I don't think there was a specific statement that our kids must be sociopathic. But there do certainly seem to be widely varying views on the definition of the terms and interpretation. Well, we know here on this site that we come form a wide range of backgrounds (and cultures at times!) and we accept this in each other. There is nothing wrong with lively debate - I do think getting defensive can get in the way of this. And both sides of this debate have at times been getting defensive. It's like fingernails across a blackboard to me, so I HAVE noticed!
Definitions do vary. One book does not a diagnosis make. On this site, we do not diagnose. We would get into so many difficulties if we tried to do this, we have learned to perhaps suggest possibilities, but always to urge getting a professional opinion.
As for sociopaths/psychopaths - in my corner of the world, the term is completely interchangeable. MAybe Australia is a backwater (although we have one of the best health systems in the world, so in this, I do not think so) but I will stick with the understanding I have got from my own country. Now, diagnosing sociopathy is not easy, because the patient generally is not at all interested in accepting there is anything wrong with them. So we are left with the layperson watching from the outside and drawing their own generally unqualified opinion.
Now to my own unqualified opinion - I believe I know/have known a number of sociopaths. One was a work colleague who made my life purgatory. BUT we do tend to fall into the trap of thinking that sociopaths are likely to be criminals - while they may have no conscience and no empathy, they are generally intelligent and also realise that the laws are there, whether they like it or not, and to break those laws puts them at risk of losing their liberty. So the stereotypical homicidal sociopath is actually more unusual. From what I have been taught, most sociopaths (or psychopaths - for me the term is the same) are law-abiding, if only to ensure they remain at liberty.
Now - mental health is, like the rest of medicine, very inexact. I've seen people, kids in their teens, get a sociopathy label inappropriately when the problem is actually Asperger's (as later diagnosed). These kids appear to totally lack empathy and it is then assumed they also totally lack a conscience. But not necessarily. We have to realise, we don't always recognise a different way of expressing such things.
I think we have also gotten off topic. A more important question, rather than bogging down in sociopathy or otherwise (considering none of us are sufficiently qualified), is to ask - in our opinion, as parents, what makes a kid a difficult child? For each of us, the answers will be different. But one thing is clear to me, from all I have gleaned in the years I have posted on this site: not in every case, but in most cases, the people who come here to post, are here because of sheer desperation. A slack or lazy parent wouldn't bother. A parent in denial wouldn't stay here. They would not want to face that there could be a problem that doesn't have a simple solution. So for those of us here on this site, especially the long-termers - we are not a representative sample, folks. And mrsammler - please be aware, we have been doing this for a very long time, we have used every expert resource and this is still where we are. For a lot of us, it is heaps better than where we were.
In other words, mrsammler, we are not your sister. Our kids are not your nephew.
That doesn't mean we can't listen to your concerns and perhaps offer some insight. But if neither your sister nor your nephew are interested in change, or perhaps even able to change, there really is not much you can do.
I would suggest you look up "co-dependency" and see if it has their photos on the cover. Metaphorically speaking, of course.
It is always important to try to identify exactly what the underlying problem is, in each case. Two kids could seem identical, but need a totally different approach, based on the real cause. For example, Step mentioned her stepdaughter's history of sexual abuse. What that kid has been though, would be enough to unbalance anyone. But you can't go back and unring the bell. There are other factors there complicating the picture. But another child on this board who behaves similarly, may have no history of being sexually abused. Or there might be another kid who was molested, but has not gone down that path. Why the difference?
I don't know. That's why I'm here. it helps to kick this around and try to find out.
That is why when we post, we try to be open, to listen, to recognise that others are not necessarily dealing with exactly what we are. We also have to be careful to not be too simplistic in our suggestions. Over on General, for example, there has been a long thread on the subject of therapists wanting to try behaviour charts with a girl who is so far beyond behaviour charts, it is not funny. The therapists have no other suggestion to offer, but they were called in by the mother because nothing works! It is very frustrating when you have really tried a great deal, thought laterally, done your utmost, then you yell for help - only to be told to try something that you totally ruled out years ago as completely useless.
I have raised four kids now. The eldest is a easy child. So it's not my parenting that has resulted in my having difficult child kids too. OF those with difficult child in them, they are all different. The discipline methods I used for the first three kids worked well. But when I tried to apply them to difficult child 3 - wow! Massive failure! I had to find something else that worked. And I did - "Explosive CHild" worked for us. it's not a cure, but it has been the best management of anything we have found. But it has to be done properly, looked into properly. it is not appeasement, it is not turning yourself into a doormat for the child. Far from it.
We each do what we can with what we have got. And we each have to listen, and be open, and not make sweeping judgemental statements of the "when did you stop beating your wife?" category (a phrase of husband's).
Which reminds me - my husband is another male who lurks here every day and posts occasionally. I don't think he's ever posted on PE though. Maybe because our main concerns are difficult child 3 who is still a teenager...
I would strongly recommend some reading. A lot of reading. Widely, on a range of topics. Then read a lot of threads. Go back into the archives. There you will find the distilled wisdom of this site. I still go and dip into it from time to time, even though I saw a lot of it the first time around. it is always good to take a refresher course.
Depending on what you want from us, mrsammler, we could be very helpful as a resource. But I'm not sure what it is you want, so without being able to work that out, it is very difficult to know how to assist you.
Marg
