Boundaries...Please read Copa and Cedar...please answer. Thanks.

[Scent of Cedar *]

they’re at the abusive end of the spectrum and just like you don’t negotiate with terrorists, I wouldn’t negotiate with your emotional health.

I like this idea very much: ...and just like you don't negotiate with terrorists, you don't negotiate with your emotional health.

On the fridge it goes.

Terrorists are trying to frighten us into living afraid, too.

I had not thought of FOO issues in this way.

My boundary is that I don’t want to spend two hours on the phone with you draining the sh*t out of me

Yep.

They can and will try the guilt card but it’s best to stick to the facts. I appreciate that I came out of my mother’s womb or that somebody else did something for me, but that doesn’t mean that I owe boundary busts.

Stop trying to control outcomes. Let the chips fall where they may. I learned this the hard way with the wedding, the being ganged upon (apparently it’s called ‘family’) and going through a grieving process of sorts – people are going to say what they’re going to say, think what they’re going to think and do what they’re going to do, so it’s best to get on with the business of being you.

Part of that is to stop rethinking everything, looking for what we did that might have been unintentionaly offensive.

I will stop doing that.

Don’t be wishy-washy and passive. I know it’s easy to agree now, backtrack later or to make disagreeing noises or vague protestations without actually saying ‘No’ or whatever it is you’re being indirect about, but when you hint, that means no direct message and opening you up to negotiation. I offered to do something, they then asked for something else, I did say no but then I also sort of intimated that I might be able to do the other. This morning I said, “This is what I’m doing [the original offer]” and they accepted it. Be direct and firm.

Here is where the element of surprise comes in. Give an inch, take a mile.

They’re going to respond however they’re going to respond and experience has taught me that it’s best not to go around with your fancy-pants boundaries expecting people to be rewarding you, praising you, or even telling them about how you want things to be. Just get on with it.

Also, and this is more serious, I posted some very heavy stuff to both Cedar and you and I'm afraid for you to read what I sent (very much so), yet I hope you do read it and tell me the truth. The fact that I'm s hivering like a baby inside should tell you how heavy these were for me. You don't have to answer my questions about them. I will NOT be angry if you don't want to.

I do not see this, Serenity.

Will you send again, please?

I am glad for you that you took the courage to post whatever it was.

:O)

I will answer because I always learn so much about myself when I do.

I will go look again.

Cedar

 

[BusynMember]

Thanks. Cedar. Her no contact was to punish me. Every single time. It wasn't to protect her. She brags about it to others
Thanks for more clarity. It helps that others do get it.

 

[Scent of Cedar *]

Her no contact was to punish me. Every single time. It wasn't to protect her. She brags about it to others

Yes. I am ashamed that my family doesn't care enough about me to not go no contact. If I were trying to hurt them, I would be bragging that I had cut them off. But I would not do that, and neither would you. I am thinking the kind of people who do that get a power-over charge out of cutting us off. Maybe that is why your sister is so mad. She initiated no contact (again) but this time, you are not willing to take her back.

She is still playing FOO games.

How hurtful.

Cedar

 

[Copabanana]

Yes. I am ashamed that my family doesn't care enough about me to not go no contact.

That is not true, Cedar. They love and care about you as much as they are able. It is about control and power over, not love and care. Sadly, their need for the former trumps the latter. They are less for it, not you.

Maybe that is why your sister is so mad. She initiated no contact (again) but this time, you are not willing to take her back.

Yes. I agree. I think she went no contact because you set a limit. That you loved her more than to listen to her for yet more years go round and round about her abusive boyfriend.

She punished you for setting a limit. How dare you, Serenity? She is the one who gets to control everything (like my own sister.) And then? You decided you no longer would tolerate being punished by her, just for protecting her and yourself. For doing the right thing for both of you. Not for you. Not for her. For both of you.

Serenity, I wish you could accept you took the high road. For both of you. That you did the right thing. Nobody is expected to allow themselves to be destroyed by another person. Please try to understand this.

COPA

 

[Copabanana]

just like you don’t negotiate with terrorists

I missed this. I love it, too.

When somebody is degrading us, or hurting us continuously, (pretty much my whole family of origin fits these criteria, unfortunately, for me) there is no negotiating with them...because they have already shown by their crossing the line into terrorism...that they will not negotiate fairly...that conversation is not what they seek. Reciprocity, back and forth, they have rejected for power over. Because even in the case of my father...having chosen a life of degradation...insisted upon subjecting me to this, insisting I witness his sadism.

I had not a choice, but to leave.

I want to add this. Sometimes we indirectly accuse ourselves (and were accused by others) as being the problem because of our sensitivity.

Does the sensitivity of ISIS captives ever enter into the discussion?

Is the sadism, brutality, inhumanity and culpability of their captors ever considered to be even partially excused by taking into account individual differences of captives? No.

 

[BusynMember]

I am thinking the kind of people who do that get a power-over charge out of cutting us off. Maybe that is why your sister is so mad. She initiated no contact (again) but this time, you are not willing to take her back.

Yes. Thank you.