me or to judge me.

Copa, I so appreciate your help. No one here has ever made me feel bad about anything I have said. It's my own insecurities and lack of worth that makes me say things about posting too much etc.
I have never been good with complements, don't know how to react to them. Here is different. I am able to react without judgement.
What I like best here, is there is no confrontation. Everyone speaks their truths, their experience, what helped and what didn't. No one shames you for not being where they are in their walk. This is a family, what a family should be. There is no body type, race, age, physical or monetary status. Just good people doing good towards others. Who wouldn't feel safe here?

 

[Beta]

My son gets in my face screams and yells following me around the house. He puts his fists in my face then punched a wall or door, what ever is close to me but his fists have not made contact with my body.

Okay OW1, this is very frightening to me, and I'm not even there experiencing it! This is totally unacceptable behavior. I think what Copa has suggested is good advice. I think you need to find a safe time and place and let your son know he and his girlfriend need to find another place to live, and if he erupts in anger and violence (and it sounds like he will), I would call the police. I don't usually offer advice here and I hope I am not overstepping my boundaries, but this isn't good for you, or for him, for that matter. I like the idea of a restraining order. Is there anyone who could be there with you while you make this statement to him (and I agree that there should be no explanation or elaboration; just a firm statement). I don't know if I should even be saying all this; I just know that I'm frightened for you and I'm outraged that your son would do this to his own mother.

 

[Nandina]

I agree with the great advice offered here. A restraining order would be an absolute necessity in my opinion, to keep him from coming back to terrorize you once he has been removed from the house. And if he violated it and came back anyway, he could be arrested.

I don’t know much about your son, but he sounds like he isn’t the type to go quietly into the night.

Safety first, OW. Sending love, strength and many hugs your way.

 

[Deni D]

Overwhelmed ~ Many of us have had the experience of putting up boundaries with our adult children only to be met with them bringing out the big guns. It's typical when you make changes for someone who wants to keep things the same to really push back.

With your daughter I would expect she will put herself and therefore her children in a worse financial situation before she gets it. And I think there's also a good chance she will use the grandchildren against you. It's not unusual in these cases for the adult child to accuse the parent of not caring about the grandchildren and then keeping the grandchildren away as a bargaining chip.

As for your son, do I have it right that he's a 35 year old man, not working, has a hefty temper and is living for free in your house with this girlfriend? This is just my opinion but I feel strongly, if I have this right, you need some help with getting him to move out. For your sanity it seems getting him out will help you most to start to take care of yourself.

But from my experience, starting with calling the police might not be helpful. Here's a scenario ~ An adult child won't move out and he tries to scare the parent into getting back in line by yelling at her and punching a wall by her face. She calls the police. They come to be met with a woman who is very upset and seeming like the "crazy" one. On the other hand he and his girlfriend are very calm and both explain to the police how she always acts crazy. He and the girlfriend explain how what you say happened didn't happen at all, there's power in numbers in these situations. The police tell him if you all can't get along maybe he should move out. He tells them he's been working on that but he doesn't know who will take care of his crazy mother if he's not there. The police tell the mother if she really doesn't want her son and his girlfriend there she can go up to the court house and file to have them evicted (which will take months). The police leave shaking their heads, glad they don't have to put up with a mother like that, hope she gets help for herself.

That exact scenario did not happen to me, but has to others I know of. I think the police could be part of your solution but don't think they are the first and only part.

Someone had suggested contacting the domestic violence organization in your area to see what help you can get from them. I know in my area there is a group who work with domestic violence victims at the county level. Anyone who goes into court on a restraining order situation has no choice but to talk to them around here. But you don't have to have already gotten to to the point of a restraining order to seek their help. I think looking for these folks in your town or county and starting by meeting with them to discuss your situation would be a safe start. Also I would not tell your son about any of the support you are seeking, warning him this way would not be good for you.

Oh and by the way, I also want to tell you that you are not bothering anyone here by posting often. Actually considering your situation I know I'd much rather see you on here often.

This is all a one step at a time thing, often a giant leap backwards and then a going forward one step at a time again. It's tough, and you don't deserve any of this, big hug to you.

 

[Overwhelmed1]

Again thank you everyone. I appreciate everything you have to say. Don't hold back because you think it might hurt my feelings or push me away. I need to hear all of this. I need to be informed of all my options and all the scenarios because, quite frankly my head is spinning.
I have not heard anything from my daughter. Without me she will have no roof over her head and no cash. She will probably end up at a shelter. I wondering if she is going to trash everything I bought for her and the kids. I furnished most if the apartment, some stuff she got given to her. All the other essential and non-essential item, toys, clothes, shoes etc. I am not going to contact her though. Is that wrong? Should I try reaching out to her and discuss her plans?
My son has really got my tummy in a panic. I am very nervous.
I can't get the grandkids off my mind. I got them off the street for two years, just to put them back out there. Am I doing the right thing. Should I have never helped if I wasn't going to continue?
What a mess

 

[BusynMember1]

I am very sympathetic as I was a huge enabler. But Kay did not live with us. We found ways, some not good ways, to make sure she did not live in our house, let alone with her creepy husband.

We have to take care of us. Would you live with a partner who treated you like your son and this girlfriend do?

Your son is tall, young and strong. He is doing domestic abuse to you just as clearly as if a partner were were doing it. He has no right.

I hope you think and/or pray over this and do what you have to do to stay safe and peaceful. Our homes in my opinion should be our sanctuaries, not the place we are terrorized and held hostage.

Please put your peace and we'll we'll first. You received excellent advice.

Hugs and love.

 

[WiseChoices]

Good for you! You don't owe anyone any explanations and do not need to defend your new choices. Nobody has the right to your money or debit card.

If it were me, I would make sure immediately that my daughter no longer has access to any of my finances. I would shut down access to my debit and credit cards, taking her off any accounts she is possibly on, changing online passwords to any accounts , and making sure my finances are locked down right with me being the only person who has access.

I made a mistake some years ago giving my daughter my credit card to go to the store for us and buy things for the family. She took advantage by getting a few small things for herself a few times and saying I would have let her get it if I had been with her. Which is probably true. But I realized from that that it's not observing proper financial boundaries when I give my adult children my card. I have since been extremely careful to observe financial boundaries. I always had this vision of living in absolute trust with my children - the way I am with my parents - but at the present time that is not possible based on what I have observed when I have given my children that trust. I needed to reel it in and protect my assets.

I will keep your grandchildren in my prayers. And I am sending you courage and strength for when you talk to your son. Something I recently learned about confidence: speaking calmly, not using too many words, not explaining myself, not defending myself, addressing the processes that are happening rather than the feelings, standing/sitting straight up, shoulders back, and not reacting to anything that is being said, not fidgeting.

Keep us posted on how it goes for you. When he does move, make sure you ask for the key back and you might even want to change the locks. My friend had both her trailer and her house broken into when her son owed money to drug dealers.

Much love!

 

[WiseChoices]

Again thank you everyone. I appreciate everything you have to say. Don't hold back because you think it might hurt my feelings or push me away. I need to hear all of this. I need to be informed of all my options and all the scenarios because, quite frankly my head is spinning.
I have not heard anything from my daughter. Without me she will have no roof over her head and no cash. She will probably end up at a shelter. I wondering if she is going to trash everything I bought for her and the kids. I furnished most if the apartment, some stuff she got given to her. All the other essential and non-essential item, toys, clothes, shoes etc. I am not going to contact her though. Is that wrong? Should I try reaching out to her and discuss her plans?
My son has really got my tummy in a panic. I am very nervous.
I can't get the grandkids off my mind. I got them off the street for two years, just to put them back out there. Am I doing the right thing. Should I have never helped if I wasn't going to continue?
What a mess

I would not contact her. The details of how she deals with the boundary you have set see strictly up to her. What happens to the stuff you have bought for her is not your responsibility. Your responsibility is to yourself. Addicts are extremely resourceful - I would not worry about what happens. She will figure something out. Keep in mind that you are HELPING her to help herself (like any adult should) and empowering her to make her own choices. The current situation was keeping her and you sick.

I would talk to son without the girlfriend present. I like the idea of having someone else present that is there as a witness for you. I like the idea of talking to a domestic violence organization ahead of time to have a distinct plan on how to do this.

 

[Copabanana]

Should I try reaching out to her and discuss her plans?

To my view, NOOOOO!

The growth for her and for you, let me say potential growth, will come from letting her deal with her real situation, responding to it, and reaching out to build a community network of support. She may or may not. But if she doesn't do it now, she may do it later. By rescuing our children, we stand in the way of their creating real resources, both internally and socially. That is my belief and that is my experience.

I got them off the street for two years, just to put them back out there. Am I doing the right thing. Should I have never helped if I wasn't going to continue?

You are NOT putting them back on the street. You gave your daughter the gift of 2 years to build a foundation of skills and support to be in the position to care for her children and herself. Instead, she made other choices. Same for my own son. Not one bit of the sacrifice I made did my son use to create a better life. Instead, like with your daughter, he used my help to dig in with problematic and self-harming attitudes and behaviors. All I did by sheltering him was keep at bay my own fear and anxiety and guilt.

Finally I realized this was not sustainable. Even if I was willing and able to do it for the rest of my life, I had to face that by continuing to act in my own self-interest, (because I faced to keep rescuing him was self-serving) to avoid, guilt, fear, panic about my son, I was hurting him both short and long term, I had to stop.

I had to face head on that I was NOT buying time, Because eventually I would die, and the piper would have to be paid. I have to accept reality now. The reality that my son must care for himself or not. Because eventually, that will be his reality. I will die. Better my son deals with his life now, than later. Better for him and better for me. I did not come easily to this perspective. But I feel at peace with it now.

It took me lots of work here on this forum. I would post terrified, panicked, and deeply sad. Desperate and despondent. Until finally, I had built the strength within me, and the faith to let go. The reality is that these are adults. Not babies.

Finally, we need to be the adults and the babies we care about and protect. Because I have come to believe that the panic, and the loss and the despondency and desperation that I have felt in relation to the situation of my adult son--these are feelings inside of myself that i have projected onto him. Better he stand up. And me too.

Your daughter had real life babies. She produced them. She bore them. She is their mother, not you. I believe with all my heart that you need to step aside and let her step into her rightful role as a good mother. I believe she has it in her. You will be willing to support her in appropriate ways, after the dust has cleared. But she is responsible now for creating the next steps. Let her find the resources, both personal, social and also economic to do so.

She may do all kinds of things, over which you have no control. If you believe you need help to deal with what may come, you have support here, and there is Al Anon. If there are no available meetings in your community there are online meetings. But regardless of what your daughter does, I believe, truly, this is the correct thing for her, for the children and for you.
But the reality is we have no control. That is what I came to see. That we have control was an illusion.

But if your experience is anything like mine was, this ambivalence, regret, fear, second-guessing is a normal and expected result of taking action. It will ease. You are doing fantastically. You are very brave and a loving, responsible mother.

 

[AppleCori]

Hi OV1,

You have gotten some great advice!

If I were in your situation, I think I would do these things first (in no particular order):

#1) Take away daughter’s access to you bank accounts, credit cards, and any other way she has access to you money. This may take some work and time, so you should probably start on it now. Your goal is (if I understand what you are saying) to cut all financial ties and entanglements with her by June. Start now in order to accomplish this.

#2) Call the Domestic Violence Hotline and talk to someone there about how to deal with your son and his girlfriend. They will recognize that domestic violence is not just a problem between spouses/significant others, but also happens in other family situations. Since your son is intimidating, threatening, and violent, you need professional advice on how to handle getting him out of your house. He will likely ramp up the threats and violence to keep you from throwing him out. Be ready. You need to make your own safety paramount.

#3) I don’t know what your age is, but you might also give the Dept. of Aging & Disability Services a call. They take elder abuse very seriously.

#4) Continue to post so we know that you are doing okay. We are worried about your safety.

Apple

 

[Overwhelmed1]

I have been thinking today, A LOT.
If I tell my son this weekend about my decision for him to move out, I may have to deal with anger from him while I am at home working. That could be bad for me professionally. The positive though I would be there so he couldn't destroy anything. Not sure he would but he did tell me not to long ago, he would leave and remove all the remolding I paid him to do. Told me you should have saved the carpet when you put down the hardwood floors. I don't think he would really do that.
I'm thinking I should wait until I am back at work so I am not there with him all day.
I don't have anyone to be there with me when I tell him that he needs to move out. He would play it cool until they left most likely. He would probably leave until the person left.
I have called the police once and they arrested him. He had to go to anger management classes and be tested for substance and alcohol for a year.
He was gone for two years then like a dummy I let him back in. He seemed to have changed and things were good for a while.
He is depressed I know but I offered to take him to a counselor or therapist but he wouldn't go.
Now several years later he is slipping back to his old ways.
Now I am back to square one.
I know I have done great damage to both my kids by trying to be the fixer. If only I could go backwards and knew then what I know now. Maybe both my daughter and son would be in a better place now.
Well I can't change the past and can't tell the future. All that's left today is go to sleep and pray for a better tommorow for us all.

 

[Copabanana]

The positive though I would be there so he couldn't destroy anything.

What's wrong with this picture? That you would be there to protect your things against his rampage, is NO solution. Your psyche and soul, and body are infinitely more precious than what material thing he could destroy. Which is not to say that any real or threatened destruction of our things, does not count. It does. The last thing i considered was my own being, not long ago.

I'm thinking I should wait until I am back at work so I am not there with him all day.

Only you can decide. When you came back to CD the toll this was taking on you was considerable, living with somebody who was explosive and threatening and insulted you.

You are not responsible for his behavior. He is. Every day you keep the status quo where he can belittle, mock, threaten, and scare you is one more day he does not have to take responsibility for himself. This is exactly what you're beating yourself up for here:

by trying to be the fixer.

If only I could go backwards

Maybe both my daughter and son would be in a better place now.

You are not responsible for the choices that your ADULT children make. By choosing to be the shock absorbers for our sons' bad conduct by taking their verbal blows and threatened physical ones, their insults, their disregard of boundaries and lack of reciprocity, we allow them to live in a fantasy land where acts don't matter. Especially bad acts toward us.

The thing is, you're right. Going limp and playing dead is a strategy to fool our attackers. The problem is the price we pay for this. That's one thing.

If you are afraid of him or what he could do, you should not speak to him alone. I agree. You should not be in the house alone with him, having told him to leave. I agree. But at the same time,the consequences and responsibility for his bad acts should not be yours. These should be his consequences. He will only get better if he experiences his life, himself, rather than inserting you in it.

You do have options: You can wait (but how will this help?) You can go to a domestic violence program to meet with a counselor to make a plan. You can get a restraining order.

I don't have anyone to be there with me when I tell him that he needs to move out

I hear you. From what you're writing the risk would be how he would torture you and destroy your home, after you told him. While you don't really need somebody to be with you when you tell him, if it's in a Starbucks or Denny's, the problem seems not to be just the telling him, as you rightly note. If the police and courts believed he was sufficiently violent to require arrest and anger management for a year, your fears are based upon reality, and telling him he will have to move, is not the real problem. The real problem is he's violent and abusive towards you.

The problem is him. Not where he lives. Except for the fact that you seem to be his target. And he lives with you.

OW. I don't believe waiting will make this reality go away. Continuing to live with him, he will continue to torture and threaten you. You're right. If you confront him, he may well hurt you and/or destroy your home. I can hear the reality of the situation for you. I don't know him, but this is what you seem to fear. In my experience, fears tend to be real. I urge you to go either to a Domestic Violence Program or to Elder Abuse, or both. You don't have to do anything, except upon your own timetable. Just beginning the conversation with them should help.

As an aside, you could well already qualify for Victim Witness Benefits through the District Attorney's office in your County, based upon the police report you filed in the past, that led to his arrest. What that would do is give you free therapy for trauma for at least a year. And the therapist would help you make a safety plan and put it into effect. Very, very good therapists are involved with this program, because it's very well compensated.

 

[WiseChoices]

Dear OW1, the fact that you are contemplating when is the best time to tell him with the least amount of damage to your home and career shows how much power and control your son has been allowed to have over you.

The way I see it,

 

[WiseChoices]

Ooops, my post got cut off somehow.

The way I see it, if you want him out the end of May, I would tell him a month ahead of time so he can make the proper arrangements. If you feel he needs 2 months to save up money etc , then I would tell him by the 30th of this month. In other words: the timing is on your terms and set out of necessity for you not out of fear. I would keep this announcement very simple , no explanations necessary. Something along the lines of that the current situation is no longer workable for you. If he gets in your face and scares you, call the cops. If he starts destroying anything, call the cops. Any display of violence, call the cops.

There is no need to beat yourself up about the past. It saws away at your own power. Come back to the strength you feel now, and work off of that. Your children are both sick. They are not bad but sick. You are now helping them to take responsibility for their own sickness. Just like if they had diabetes, you would not be responsible for them to go see their doctor, to pay for their insulin or to make sure they eat properly. You are doing the most loving thing you can do for them and yourself: to return everyone to their proper place of responsibility.

Think of the freedom you will feel when you come home to your own house and it is quiet and serene. Your sanctuary. Think of the joy you will feel opening your bank statement and having money available for your own self.

 

[Triedntrue]

A lot of good advice on here so i will keep it short. I believe that if you feel he will be violent when asked to leave you can ask for deputies or constables to be there to make sure that he does not get violent. My son is also a wall puncher and a thrower of whatever is handy. His ex did this.

On another note after he leaves i agree with changing locks i would also invest in an alarm system. Maybe even a nice big fur companion ( i would do this for the company as well as a warning system).