She will never be normal, will she?

[Stick a Fork in Me]

Ha! Love the tequila story.

I think I've been running to the shelter of mother's little helper too often as it is, though. I need to cut back before my pants stop fitting.

And I have a feeling you have some more claims to fame, star. You're holding out on us.

 

[DammitJanet]

LOL...you are very perceptive! Star has many many claims to fame! Stealing donkeys is one...lol. Dont let her get near your manger or she will steal your ummm...donkey! And watch out for Witzend...she is very good at kicking backside over to Star!

 

[witzend]

"She's writing her own story - you're only a small chapter in it so stop making her the center of yours. Go live your life the best you can and the example will be the best thing you can offer her."

I remember hearing an interview with someone (it escapes me who, right now) who was famous in their own right, whose famous father had written his memoirs including times when he was a boy. He said it was very strange to read the book and realize that he was not the main character in the story - in fact he was a small part of the story, and nothing was told from his own point of view. But when he thought about it, he realized that they each had their own story to tell, and if he were telling his, his father would be a minor character in his story.

Keep that in mind while you go through this time with her. Eventually your life will become your own again.

FWIW, we've all done things we regretted. Even parents with perfect children. Life is a learning process, and that part was a difficult one for both of you. It's likely that neither of you will make that mistake again.

 

[Nomad]

I am so sorry...I do hope you will make your way back to your therapist.

Your child has bipolar disorder. This is a life-long situation. She will need to take medication and will likely also need therapy. However, you can not force her to do these things. Just like with "regular" teens and/or young adults, these choices are their own. So, although there is a biological difficulty here that is greatly influencing her behavior, people...even those who are unwell, are still accountable to themselves and others. They still can make the decision to take steps for help....so that they don't hurt themselves or others.

How can you be accountable for this biological problem? It is something that just happened. Likewise, how can you be accountable for her decisions, especially those she makes as an adult?

All you can do, if you are able to do it, is provide her with opportunities that would be beneficial to her. For example, if you can...offer to take her to the doctor. Offer to take her to a therapist or find low cost therapy, etc. However, once again, it is her choice if she will take part in these things that will help her. I would not put toooo much energy into this help, just make offers when you are able and make sure she does the work....puts some work into it.

Of utmost concern is how down you are on yourself. Are you in therapy? Have you seen a doctor about how you feel? How are your sleeping habits?

Although it has got to be very tough, try not to hate her. Understand that MUCH of her attitude/behavior stems from her illness.

Instead, protect yourself and your emotions by detaching from it all. Yes, it is a "loss." Almost like a death of sorts. You realize that this child is never going to get totally well and there is a chance that she wont improve. But keep in mind, improvement is "on her," not on you.

Please get yourself back to your therapist. Are you able to take some kind of little vacation? If your daughter lives at home, could someone stay at your home to watch over things? It's time for a reprieve and time to find that therapist's phone number.

Please take a gooood look at what Bean said....the only real change you can make is the one you make for YOURself. Talk with- you therapist about your ultimate goals...starting with wanting to feel better/get rid of all the anger and pain.

 

[KTMom91]

I have no other advice...who could say it better than Star? However, I did want to add my support. I understand. Sending many hugs and good thoughts.

 

[Stick a Fork in Me]

...

2) Check with her doctor about her medications. She may need something tweeked.

I should mention that she's been prescribed symbyax (for the bipolar) and ambien (for SEVERE insomnia which runs in the family - I suffered from it horribly until I was almost 40) and she refuses to take either. The symbyax makes her amazingly wonderfully human, but she sleeps a lot and she's so used to not sleeping that she thinks it's abnormal, and she hates the heavy drugged feeling of the ambien (for which I'm actually kind of grateful... and the fact that the ambien is still sitting on her dresser tells me she doesn't have a larger drug problem).

She thinks pot is the only drug she needs.

So she's decidedly improperly medicated and taking a drug that increases her depression (which I guess makes her self-medicated, like so many who suffer from mental illness). Her rage is actually lessened on the pot but the constant use of it has her being completely useless for anything else. She just doesn't care.

 

[katya02]

I just wanted to stop in and say hello and welcome, even if late ... I wrote up a long reply yesterday, lost it in the ether (my computer sneakily logged me out somehow while I was writing), and then had to go pick up one of my sons.

By now people have said everything I could possibly say, except that I too empathize with you and have stood in your shoes. The grief, the loss, the mourning are intense. But ... I love the quote from the therapist about writing one's own story and letting our kids write theirs. That's what I'm trying to do right now. Since my difficult child has been living away from home it's been so much easier to detach and let him live his life, and get on with mine. He's still in my life and in my heart, but I'm not feeling that if I could just fix him I'd be a better mother. Some things are not within my ability to fix. I've done my best all these years; I'd do a few things differently if I had it to do over, but I don't, so I don't fantasize about that. I have new things to do now and my focus is to do the best I can with those.

Sending support and understanding, and hoping you'll link up with that therapist again and take some time for yourself.

 

[hearts and roses]

I feel this obligation to get her through school. Once that's done (or if she drops out) she can take off and live in the park if that makes her happy.

That was my big thing with my difficult child (and I totally understand your feelings about her not being a 'gift'). I just wanted her to graduate - beyond that I felt she was on her own. I worked so closely with her teachers along the way. And then the director of her school asked me why. Along with all the talk of detachment here and then some issues with my sister...I sought out some counseling to deal with my sister issues and learned about the beauty and gift of detaching with love. Yes, you can detach with love and it is a most amazing experience. After difficult child graduated and was sponging off us, making our life a living he// (she was also 18 senior year), I kicked her booty out.

After she left, I went into her room and threw out bagloads of junk and packed the rest up into plastic bins. Her room was bare. When it seemed she was ready to behave, we allowed her back in. Big mistake. Tack on another year of he//. My marriage suffered, my relationships suffered, but most of all I suffered. Did difficult child suffer? No, I really don't think so. Perhaps in her own way or what she perceived her suffering to be. in my opinion, she suffered wasted time.

After months of practicing healthy detachment from my sister, I began using the techniques I learned with difficult child. We stopped giving her gas money, we took her car off the road, we didn't drive her anywhere, we were civil but refused to get pulled into her her vortex of negativity and self pity. All we kept saying was, "Get a job. Money equals freedom." She was seeing this absolute waste of skin loser who we named Monkeyboy and they were big into smoking pot and drinking. Not my problem, as long as it wasn't done at my home, which it wasn't - she knew we wouldn't tolerate it. The one time I found a bong and pipe, I smashed them and threw them out and told her so.

My H had some real difficulty being able to detach so they were still going at it to an extent - arguing, saying hateful and mean things. At several points, difficult child threw things at him, once a cup of hot tea. That was a lovely Thanksgiving. Anyway, I eventually said to her, with tears in my eyes, "I love you honey, but you need to leave here. You need to go find your way, figure out what you need to do." And she agreed and left. For about a week. Hahaha - you thought there was going to be some miracle, huh?

No, she came back home, because who would have her for an extended time? Where could she crash for free? I continued to practice detachment, I strengthened my friendships outside my home, I began treating myself to a pedicure or manicure now and again, met my best friend for coffee every Saturday; I began counseling and basically started to turn the focus more onto myself and my H and less on her. What happened? No miracles, but slowly she lost interest in Monkeyboy seeing him for the loser he was, she got a job, she earned her car back. She now pays H insurance money every month, she helps around the house, she is respectful and downright loving at times. Currently she's been dating a guy who is 29 - she is 20 - I call him her "old man" (lol). But you know what? He's past all that drinking and drugging. He works a lot, he's kind to difficult child, respectful of us and our house rules. Granted he has to two kids, but instead of freaking about that not being the best of situations for difficult child, I instead chuckle to myself of the irony involved with her being a step parent one day...as she was a very unwilling stepchild! Hahaha - the joke is on her. It's not as easy as it may seem. I have to hand it to my H, he loves her no matter what.

And like others here, I also felt like I hated her, just wanted her gone, didn't even care how it happened - "just go away already and leave me alone!" is how I felt most days. I could feel my stomach churn when I'd hear her coming in late at night, disrupting my house. I often skipped dinner so I didn't have to sit next to her and hear her lies and BS stories or smell her. God, take a shower already; you reek! But I digress....

I guess the bottom line message from me would go along with what everyone here has already said. Find a way to focus more on YOU, learn how to detach lovingly. I have to agree that it's very imporant for you to convey to your daughter that you do love her and that's why you need to let her go should you choose to kick her out. I am on the fence about calling in the police EVER, but if you feel that's your only alternative, then so be it. When difficult child would be storming around and yelling at us/me, I would turn and say, "Oh, but I love you honey" and that would just really send her over the edge, but it helped me to keep things light.

The fact is, she is not behaving in the way you want people to behave in your home. She thinks she is smarter and cooler than you and that she can do it on her own so I say, "prove it" and give her the opportunity to go it alone, fall on her face, pick herself back up and do whatever. She will be left with no one to blame but herself.

I am not one who thinks at 18 the big magic lightbulb goes off and they suddenly 'get it'. But I also don't think that we as parents need to be so giving of ourselves, sacrificing of our lives, etc. Infants, small children, preteens, sure, we all sacrifice for our kids. But as they grow through their teens and into early adulthood - not so much. How else will they figure out how to navigate through REAL life if we don't give them the opportunity? What's the worst that will happen if she doesn't graduate HS? Really? One day she will have to get her GED or go to some trade school as an adult. So what? Once I stopped worrying and intervening on difficult child's behalf, she HAD to work with her teachers and a miracle did happen! She graduated, barely scraped through, but she graduated. She had a 54 in Civics and on her final, after many afternoons studying with her teacher, she scored a 92 on the final. Miracles do happen. Sometimes. Usually when you least expect them.

In the meantime, go get a pedicure, meet a friend for lunch or cocktails. Call an old friend and catch up, clean out your house - whatever helps you de-stress. But definitely call a therapist to help you work through this. It will get worse before it gets better and you will need the support of a professional. Sending big giant gentle hugs to your hurting mommy heart.

 

[Star*]

I think that Symba medicine would magically disappear off her dresser and every little oreo and bowl of Kix and oatmeal would be (said like the wicked witch on the Wizard of Oz) "SPrrrrrrinkled, Sprrrrrrrrrinkled" into her food.

Does it come in an herbal form she could smoke?

 

[Stick a Fork in Me]

I wish I could tell you all how much you speak directly to my soul!

Several things said here made lightbulbs and lightning flashes go off in my mind.

Asking why it's so important to me that she graduates was actually quite interesting. My standby has always been that if she's not a full-time student I can't insure her, but at the end of the day that's pretty much a cyclical rationalization. She can choose to be insured or not.

I've done my best all these years; I'd do a few things differently if I had it to do over, but I don't, so I don't fantasize about that. I have new things to do now and my focus is to do the best I can with those.

Wow. That is so true I don't even know how to absorb it!!! LOL. I'm really stuck in blame and explanations, though I realize that even if I had all those answers, I couldn't do a damned thing about it now.

I've printed out the detachment article and also had my husband read it. I think I'll be reading it a lot over the next few weeks.

Thank you all so much. Your kindness means a lot to me. And your wisdom and experience are priceless.

 

[BusynMember]

Ok, sweetie, I'm going to give you a kernel of hope to hang onto. I did feel like you once, when my daughter was doing drugs. I loved her, don't get me wrong, but I was sickened by the addict she had become. We made her leave.

For the record, so that you know it can be worse, pot was very tame for her. She was also snorting ADHD drugs (they cut them in pillcrushers and snort them alone or with coke), over the counter drugs, ecstacy, she tried heroine twice (yes, I thought you were an addict the first time, but it's not true) and an assortment of other drugs that I can't even name because I am not familiar with the drug culture. She also drank like a fish and smoked cigarettes (minor, I know, compared with the rest). She was this way from age twelve (yes 12) and it continued at age eighteen. Fast forward...

We made her leave and she begged her straight arrow brother to let her live in his basement. He lives in another state. He came and got her and set the rules down. She followed them. She got a job and walked to work (three car accidents and she had no license). She had to clean his house and cook. She did it. She quit drugs and drinking (telling me it wasn't easy as she was addicted to meth). She was lonely for a while, but she gradually met her boyfriend of eight years now. She is in culinary school now, working and getting straight A's and cooking up a storm for all of us on the holidays. Yum! She is into natural and organic foods. She does not party anymore and calls those who do "immature. They need to stop, like I did." She bought a house with her boyfriend, mostly because of HER good credit. She is 25 1/2. She quit drugs sometime when she was 19. She quit cigarettes too and nobody whines more than her when anybody lights up a cigarette. She insists on a smoke-free home. She told me she had wanted to quit drugs earlier, but it was easier to do it once she moved away from her "friends." Her "friends" would pressure her into doing drugs when she tried to quit.

I guess the moral of the story is that some kids turn it around later in life. My daughter had some really bad things happen to her as a child and drugs helped numb the pain, but she wanted to change and she did. She tells me the kicker was when she saw a friend with track marks up and down her arms and thought, "OMG! That will be me if I don't stop!"

Keep the Faith. Your daughter is young. Perhaps she needs a change of scenery. Do you have anyone who would take her in? Sometimes our kids listen better to others than to us (like my daughter obeyed her older brother). If not, I would not blame you if you set down rules and made her leave if she discarded them.

(((Hugs))) from one who has been in the drug-fogged trenches. I wish you a good ending...it is possible. It really, really is.

She did not get treatment. She refused treatment. She did it on her own.

 

[Nomad]

Read real fast...my apologies if I missed some things.

I too wanted our difficult child to graduate from HS. I'm kinda happy that she did. HOWEVER, it really took a toll on me. I really gave up a lot to help her...to help make it happen. In the end, I'm not toally convinced it was worth it. But, I do not regret it. Afterwards, I decided...no more extraordinary efforts on my part for her benefit. Besides, she was approaching age 18...and I was pulling back FAST. Now that she is 21, she is out of the home and we are detached (for the most part) and it is gooood.

(So glad you are reading/re-reading that detachment link...the letting go/grow poem is particularly good!)

I agree with- K. "some things are not with-i my ability to fix." Amen sister! I can provide a little help, say a little prayer and hope for the best. Our difficult children have to pull their own weight. IF it is with-i our ability, and they are not taking advantage, we might provide "some" limited assistance. That's about it. By and large ,they have to do it themselves...no different really than anyone else. It is NOT with-i our ability to FIX the situation.

I agree with- S. do let your daughter know that you love her, but make it clear that you will not be burdened by HER poor choices in life. That life moves on for you. Do set some boundaries.

Also like what J. had to say. It might sound a little weird..but call a friend, go out for some coffee and go get a manicure or something like that that you enjoy.

This stuff is extremely hard....but you are very limited in what you can do (or should do). You can not fix it...an important point to remember.

It's up to your difficult child to get help for herself, to look at the situation differently, to make different choices...these things are up to HER.

In the mean time...don't miss out on all that life has to offer YOU. Don't short change yourself.

Hope you were able to make an apt. with- your therapist.

 

[Robinboots]

Wow. I get it, I really do. I wonder the same thing, like what is this punishment for?? I'm being hit by the karma bus and don't even really know why.

But see, back in the day, people had kids (duh!) and they raised them, end of story. The last few decades, we've been programmed to think that our kids accomplishments (and disappointments and issues) belong to US - that however they turn out is BECAUSE of what we, as parents, did or did not do.

THAT IS NOT TRUE!

A baby will walk and talk when he's darn good and ready - if it's early, we take credit, if it's later, we stress and worry. Parents, all of us, need to get over it already - kids are individuals, not extensions of us. You can do everything "right" and they can still turn out "wrong".

We have five. Four (well, three, mostly) are perfectly fine - jury is still out on my stepson, he's kinda weird, in my humble opinion! But the other one - dear God. The one I'm here for, ya know - you have got to get to the place where you realize it's NOT your fault. And it's hard, because so many outside your immediate family assume it IS you. And that, my friend, stinks big time.

But you aren't alone.

 

[Stick a Fork in Me]

I put all my eggs (figuratively and literally) in one basket.

Maybe if I'd had more than one and any had turned out normal it would be easier not to despise myself. I had only the one, so I'm at 100% fail rate.

 

[katya02]

The idea that we pass/fail as parents depending on what our kids choose to do is problematic. Yes, we have a duty to nurture, to love, and to teach. We have a duty to provide physical, emotional, intellectual (insofar as we're able), and many would say spiritual necessities to our children. I'd wager that you did this; we all did. The thing is, children are individuals apart from us and they have choices. Every child comes with an individual temperament, reactivity level, and personality that makes him/her unique and independent of environment. Sure, environment has an effect. But individual characteristics trump environment.

Criminals come from the best possible environments and caring, law-abiding people come from the worst circumstances imaginable. Kids with problems come from precisely the same circumstances, the same families, as kids who overcome whatever challenges are inherent in those circumstances. (I'm talking personality and behavior here, not medical problems and challenges.)

We can and should provide the attachment, the trust and human relationship, the teaching of values and spirituality, and the physical necessities that our children need to become adult human beings. Beyond that it's more in their court than ours. And I've become convinced that too much protection, too much smoothing of their paths, ends up being detrimental. I'm not talking about issues of medical care, I mean things like always running interference with the teachers at school, or smoothing things over with neighbors who have suffered in some way from a child's actions, or taking care of all practical issues as a child becomes an adult. Those are the things that wear us down and make us resentful and they're exactly what we would do better to let our kids 'own'.

So there's no basket and there's no pass/fail scale that depends on 'results'. We bring other people into the world and have obligations to them that we lovingly fulfill, but that is where the pass/fail meter lies, not in who our children decide to be. It's been hard for me to come to grips with the idea that the way my children 'turn out' is not the scale on which my worth as a person depends. All the time I spent and the energy I put into their lives say something about who I am as a person. What my children choose to do with their lives says nothing at all about me and my personal worth.

 

[emotionallybankrupt]

Wow, what a thread! I relate to so many of the feelings expressed. I've worried a lot about the "unmotherly" emotions I had regarding my child. Before I found this board, I'd never heard anybody else express any of those same emotions. It was a huge relief.

Even the relatively small amount of time I've had away from my difficult child has changed my perspective a lot, though. I don't really hate her; I was just so far past any coping skills that I couldn't see it any other way at the time. Since there were no options for other living arrangements for her, even temporarily, I never got a break, and so I became all the more broken myself.

I'm thinking you, also, are at the point of needing her out of the house for the sake of all concerned, as has already been suggested by many previous posts on the thread.

On nicknames...when I read your post about her educational program being spoonfed, I wondered if that might work--you the fork, she the "spoonfed wonder"? Time to find her own spoon and learn how to use it?

For my difficult child, I'm working hard to keep myself from feeling sorry for her. I'm looking at it as her own self-imposed, self-designed, personalized boot camp. I hope she can learn what she needs to learn through that, so that she can grow to her potential. It wasn't going to happen here. Patterns were too entrenched. She was stagnating, and so was I.

The idea that we're never tested beyond what we can handle is a load of **** because I cannot handle this.

I, too, clutched that concept tightly for many years while at the same time, the life was being drained out of me. Finally, somebody pointed out to me the CONTEXT of this so frequently quoted statement. Temptation, (gulp), not burden. Re-read with this in mind and see if it gives you any release from the idea that you should be able to handle whatever is thrown at you and that you are somehow a failure if you can't.

What it says to me is that I should be always capable of resisting the temptation to choke her, but not necessarily to avoid a breakdown myself. Gives that self-care concept a new importance.

 

[emotionallybankrupt]

"She's writing her own story - you're only a small chapter in it so stop making her the center of yours. Go live your life the best you can and the example will be the best thing you can offer her."

Thank you for this. Now copied and on my fridge.

Here's one I heard often from my dad. He was a collector of quotes, and I don't know where he got this one. He compared anger to an acid: "Anger does more to burn the vessel where it's stored than that on which it's poured."

 

[Nomad]

Yep, all of us have to learn as adults to set boundaries. Even us moms. Ironically, many times our difficult children have major issues setting up boundaries. So, setting up a boundary with- them, can actually be a good example for them to hopefully learn and observe. Mirror. When they are past 18, and certainly 21 or older...it is time for them to pull their own weight. Depending on the circumstances, we might offer some MINOR assistance, if it would not hurt us to do so and they are appreciative and using the assistance to help be productive and go further....but by and large we need to DETACH. Our adult "kids" need to GROW, and work toward independence.


Letting Go"
* To "let go" does not mean to stop caring; it means I can't do it for someone else.
* To "let go" is not to cut myself off; it's the realization I can't control another.
* To "let go" is not to enable, but to allow learning from natural consequences.
* To "let go" is to admit powerlessness, which means the outcome is not in my hands.
* To "let go" is not to try to change or blame another; it's to make the most of myself.
* To "let go" is not to care for, but to care about.
* To "let go" is not to fix, but to be supportive.
* To "let go" is not to judge, but to allow another to be a human being.
* To "let go" is not to be in the middle arranging all the outcomes, but to allow others to affect their own destinies.
* To "let go" is not to be protective; it's to permit another to face reality.
* To "let go" is not to deny, but to accept.
* To "let go" is not to nag, scold or argue, but instead to search out my own shortcomings and correct them.
* To "let go" is not to criticize and regulate anybody, but to try to become what I dream I can be.
* To "let go" is not to adjust everything to my desires, but to take each day as it comes and cherish myself in it.
* To "let go" is to not regret the past, but to grow and live for the future.
* To "let go" is to fear less and love myself more.