Indigo Child?? Feedback appreciated
- Thread starter Tanya M
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SuZir
Well-Known Member
Around the time I learnt about this indigo child thing, it wasn't about kids themselves identifying as indigos (of course as I said, it was over a decade ago, or more like two decades soon so most born after the cut off weren't able yet.) To me it felt more like parents, well mothers, to be exact, not being able to come to terms with the fact that their kid was special in the 'special needs' way and preferring to explain their children's issues with some other way.
I did every attachment parenting, cloth diaper, green, hippy, tree-hugging things fashionable at the time with Joy and in those circles I got to know this mother who ranted me about the indigo children (likely especially to me because difficult child was clearly showing signs of specialness too.) Looking back, her older kid, who she identified being Indigo Child, was likely either with ADHD with some asperger traits or high end asperger kid with lots of ADHD mixed in. I lost contact after Joy's toddler years, so I don't know how this indigo kid is doing nowadays.
I did every attachment parenting, cloth diaper, green, hippy, tree-hugging things fashionable at the time with Joy and in those circles I got to know this mother who ranted me about the indigo children (likely especially to me because difficult child was clearly showing signs of specialness too.) Looking back, her older kid, who she identified being Indigo Child, was likely either with ADHD with some asperger traits or high end asperger kid with lots of ADHD mixed in. I lost contact after Joy's toddler years, so I don't know how this indigo kid is doing nowadays.
Scent of Cedar *
Well-Known Member
Ouch.
Here are some quotes. The first is Einstein regarding religion. The second is a Jewish wisdom quote. The third is from a book interpreting the meaning behind some of the wonderings in the Jewish Kabalah.
***
"To know that what is impenetrable to us really exists, manifesting itself to us as the highest wisdom and the most radiant beauty, which our dull faculties can comprehend only in their most primitive forms ~ this knowledge, this feeling, is at the center of all true religiousness. In this sense, and in this sense only, I belong to the ranks of devoutly religious men."
Albert Einstein
"Both you and the other came naked into the world, and will eventually sleep in the dust, together."
Jewish Wisdom Quote
"If we could eliminate the space between the nucleus of the atoms that comprise our body, all of the physical matter of the body would compact into something smaller than a grain of sand. In other words, we are a grain of matter scattered through five or six feet of space, held together by electromagnetic forces that nobody has been able to measure."
Cooper
God is a Via (?)
Kaballah
***
And here is one just for you, Tanya:
"Layers, crusts, and shells which may have been built up over years become brittle, break apart, and begin to disappear. Muscles relax. And a realization dawns that a personal daystar has begun to shine, giving us its light."
Maria Harris
Dance of the Spirit
Cedar
There's so much truth in this statement. It was not easy for me to accept the fact that my son was not a good kid but a trouble maker so I can see where some parents would opt for the "Indigo Child" version.
Denial is not just a river in Egypt
BusynMember
Well-Known Member
I recall, and I'm sure it will happen again, many parents with young "special" children who say "he is so smart, has such a high IQ that he is bored and acts out." That is actually giving credence to the idea of The Indigo Child. In essence the mothers are so desperate for an explanation that does not include a disorder or mental illness that they are saying that their child is too brilliant to behave in this world and nobody has been able to handle his extraordinary intelligence.
While many of our challenged adult children have very high IQs, many don't. Many are average. Many are below average. And most academically gifted people do not go around telling their parents that they hate them and breaking every rule of society. That is actually a personality problem, not due to giftedness or anything other than either a neurological disorder, a mental illness, or a personality disorder. But this "my child is so gifted that he can't behave" is a form of the Indigo Child mindset, at least in my opinion. We all know how desperate you can feel as a parent.
While many of our challenged adult children have very high IQs, many don't. Many are average. Many are below average. And most academically gifted people do not go around telling their parents that they hate them and breaking every rule of society. That is actually a personality problem, not due to giftedness or anything other than either a neurological disorder, a mental illness, or a personality disorder. But this "my child is so gifted that he can't behave" is a form of the Indigo Child mindset, at least in my opinion. We all know how desperate you can feel as a parent.
SuZir
Well-Known Member
I do believe high IQ, especially with more challenging temperament type*, can be a root of certain behavioural issues especially with young kids and in group settings like school. Young kids, even the most typical ones, do not have much patience, nor are they very good at self-regulation. So if they are bored, they are bored and come up something to entertain themselves and often that something may not be something adults would prefer. Difference to our g f gs come in certain areas; these kids are not behind in skill development and their self-regulation etc. skills are at age level. I have known few kids like that, who seemed to be always in trouble at kindergarten and school and some were even very stressed out at home and behaving badly because of that, but after parents and teachers worked out the solutions so that kid weren't bored anymore, and didn't have to just sit and wait or do same, very easy to them, stuff over and over again, the behavioural problems disappeared. but difference to for example my difficult child, who is also high IQ, was rather clear in that those kids didn't have skill development issues mine had.
*I have been meaning to tip you to this direction many times MWM, but have always forgotten. I think you could find temperament study that is rather hot research area around here in developmental psychology, quite interesting. Here is a bit for starters from Wikipedia: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Temperament_and_Character_Inventory
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BusynMember
Well-Known Member
Ah, thank you, Suzir. I love reading opinions and research on stuff like that. Thank you.
I think you are right too that certain kids who can not self-regulate and get bored can be troublesome. 37 was one...he would finish his work then do the "class clown" act while his peers were trying hard to finish their work. However, his lack of ability to self-regulate caused him trouble in many aspects of life...and still does!
I think you are right too that certain kids who can not self-regulate and get bored can be troublesome. 37 was one...he would finish his work then do the "class clown" act while his peers were trying hard to finish their work. However, his lack of ability to self-regulate caused him trouble in many aspects of life...and still does!
Childofmine
one day at a time
My first response is "what!!!???"
My second is "hey if it works for you and you're not relying on others for your upkeep go for it."
But...all around...sounds like someone who is really exhausting and difficult.
Best taken in very small doses.
My second is "hey if it works for you and you're not relying on others for your upkeep go for it."
But...all around...sounds like someone who is really exhausting and difficult.
Best taken in very small doses.
My son does have a high IQ. When he was in school he was bored. I worked with his teachers and he was given more "challenging" work. The problem was, he would do the work and do it well but would not turn it in. I have always been amazed at how my son can read a book and retain all the information but in my opinion, where he falls short is that he does not temper any of it with common sense. He truly believes that because he retains information so well that he is an authority on whatever the subject matter. Intelligence has never been the issue with him, common sense on the other hand and how to use his intelligence is the problem. One year my son made my husband a knife for his birthday. He read a book on how to forge the steel, how the knife should be weighted, how the handle should fit your hand, etc.... It is a really nice knife. We took it to a knife show to see what a professional thought of it, he was amazed that it was a "first" attempt, he told us our son could have a great career. When I told my son about this and gave him the mans business card his response was "I know I'm good, I know I can do it, I don't need to do anymore"
He is also a very talented artist. Most of his drawings are very dark but good, the detail is amazing. I encouraged him to go to art school, again it was met with the "I know I'm good, I don't need school to teach me anything" He learned how to do tattoos. Again, he was very good at it, he had a following of people who wanted him to do their "ink" He even found some guy willing to help him start his own business, this guy believed in him enough to front him 10K. He found a place to rent and opened up his shop. That only lasted about 3 months and he blamed the guy who fronted him the money with the failure claiming that he didn't give him enough money. He had convinced "manipulated" this guy into thinking that he knew how to manage a business and could take care of the bookkeeping. The money that was supposed to be used for paying the rent and utilities the first few months until the business was established, instead my son used the money to buy more expensive equipment and to also party on.
So now he's had this "epiphany" that he is an Indigo Child and he's going to "save the world"
I hope this new found enlightenment works for him and lasts longer than his other endeavors. Perhaps this will help him to stay off the booze, pot and other drugs, will keep him from stealing and ending up in jail.
Jabberwockey
Well-Known Member
Yup, pretty much it.
But marijuana isn't a drug! Its a naturally occurring substance that makes it SOOOOO superior to alcohol because alcohol is man made.
RIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIGHT (In my best Dr Evil voice)
Jabberwockey
Well-Known Member
And yes, I had many a conversation with our son as he tried in vain to convince me of "The New Morality" and that my values were old fashioned and out dated. Threw a monkey wrench into the gears of his argument when I agreed that my values were old fashioned. Pissed him off when I followed up with out dated or not, My House My Rules!
SeekingStrength
Well-Known Member
The first time I ever heard of Indigo Children was a couple years ago from my two youngest. They were discussing that Jen McCarthy was claiming her child was an Indigo Child (she believed different "diagnoses" before and after).
I was curious and Googled the term.
To me, it seems like an Hey, I'm special and do not choose to accept any other explanations (which require work on my part).
Not being a fan of J McCarthy may figure into my take on the fact I think it is totally nuts. When she left the tv show for a radio stint, husband commented that nobody would be interested in what J McCarthy says on the radio, lol. She was not popular for her thoughts, according to him.
I was curious and Googled the term.
To me, it seems like an Hey, I'm special and do not choose to accept any other explanations (which require work on my part).
Not being a fan of J McCarthy may figure into my take on the fact I think it is totally nuts. When she left the tv show for a radio stint, husband commented that nobody would be interested in what J McCarthy says on the radio, lol. She was not popular for her thoughts, according to him.
I had several people try to convince me that Wiz was an Indigo Child. The whole thing made me gag. My biggest problem was that Wiz didn't need ANY more reasons to think he was better than everyone else, he had a super huge helping of that already. One idiot relative went so far as to tell WIZ that he was Indigo and it meant he was special and a new breed of human and we should all follow his lead and not 'stifle' him or insist he follow our rules - we should revere him and follow HIS rules.
Yeah, that relative got about the biggest chewing out that I ever gave, even if I hadn't ever chewed her out before. I actually forced her to tell Wiz that she was very wrong to say that and that Indigo was just an excuse for children to be rude and badly behaved. It was not a good time in our relationship, let me tell you. The threat of cutting off her contact with Wiz was not made lightly, but her Indigo nonsense made not only my life and my hubby and other kids' lives more difficult, it made Wiz' life at school and other places more difficult. No one is allowed to do that to my kids and stay in contact with them with-o working to make it better.
I have zero patience for this. There is no biological basis to claim an ADHD or special needs child is a new type of human. They are homo sapiens sapiens just like the rest of us, period. Most of our kids with problems don't need ANY more encouragement to feel they are better than us and are entitled to have and do and say whatever they want. Not only is it permission for the child to be badly behaved, it gives the parent a way to abdicate parenting that child. Mom can say, "Well, I can't do anything about Jonny not following the rules. He is an Indigo and you should follow his rules." I actually have heard parents tell a soccer coach and some teachers this when spoken to about their children's behavior. I always wondered what should happen if 2 or 3 Indigos were in the same group with different ideas about what to do - which one do you follow if they are all so special? Of course no one wants to discuss that. Indigos shouldn't have to compromise, after all!
SuZir's reaction may be best. I am lucky that it was pretty easy to get Wiz to not buy into this back when it was introduced to him.
Why does your son want to make you atheist like him? Mostly to tear down something important to you that has rules for behavior that are not convenient to him. I highly doubt it is philosophical in reasoning. It sounds like it is a way to be different or separate from the family and to create more justifications for his behaviors. My own brother used to claim to be atheist all the time. It was NOT because he had any strong belief in a lack of a God, it was mostly to upset my folks. Poor guy, it didn't work because my folks insisted on educating us in a religion until we were old enough to think things through for ourselves, and the they insisted on allowing us to make our own religious choices as to beliefs as long as we didn't hurt anyone and respected the beliefs of others. He wanted a hot button to push to upset my parents and I and tried very very very hard to make religion that button. It drove him completely bonkers that he failed completely. Then he turned to other religions and tried to upset us by claiming to believe in them. He tried to be atheist real hard, but still had to attend his catholic school even when I went to a public school. He wasn't in the school because he was Catholic. He was there because it was strict and he was on the way to juvenile hall.
So he then was Buddhist. Around that time a cousin had a Buddhist wedding. It was beautiful and amazing and did not upset anyone in the family. So being Buddhist was out. On and on, one after another, he desperately tried to make SOMEONE in the family upset about religion. Again and again, he failed.
Now he doesn't bring it up. He tried to insist his daughter go to other religion's services but that fizzled out because he doesn't like to go to group functions. He is a true individual, after all. Just ask him.
I think your son may be trying to do what my bro tried for so long to accomplish. He wants to create drama and a reason to do what he wants. If he can get you to believe in atheism, he will feel he has succeeded in taking something you rely on away from you. He will then see you as vulnerable and malleable, able to be pushed into whatever he wants to push you into.
Yeah, that relative got about the biggest chewing out that I ever gave, even if I hadn't ever chewed her out before. I actually forced her to tell Wiz that she was very wrong to say that and that Indigo was just an excuse for children to be rude and badly behaved. It was not a good time in our relationship, let me tell you. The threat of cutting off her contact with Wiz was not made lightly, but her Indigo nonsense made not only my life and my hubby and other kids' lives more difficult, it made Wiz' life at school and other places more difficult. No one is allowed to do that to my kids and stay in contact with them with-o working to make it better.
I have zero patience for this. There is no biological basis to claim an ADHD or special needs child is a new type of human. They are homo sapiens sapiens just like the rest of us, period. Most of our kids with problems don't need ANY more encouragement to feel they are better than us and are entitled to have and do and say whatever they want. Not only is it permission for the child to be badly behaved, it gives the parent a way to abdicate parenting that child. Mom can say, "Well, I can't do anything about Jonny not following the rules. He is an Indigo and you should follow his rules." I actually have heard parents tell a soccer coach and some teachers this when spoken to about their children's behavior. I always wondered what should happen if 2 or 3 Indigos were in the same group with different ideas about what to do - which one do you follow if they are all so special? Of course no one wants to discuss that. Indigos shouldn't have to compromise, after all!
SuZir's reaction may be best. I am lucky that it was pretty easy to get Wiz to not buy into this back when it was introduced to him.
Why does your son want to make you atheist like him? Mostly to tear down something important to you that has rules for behavior that are not convenient to him. I highly doubt it is philosophical in reasoning. It sounds like it is a way to be different or separate from the family and to create more justifications for his behaviors. My own brother used to claim to be atheist all the time. It was NOT because he had any strong belief in a lack of a God, it was mostly to upset my folks. Poor guy, it didn't work because my folks insisted on educating us in a religion until we were old enough to think things through for ourselves, and the they insisted on allowing us to make our own religious choices as to beliefs as long as we didn't hurt anyone and respected the beliefs of others. He wanted a hot button to push to upset my parents and I and tried very very very hard to make religion that button. It drove him completely bonkers that he failed completely. Then he turned to other religions and tried to upset us by claiming to believe in them. He tried to be atheist real hard, but still had to attend his catholic school even when I went to a public school. He wasn't in the school because he was Catholic. He was there because it was strict and he was on the way to juvenile hall.
So he then was Buddhist. Around that time a cousin had a Buddhist wedding. It was beautiful and amazing and did not upset anyone in the family. So being Buddhist was out. On and on, one after another, he desperately tried to make SOMEONE in the family upset about religion. Again and again, he failed.
Now he doesn't bring it up. He tried to insist his daughter go to other religion's services but that fizzled out because he doesn't like to go to group functions. He is a true individual, after all. Just ask him.
I think your son may be trying to do what my bro tried for so long to accomplish. He wants to create drama and a reason to do what he wants. If he can get you to believe in atheism, he will feel he has succeeded in taking something you rely on away from you. He will then see you as vulnerable and malleable, able to be pushed into whatever he wants to push you into.
BusynMember
Well-Known Member
Oh, good ole Jenny McCarthy who says her autistic son is "cured." Not better because she was able to afford live-in interventions for him. Cured.
Parents of differently wired kids do it too.
Can animals be Indigo? I swear I have an Indigo Yorkie mix.
Jabberwockey
Well-Known Member
Had to look up Jenny McCarthy because, while I recognize the name, I really have no idea who she is. Whenever an entertainer starts spouting their knowledge of politics, medicine, economic development, or whatever the current hot button is, unless they have proof of their expertise (you know, that pesky little piece of paper called a college DEGREE!) I pretty much ignore them. How pathetic is it that the only thing I recognize her from was Baseketball by the creators of South Park?!?!
Reading up on her, I caught that she refers to herself as indigo and her child is crystal. I looked it up and found this link. http://www.angeltherapy.com/blog/indigo-crystal-and-rainbow-children
Read the first few paragraphs and had to shut it down because it was giving me the urge to go club a baby seal or drill for oil! Just kidding! But that kind of hippy dippy Everyone Is Special everyone wins so there are no losers lets fire the coach because he had the audacity to win the game by too many points hurting the feelings of the other team WE'RE ALL ENTITLED crap makes me want to hurt someone.
Yeah, a former Playboy centerfold turned actress/activists tells me that mercury in the vaccine is causing autism but a scientist tells me its not, guess who has credibility with me and therefore gets my attention?!
Thus endeth my rant.
Reading up on her, I caught that she refers to herself as indigo and her child is crystal. I looked it up and found this link. http://www.angeltherapy.com/blog/indigo-crystal-and-rainbow-children
Read the first few paragraphs and had to shut it down because it was giving me the urge to go club a baby seal or drill for oil! Just kidding! But that kind of hippy dippy Everyone Is Special everyone wins so there are no losers lets fire the coach because he had the audacity to win the game by too many points hurting the feelings of the other team WE'RE ALL ENTITLED crap makes me want to hurt someone.
Yeah, a former Playboy centerfold turned actress/activists tells me that mercury in the vaccine is causing autism but a scientist tells me its not, guess who has credibility with me and therefore gets my attention?!
Thus endeth my rant.
Jabberwockey
Well-Known Member
Yeah, saw that in the Wiki article on her. I only recognize her as the, and I use this term loosely!, actress from Baseketball who was in all the sexual innuendo scenes. At one point she walked in wearing silver lipstick carrying an unchromed trailer hitch, hands it to a guy and says "Finished". Not someone I'm going to go to for medical advice, thank you very much.
Lil
Well-Known Member
Jabberwockey
Well-Known Member
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