Honeymoon is over

[DammitJanet]

I second third or fourth the cig thing. Cory smoked from early teen years...still does. It was one battle I didnt fight.

Honestly....Your kid sounds SOOOOOOO much like Cory I wish those two could talk to each other some time. Cory really has some regrets and some words of wisdom. Unfortunately Cory lives on less that 700 bucks a month now and has no phone. Might mention that to your son as the results of what happens when you act like that.

 

[Wonderful Family]

You have to assume your son is at serious risk for a true suicide attempt. My sister was saying the same thing as a teenager, my mother just did this in October - both made very, very serious suicide attempts and are lucky to be alive today.

The one thing that always sticks in my head was the "successful suicide" attempt statistic among males diagnosed with bipolar - I've seen upwards of 30-37;. My son knows that I take any discussion like this 100% seriously and am vigilant about watching him. I'm sure this is just from my family experience; but I never take these comments lightly. He may not even understand that he may try something; but everything I see is a huge red flag for the planning portion. Be especially vigilant if he all of a sudden becomes calm and reasonable.

Long, I know, but below are my personal suggestions having been through everything but the smoking (difficult child was a tad bit younger than yours and despises the fact that I do smoke a little) - as you've heard before, nobody can diagnose here, but if your difficult child was like mine, he needed intensive medication management and it took time; but it kept difficult child going. My son was also days short of Residential Treatment Center (RTC) when he ended up in the psychiatric hospital program and we finally ended up on a medication combo that helped stabilize him:

First, call the psychiatric hospital ASAP and let them know what is going on - they are legally liable if something were to happen. Can you get your current psychiatrist involved?

If none of this works, here's what I would do:

A) You need a psychiatrist you can see ASAP. It doesn't matter what the diagnosis is - these docs are just more likely to be aggressive in treatment.
B) Take the list of docs as well as any other names that you have (go through the phone book if necessary) and start calling at 8:00 tomorrow morning. Leave numerous messages that your son is seriously depressed and at risk of suicide and that you need an appointment ASP. You will likely find a doctor that cares and get an appointment immediately. My son's current psychiatrist saw him when I took this approach and actually saw him after hours (and the name came off the BiPolar (BP) kids list) on the same day; even though his practice was completely full. Just be prepared to pay out-of-pocket and submit the claim to insurance. A bit pricey; but it saved my kid's life.
C) I agree with the others; don't worry about the smoking for the moment. You know if it's manipulation or not. What I learned is that appearing to be somewhat OK and rational does not mean that the kid really is. In other words, psychosis or other mental impairment is not always obvious. My son had no control when it looked like he did.
D) The last thing I did under this same situation was force interaction. It may not be what everyone else would suggest, but I did find that if I got difficult child outside for a few minutes, with a little exercise, he was a tiny bit better and it got us through another day. The other was constantly being in his face and trying to talk to him. It was always unpleasant (difficult child was not violent towards us at this time); and sometimes I wasn't quite so nice. Other times, we just did whatever he wanted even though he was treated as a prince just to keep going. What we found out afterwards is that he was listening even when he couldn't talk.

My son was almost completely catatonic at one point. In my difficult child's case, his reaction was to completely shut down instead of lashing out at others or himself; he still cannot relay emotions well. We spent months pulling difficult child off of roof tops, out of closets and from underneath his bed because he would try to hide. He would hide and literally sit with a black hood over his head and just rub his hands over and over and stare into space for hours (he was not trying to commit suicide and it was not because I mentioned being not so nice above!).

I do understand where you are coming from. It wasn't until I got very aggressive that we started to find some answers.

Most importantly, tell your son what you are trying to do to help. He doesn't need to know the details, just that you are seeking answers and that you love him. If you really think he is at risk for suicide, talk to him about it explicitly. You are not likely to give him new ideas.

 

[Jena]

Hey you

I"m so sorry to hear what he's going thru and what your enduring alone over there. Cutting is rough, it's impulsive, and it's a habit and it feels good to them. It's so hard to stop it's like us being told we can't have a cigarette.

Has anyone through the course of doctor's and stuff ever implemented a plan on what he "can" do when the urge to cut comes over him? I ran into this pretty badly the other night. Needless to say a plan was implemented that when the urge to cut was upon a person that they need to redirect it into actually doing something "silly" to redirect their brain and work on modifying the wiring. I'Tourette's Syndrome all new to me. The child picks a silly word a word they like, teenagers are using this technique by the way and when the urge overcomes them they write the word as many times as they need to. than another one was doing something an actual act it can be anything at all that they enjoy doing besides cutting or smoking. There's a list of 4 things that are placed on the wall of bedroom, and a list for their pocket. a reward is given weekly if the cutting is decreased. it sounds silly but i'm seeing stuff work i never would of imagined.

i agree with the others if this can't be handled and you have been trying so hard an Residential Treatment Center (RTC) would be best. def not foster care placement.

I'm sending you hugs and alot of support. sorry i'm so late to this i havne't been on.

 

[Ropefree]

Klmno: My position on the manipulation theme is this"I know my kid is going to try and manipulate me. I do not have to pay a dime for the effort"
Your son is aware that he has the diagnosis. You talk about it, he talks about it and it is the black hole around which HE has YOU tethered.

I am not hearing you are doing anything together at all but this manic type
game by the set of rules that set him in the center of attention recieving things that are not apropriate for him.

He gets a lot of power from you and also the stymulation of chaos and he does so with out earning any possitive attention in anyway. He is stealing from you and others...I assume you are not purchasing razor blades for his use to cut into his fleash, or tobacco which is not even legal to buy for him and give him, and he enters your private bedroom and steals the phone?
And this stymulation that he creates with great enthusiasm is learned behavior.

Somewhere you let drift off the boundaries IN YOUR HOME that are common scence. Yes he has mental issues. If he liked to swallow draino the problem would occur the one time. What he selects to keep you running around like a witless chicken are less than damaging and yet items that you readily place in his reach without him learning the lessons that inhibit the behavior.

In any other setting entering private space or even commonly shared space and taking any item that did not belong to him is a crime. Even in you home his theift is a crime. You teach him that he can do these things each time.
He gets a pay off. He gets the negative, outraged, fearfull, frightened, desperate you undivided. And he smokes, cuts, phones controls the phone and creates a disturbed environment.

What are his boundaries? And at his age what are his chores? What do you do with him to give him attention that is possitive?

Any place he is sent he will be required all these. He will not have cigerettes available, or razor blades to cut himself, or phone to steal use of. and he will be making his bed, cleaning, and required to ask permission to use a phone. Likely their will be ninky "stuff" to do and a community tv and when earned use of a supervised and controled computer, maybe.

I vote stop enabling the outrageous manic domination in your home. I think
YOU NEED a respite. Not time where you run yourself ragged to attempt to do MORE for him. He is ungrateful and and he likes making you work.
I have yet to meet a bi-polar who when manicly endulgent does otherwise.

You have to fed him. He does not have to like the food. You have to clothe him and he does not have to like these either. Take things away from him when he neglects to care for them everytime. Minimize the disorder and require he does do chores, his laundry, ect and read, his homework and not play type amusements. Say no mean it when you do and do not empower his enthusiasm to dwell on his off the mark thinking process where you are respocible for his mental state.

A bi-polar person has to cultivate a boring to them way of thinking. the spiralling into the extreme and being unaware of others and the behavior impact on others is dis-ease. they like doing it while they are in it. It is as
alluring as they act out on it displays.

His journey to a better mind set is lifelong with ups and downs that will not rest often. Let it be about him.

You can without fuss simply place the boundaries and restate them one time only as he "tests" and then "presses" and does WHATEVER.

Call the police over and over in one day if need be. Make the new path boundaries vividely apparent to him.

What has been going on in your home is teaching him to anticipate he will
be able to live as he wishes and that his mental health issue is the excuse.
Part of what is going on is mental illness he has. it is true. That part is not so readily teased out of the part where you are giving him a pay off of things and attention and the intensity of atmoshpere that he is co-creating with you.

You have been his support group and he does need support. You can make the relationship safe by making him behave to recieve your attention and what you give him be appropriate.

Not a tobacco habit or theift lifesyle. Try to bare in mind he has the mental illness and you are the adult in charge.

when you decide that your time and quality of life matter then he will "feel"
the motivation to behave. If not then give him other oppertunities with others to learn those lessons. However the fact that the rules in your home are allowing him these behavior extremes will not change until you change it.