Im ticked, tired and feel ..argh.

[Signorina]

You need a division of duty - a chore list. Seems like everyone is expecting someone else to do whatever needs to get done.

My H and I divided up the household chores very early in our marriage. As the kids got older, they were given "their own" chores too - based upon their age. (somehow, H's chores were most of the ones that got outsourced to the boys, sigh)Now, if one of us (or our kids) is super busy, we all pinch hit. But if someone starts taking advantage, we call them on it.

I was the youngest - later in life baby - in my house. My mom had been there done that, so I was not great about making my bed or picking up after myself. On the other hand, H was the oldest of 3 with a single parent, working mom. Keeping her kids bustling with chores was mother in law's way of making sure they didn't get into trouble while she was at work. Of course - as the oldest - H did his AND his brother's chores so HE wouldn't get into trouble since he was "in charge." H was determined that our kids wouldn't be slackers like his brother (or me) and our boys were making their beds and putting away their own clothes by the time they were 4.

Start making of list of the daily, weekly and month tasks that need to be done around your home. Get Tony and Billy's input make the list overly exhaustive and complete. Make a dinner everyone loves, sit around the table and start dividing it up with everyone's input. Make it clear that you all will be doing some chores that you like to do and some chores that you hate to do. 'tis life. Post the list and make sure YOU set a good example by doing your end. When Billy or Tony seem to "forget" - be nice and say something like "dinner will be ready in 15 minutes, that should give you enough time to take out the trash and wash up..." with a smile on your face. (I learned that from a friend, works really well most of the time)

Just my $.02

 

[susiestar]

Janet, I am going to be really blunt.

It is past time to make Billy's life VERY uncomfortable. WAY past time.

Why would he clean it up? What are the consequences for NOT cleaning it up? Mom will yell? So. Friggin'. What.

Mom needs to go and confiscate his computer stuff. Or dump the trash ON his computer. Not his bed - he will just sleep on your couch or the floor. ON. HIS. COMPUTER.

Unless you are willing to make some REAL consequences, you may as well get over being the only one who cleans because it won't change. EVER.


As for the job, WHY ONE EARTH WOULD HE APPLY?????????

WHAT does he need the job for? If he has $$ he might have to move out. If he has $$ he might have to pay rent. If he has $$ you might want him to buy his food or pay for a cleaning person.

in my opinion that is what needs to happen. Write up a list of chores for him. Tell him that he MUST do these every X often with NO reminders or you will have a cleaning person come to do them and that person will expect to be paid (it is about $60 for 4 - 6 hrs here) and HE had best have the $$ here or you will call him from wherever he is to come pay her. If he doesn't pay her, then he cannot come into the home until he does. NO sleeping, eating, getting his stuff - not clothes, computer, food, cash, NOTHING - until he forks over that $$.

Don't argue. Don't remind. Just let him know that he is an adult and if he doesn't do this then he doesn't lvie there and you are not playing or begging.

He probably could go walk into that job you found for him - they sound desperate. But WHY would he? That would take up some of his time to play on the computer. It owuld mean that you might expect things from him, that his cushy life of no bills, no chores, no adult problems/hardships would be O.V.E.R. If he doesn't have this job then you and Tony won't make him leave, won't make him pay rent, won't make him do any chores.

You are not PHYSICALLY ABLE to keep making his life so easy. It is taking a HUGE toll on you and on your body. Time to be a Warrior Mom with regard to this problem. Go deaf when Tony tells you that you are too hard. Just reach up and scratch your ear and imagine that you hae turned your hearing aids OFF and now you cannot hear what Tony is saying. Or turn up the volume on the tv and tell him to talk to your hand. whatever works. You KNOW this isn't healthy for Billy, for Tony or for you. Tony's body won't do what it used to, and right now he is not seeing it but he IS supporting Billy with his hard, physical labor. That isn't fair to Tony or you. It also isn't fair to BILLY.

I know it may be hard. But not as hard as dealing with the toll it takes on you and on Tony and on your marriage and life and even on your sons. Cause what does it tell Cory and Jamie that Billy lives at home with no bills, no chores, no responsiblities except his car?

I am sorry that Billy is so blind to the housework. My kids and husband are too. Which hoovers because I CANNOT do the housework. PLEASE think about my suggestions - even if Tony disagrees, he isn't home with Billy during the day. Making excuses for Billy means that Billy isn't CAPABLE, and I just don't think it is true. None of you has a clue if Billy is capable or not - until he MUST do these things you will never know. Being blind to housework doesn't mean that he cannot learn to see it. It means he has to be taught to see it. the ONLY way you will get him to see the mess is to make him deal with the mess. Think about it. If you and/or Tony continues to clean the mess, how will Billy EVER learn to see it? WHY would he learn to see it?

Think about what drives Billy crazy that doesn't really bug you or that you can tolerate. Then DO those things, cook those foods that make odors he hates, sing if it bothers him, whatever. I truly do NOT suggest this to be "mean". It is to make him uncomfortable enough that he grows up and becomes the man he can be. Find a way to deprive him of his computer unless/until he does what you want. You are a SMART, CREATIVE, DEVIOUS woman. I have faith that you can figure out how to do this. Heck, tell Billy if he doesn't clean or pay the cleaning lady then you will hide his computers or pawn them to pay the bill. Isn't that fair?

 

[1905]

Frankly I have the same problem here...and I give up! Nobody does any chores ever, I make every meal,clean it up,do all laundry...etc..The smallest thing is such a problem and an argument, it makes me sad that nobody cherishes me enough to help me. I know how frustrated you are. I honestly never would throw trash from one place to another.....why would I junk up my house? It isn't fair! Plus, my family wakes me up all hours of the night. I get calls at 11:30 am, woken up at 11pm to take a frozen pizza out of the oven by an 18-year-old, husband does the same thing.....waking me up to fix the heat....he won't get up, but I do, so I can just go do it (she won't mind) (she may get annoyed, but she'll still do it). I really have no idea how to solve this. Just letting you know you're not alone. They are used to what they do, and so are we, until we do something different nothing will change.

 

[InsaneCdn]

UAN... I was going to say there's an easy cure - but Janet has proven that it doesn't always work. <sigh>

For MY Mom... going from healthy/active/able-bodied to wheel-chair-bound in 6 months... forced the rest of us to take up the slack (including Dad, who up to that point wouldn't even dry dishes!)

Of course, that's not really an "easy" solution either - and, obviously, it didn't work for Janet.

 

[DammitJanet]

Yeah...Billy lived with my mom on and off most of his life and she ruined him. I had him fully from second grade till the first quarter of 7th grade when he was getting bullied so badly that I felt I had no choice but to send him to live back at my mother's. That was the biggest mistake of my life and if I had known that I could have had him switched to a different school in my district I would have but I didnt. She completely pampered him to death. She wouldnt show him how to cook, wash his clothes, clean his room, anything. When he finally came back to me he didnt even know how to operate a washing machine. He couldnt do anything more than heat stuff up in a microwave and that was iffy. She fed him mostly microwaved meals.

He doesnt consider me his mother in the truest sense I dont believe. She taught him that he was more of a younger brother to me. In fact, he calls me Janet. Not mom. He will refer to me as his mother but she would never refer to me as his mother...only Janet. I referred to her as Grammy, but she didnt do the same to me. She always told him as an infant and toddler to go see Janet, not go see your mommy so he grew up calling me Janet no matter what I tried. He never would change. I thought that might change when the other kids came along but it never did. They never tried to call me Janet. They did think it was a bit odd though but then our family was odd so nothing was normal anyway.

 

[Star*]

Would it work to tell him he had unitl Feb 20th 2012 to move out? Put it in writing and keep a copy and then as the weeks got closer start making preparations for his room? I know he had that nice girlfriend? - I think I'd tell her it's time to take her boy and go play house elsewhere. RECLAIM YOUR HOME Mom.

 

[DammitJanet]

Star...I know there have been movements on that front. For awhile that was at a standstill because she had gone into a lockdown mode herself where she became stuck in the domestic violence thing and she was terrified to throw her husband out. I know she has filed a legal separation now and a PO. She brought her kids back to her parents in NMB, SC from CO. Her H somehow is being allowed onto the base but has to keep away from her. I think he is allowed onto the base because he has spousal rights...which I think is bs. Hopefully she can get divorced before she is separated from the army which is supposed to happen in the next 6 months or so. He may put up a fight though but we all think he abused her youngest daughter. Not to mention abusing her. The teacher in the little girls school in SC is reporting signs to cps. Billy is still holding out hope I think. For awhile he had given up.

 

[InsaneCdn]

Oh, Janet.
{{hugs}} to you and to your Billy boy.
I can understand where you are coming from on this - and where Billy is coming from - and where Tony is coming from...
The biggist problem? Is that the real problem isn't your fault, or Tony's fault, or even Billy's fault.

Blame the unfairness of life, if you want.
But... Billy does not have a secure relationship with anybody, really.
All those attachment issues - esp. insecure attachment (rather than Reactive Attachment Disorder (RAD), which doens't apply)...
The whole need to "look out for ME" rather than the reciprocity of healthy relationships... comes from not having had the kind of secure, healthy relationships he needed at the points in time when it was most crucial.

And so.. I think your mommy gut is right.
Its frustrating. Infuriating. Difficult.
But... just booting him out on his rear, may not really be the answer either.

There are no easy answers, when a kid is broken.
I think you and Tony have done fairly well for him... all things considered.

{{hugs}}

 

[DammitJanet]

Thanks. My mother was evil personified. Mommy dearest was her twin. I knew she had dementia when she looked at me one day and told me that I had been such a joy to raise. LOL. She had never given me a word of praise in my life so I knew there was something extremely wrong with her. Within 4 months of that conversation she didnt even know who I was. She swore she had never had a baby in her life...even when I showed her pictures of her with a baby child...a girl child. Nope...not hers. She must have been sitting with a neighbor's child or maybe one of her brothers kids. She remembered Billy and her dog longer than me. Her dog longest of all. She really hurt me and him. She didnt leave the other two unscathed but Tony and I tried to protect them more by keeping them away as much as possible. She called Jamie the B@stard child. She hated Tony even though he did everything under the sun for her. Both Cory and Jamie were born out of wedlock...Billy was conceived. well actually...I was still married to my first husband when Jamie was born sooooo.....lol. I guess Cory was the only one technically born out of wedlock. LOL. My mom was a thrower. No one knew what was going to come flying their way. One day she threw a handful of hangers out her backdoor and hit Jamie across the face. Tony was furious and he didnt let his two boys over there for about 6 months. He said she was crazy...and he was right. But we moved away when Jamie was 4 and Cory was 2 so they really dont remember all that much.