My son is spiraling down

[toughlovin]

My son is also across the country..... but there are treatment centers all over the country. Call your insurance co and see if they have any they cover where he is.... that is how we found the treatment center my son went to which was great....In some ways that is better for you because then he cant come back and live with you. He probably needs residential treatment and then some kind of sober living.... paying for an apartment, especially if you have to cosign a lease, is very very risky in my opinion.

 

[New Leaf]

I responded with, we love you and know there is a way to peace. You just have to commit to the work. We told him to come back to our state and insurance will cover treatment. I'm not exactly sure how that would work. Maybe an apartment on the condition of going to all meetings and therapy? I just don't see an answer with him being on the other side of the country with no money, no job and no friends or family.

There is love in this, Quicksand, no doubt about it. There is also danger for you to slide into enabling. Sorry no other way to put it. When our d cs are in this apologetic, woe is me stage it is hard not to pull out all of our stoppers and go full throttle to help. We want them to be better, desperately.

There is that piece also, where it is possible he will be in trouble with the law, if the FB postings are true. Then what happens?

Take some time to think things through Quicksand. Even if you texted him one solution, you can say you have changed your mind, if that is what your decision is.

Of course, it is your journey, your choice. Remember, we just give suggestions, opinions, or let others know what our experiences are. It is always up to you, what you finally decide.

The beauty of this site is that you will receive information from folks who have been there, done that.

My son is also across the country..... but there are treatment centers all over the country. Call your insurance co and see if they have any they cover where he is.... that is how we found the treatment center my son went to which was great....

This is terrific advice from a mom who is in the same boat.I agree. If anything, how your son responds will be a determining factor in what kind of help he is looking for. Does he really want to change and kick heroin? Or, does he want you to fly him home, so it will be easier for him?

In some ways that is better for you because then he cant come back and live with you. He probably needs residential treatment and then some kind of sober living.... paying for an apartment, especially if you have to cosign a lease, is very very risky in my opinion.

I agree. An apartment is risky. I have seen a few folks in the process of getting themselves out of this, because their d cs were not ready for change, trashed the apartment, threw parties, etc. That is learning the hard way. You do not have to learn the hard way.

One really good piece of advice I see over and again, here, is, slow...... way...... down, take deep breaths.

Everything doesn't have to happen on the dramatic, chaotic timeframe of our d cs. They can whip us up into a frenzy, good decisions can never be made in this state of mind.

Take a while to think on things, research and get other warrior moms opinions and experiences.

Then make up your mind. At least you will have time to really think it through.

Decide if you are doing something to ease your mind and worries for your son, or if you have found a solution that really helps him towards recovery.

Of course, he has to truly want to recover. That is key.

Hang in there Quicksand! You are not alone.

(((HUGS)))
leafy

 

[Quicksand]

Man, you guys hit the nail on the head! I'm listening and slowing down. I did talk to him on the phone tonight, that was awful. I couldn't help but call it all out and not tiptoe like while we were texting. He claims its his Borderline (BPD). When I was shining the light of reality on his actions and the consequences he will face if he doesn't stop immediately, he said the whole thing was a blur and he doesn't remember much. I kept pressing and saying until he can get into treatment, he has to slow down and breathe and face the fact that he must stop this or go to jail. He said he doesn't care about jail because he has no life. I told him to go turn himself in then because we will not help him unless he is willing to care. we talked more and I told him that he is intelligent enough to understand his issues and knows all of the different treatments (but focuses on the myth that it's untreatable ) and I don't believe that he's completely not in control of himself. i told him that I understand what it feels like to have overwhelming emotions and that it can be eased. As I started to get deep, he shouted WHAT DO YOU WANT FROM ME!! And hung up. I sent a text- sorry I pressed so hard, I love you. He replied- I'm having a nervous breakdown / anxiety attack I'm going to bed.
I can't tell what is truth or not. He insists he's not addicted to any drug (lots of evidence of use) and that his behavior is because he's "crazy". I really don't want him here. I will look for treatment where he is. I want to take the day off tomorrow. I go between worried and terrified to angry and feeling manipulated.

 

[New Leaf]

As I started to get deep, he shouted WHAT DO YOU WANT FROM ME!! And hung up. I sent a text- sorry I pressed so hard, I love you. He replied- I'm having a nervous breakdown / anxiety attack I'm going to bed.
I can't tell what is truth or not. He insists he's not addicted to any drug (lots of evidence of use) and that his behavior is because he's "crazy". I really don't want him here. I will look for treatment where he is. I want to take the day off tomorrow. I go between worried and terrified to angry and feeling manipulated.

Well, it is kind of evident by this, that your son has come to expect your help when he cries crazy, or mentally ill.
Don't let him fool you.
Drug addicts lie and steal and manipulate.
My daughter is in the same boat.
She has gone up and down, in, out and sideways around the drug discussion. Hangs out with people who do meth, but insists she doesn't. All lies.
We have a neighbor up the road who has been on it for years. I recently saw his poor wife, who has tried everything. She now fears what he will do if she tries to kick him out. He is increasingly violent. Rides up and down the road on his moped at all hours.
My daughter says what a nice guy he is, and that he is not on meth, he has stomach cancer. All lies.
Your son may or may not have a mental illness, but his number one big problem is heroin use, that is a bad monkey on anyones back.

Stay strong Quicksand, he will not be happy with your stance, and will try all sorts of tactics to get you back under his spell. Addicts are master manipulators.

It is good to have a list handy, or to practice what you are going to say, on the phone. Keeping it short, is best. No sense arguing, or getting drawn into the drama.

There is an article in the P.E. forum that is about loving detachment, it is helpful.
Article on detachment http://www.conductdisorders.com/community/threads/article-on-detachment.53639/

I read through it a lot to help me stand firm.

Keep your chin up, Quicksand, it will be okay. Take it one day at a time, and make sure to do something to build yourself up. This is all very stressful and tiring.

Hang in there, you are not alone.
(((HUGS)))
leafy

 

[SeekingStrength]

Hi Quicksand,

Thinking about you. Your son seems to be exhibiting the same type of behavior as my 34yo. So, I see manipulation where it might not be that at all. The loving detachment will help you gain clarity with time.

We still hear from our Difficult Child from time to time. While there is no relationship being rebuilt, I have hope that it will happen one day. He (finally) seems to understand we are not there for a handout nor do we accept the horrible way he presents his growing up years. We had to step way back before he started catching on because his approach had worked for a decade or so.

Hang in there. Let us know what you are doing today that is good for you.

SS

I am going to a weight training class this morning, my first in over ten years! I will be giving a new definition to modifying.

 

[Quicksand]

He sent a text last night that I saw when I woke up this morning. It was a picture of a lot of snow and he said how he's going to use the last of his money on a room because it's too cold to sleep in his car. I called him and he said he isn't get the room and that he's been driving all night. I asked where he was driving to. He said, I'm on my way home! We had left that talk of coming home with a pin in it because I am not sure that is a good idea, but he blew past that and is on his way. I told him, no- get a room and we will pay for it. (We are trying to buy time so I can find a treatment center for him.) he did get a room and I guess We can relax for today...
I know in my heart he cannot be in our house. I am not equipped to deal with that. I did tell him that he will have to go to inpatient treatment and he said ok I'll do whatever it takes. I still don't trust him or really believe anything he says. We've had nothing but chaos for 2 weeks and my daughter who is home from school said its just too sad watching dad and I be eaten up by this.
She went out to lunch with her friend and later this evening, she, dad and I are going out to dinner. I said I would shower and put myself together and put on a smile if just for today. That's next when I'm finished writing this. I can see us letting go... Out there on the horizon. Maybe treatment will work, but I'm not convinced his heart is honest.
You all have saved me. I'm grateful beyond words.

 

[InsaneCdn]

he is intelligent enough to understand his issues and knows all of the different treatments (but focuses on the myth that it's untreatable )

This is not uncommon with mental illness. It's a brain trap... to call it "untreatable" just because it is "not curable". Diabetes isn't curable either - but treatment can give the person a good life, and mental illness for the most part is the same (all of them do better with treatment).

 

[Quicksand]

I am a basket case this morning. Tomorrow is the day he's supposed to be back. I've called places (psychiatric / drug treatment )and learned that I can't set anything up. He has to do it. I'm getting more and more nervous anticipating his arrival. I may be repeating myself, but Thursday and Friday while I was texting him, he was saying he needs/wants help and at the same time he was obsessing about talking to his ex girlfriend face to face- he is very angry with her. I told him that he was not to contact her at all and that was a deal breaker for us. I said if he is unwilling to listen to my advice about that, he will end up in jail. I told him his ex has gone to the police for a ppo. Yesterday, he told me that he promises he won't contact her and that he is "surrendering" to us and will do whatever we say and is willing to do inpatient treatment. I just can't shake the thought that he's lying to me. His messages to her were - I be back sooner than you think, you ugly b$tch, take down the Facebook post (outing him on his antisocial acts) or I'll come at you with all that I have. His ex did take the post down and he hasn't messaged her since, but I still am afraid.

 

[BusynMember]

Insane C is right that mental illness is treatable. It can even get better if therapy and medications are good and the person's mind can slow down enough for him to think. If the young adult is on drugs, that's different.The use has to stop before the mental illness can be identified and treated.

If your son is dangerous, do you and yours at home have a plan in case he gets out of control? I strongly advise having a plan in advance.

Hugs to you and hoping for him to get the help he needs.

 

[Jabberwockey]

I calmed him down and then said I was tired and needed to go to bed and he said: oh yeah "you're there for me"!
I, feeling afraid he's going to do something crazy said: let's keep talking

This is manipulation, pure and simple. He hasn't got what he wants from you yet so he guilt's you into staying on the phone. Keep it simple and when you feel yourself starting to want to jump right in and help, politely and lovingly end the phone call.

One minute he's telling me he's losing his mind and can't stop his behavior and then I'm feeling like I'm being played for money.

His behaviors are his choice and nobody else's. Are those choices being ruled by his addiction? Yes, but continuing in the addict's life style is his choice. He reaffirms that choice every time he does drugs.

I feel like if I let him fall he's going to do something really bad.

Stop and really think about this quote. "if I let him fall". How do you "LET" him fall? He is a grown man living in a different part of the country. Even if he lived in your house you cant control his actions. Don't beat yourself up over something that you have no control over.

Maybe an apartment on the condition of going to all meetings and therapy?

Been there, done that. My advice? Don't. It's highly unlikely that it will end well.

I see that he is rushing home to "get help". Make sure that he understands that he wont be living in your home because I can pretty much guarantee that's what he expects. I know it isn't easy for you. Mom's want to help, to fix it for their children. It's much easier for men to detach from their children (male children anyway. I only have a son so can't realistically say about daughters) because its in our nature to prepare them for life then let them figure it out where mothers want to nurture and protect.

This might sound a bit harsh, and if it does I apologize but feel that it needs said. Your son's lifestyle may well be the death of him. You have to understand that this lifestyle is HIS choice and in no way influenced by you. He, for some reason or another, real or imagined, has chosen this for himself. Even if he goes to prison, that doesn't mean he will get clean. Sorry, but I've worked in Corrections for over 23 years and drugs are readily available in the prison system.

Many others have given you good advice. Take care of yourself. Detach from your son and let him live his life. Giving him money and other things can be enabling but do what you have to for your peace of mind. We cant tell you that yes, this will work, or no, this wont work. None of us are experiencing exactly what you are. We are giving advice based on our circumstances and where we are on our path to detaching from our self destructive adult children. Get help for you and your family from a counselor or self help group, whatever works for you. Take care of yourself because your son certainly wont. Remember that its his life and his choices to make, not yours. I'm so sorry that you have to be here but you have found a wonderful source of support and inspiration. Use what works for you.

 

[Childofmine]

QS, I am sure your adrenaline is at an all-time high today. I used to dread my son coming to my house for any reason. Hang in there, and slow down. Slowing down is one very quick tool you can grab onto and it really helps. Sit down, close your eyes for 5 minutes and just breathe. As your thoughts come into your mind, keep breathing, notice the thought and then let it go. Don't try to control your thoughts. Just sit there in silence and keep breathing. Doing this several times a day will really help slow you down.

You are no match for your son's addictions and mental illness. You need to get professional help to deal with him. If the situation is volatile, I would call 911 or you can take him straight to the ER and that is a great first step toward getting someone who is mentally ill (addiction is a mental illness too) to treatment. The professionals are then in charge.

I would make some hard and fast rules about whether or not he can stay at your home for any period of time, even for a visit. That was non-negotiable with me. In fact, when my son's girlfriend stabbed him last summer, he was in the hospital (left AMA and went back) and when he got out my ex-husband (his dad) and I put him up in a hotel for 2 weeks. He was not coming to either of our houses.

If the situation is calmer and you have a little more time, get a therapist specializing in addiction or substance abuse counselor involved quickly to help you with him and pave the way to treatment.

My son would talk about help but then back way off once it came time to actually do anything. Don't fall into that trap.

Keep your words simple. You don't need to make long speeches. He knows already. Don't let him get you into circular discussions...they are great at that. He's either going to treatment or not. Period. No half-measures.

And you don't need to promise anything to get him to go---no apartments, etc. He will need to go to a halfway house after he is released from treatment and you don't even have to bring that up right now.

Keep us posted. We're here for you.

 

[Quicksand]

I talked to him today, he will be here tomorrow morning. The treatment center told me to take him to the ER for a psychiatric evaluation and then to request that he be sent to the specific treatment center. I reiterated to him that he cannot contact ex girlfriend. He assured me he wouldn't. I told him we will go to the hospital as soon as he arrives. He agreed. After the treatment center, I have a dialectical therapy center that specializes in personality and mood disorders along with substance abuse. They also offer sober living houses.
Yesterday, my husband told me he didn't want to talk or think about it anymore because he had to get his head right to go back to work. Which I honored. I'm going to whine a bit here, but I'm so damn overwhelmed I can't see straight. It's all been on me. I know it affects my H and my daughter at it is in no way my daughters responsibility but my husband has only sent my son some "I love you" texts. All communication, researching, calling places, going to narc anon meetings EVERYTHING has been on me.
I called my sons ex girlfriend (on the advice of of friend/ and I fully agree) to let her know that he is coming back but will immediately go to a treatment center. Just so she's aware because he did threaten her. I told my H what I did and he got angry with me! It's all on me but if I do something that he doesn't agree with, he's mad. It feels really unfair. I'm just getting this out of me so I can stop crying. I was sitting there quietly breathing and letting all this hell pass through me when my H came home, we started talking and it turned into him being pissed at me. I going to hang in there and I have a mom that I found through 855-DRUGFREE calling me in 2 hours, so, I know she'll help me. I hope one day I can be of help to someone out there... I know one thing, I'm not doing this again.

 

[New Leaf]

Oh QS, you have done so much, I am sorry for your hurting heart. It is hard when you are the Lone Ranger and Tonto needs a break (this is my hubs).My H does not want to talk about it either.
You are right to call the ex and let her know. A heads up is good for her to be on her toes just in case.
I hope you are able to have a good talk with this mom and get some help. Wish I could give you some real hugs, but cyber ones will have to do.
Hope all goes well tomorrow.
Prayers for you and yours
(((Hugs)))
Leafy

 

[AppleCori]

How are things going today, QS?

 

[Quicksand]

He called at 6 this morning and said I'm around the corner. Boom. We got up, dressed and I took him straight to the ER. Husband had to work. We spent the entire day there. The hospital offered him a prescription for Ativan, soboxone and a list of shrinks. Really??? He told the dr. He was using heroin and that he stole suboxone and was abusing it. My son did not want either of them. He said he wanted rehab and therapy. I told the nurse we weren't leaving until we could talk to a social worker. My original plan of where to take him fell through, so the 7 hours in er was a blessing because that's how long it took to figure out where to go. It's not that easy when you can't afford 30k out of pocket. Our insurance has very limited options. He is in a detox center up to 14 days and then outpatient intensive for 6 weeks... (I think).
My son was brutally honest and cried a lot, admitted to many things. He said he first used heroin at 18. Tonight, I know he's safe. I'm thankful for that.

 

[Copabanana]

QS you did really, really good and so did your son. I am very happy for you that he is safe. He sounds like he really stepped up.

Keep us posted.

COPA

 

[Copabanana]

I have a dialectical therapy center that specializes in personality and mood disorders along with substance abuse. They also offer sober living houses.

QS, is this where he is? Dialectical Behavioral Therapy is very well regarded in these circumstances.

How are you doing? And your husband?

You have been through so much.

COPA

 

[Copabanana]

I'm not exactly sure how that would work. Maybe an apartment on the condition of going to all meetings and therapy?

Has your son showed any sign of mental illness? Often with substance dependence there will be co occurring diagnoses, that either preceded the drug use or arose as a consequence.

I ask because if he is diagnosed with a psychiatric disorder, it might expand the benefits and resources that can be brought to bear.

Many people on this forum would hesitate to recommend that you get an apartment for him.There are all kinds of programs, sober living houses, etc. that provide free or low-cost treatment and supported living, including treatment.

Maybe in these next 2 weeks you can find out what might be available in your part of the country. Perhaps an internet search would bring up resources, or you might go to your Counties Drug Treatment Office, typically associated with the Department of Mental Health.

Maybe other parents in Alanon or in NAMI might be aware of resources.

You are doing phenomenally, I think. At least a whole lot better than I did. Keep posting.

COPA

 

[Quicksand]

Thank you! My son has diagnosed himself as Borderline (BPD)- and I agree. He is at a drug treatment facility affiliated with a very good hospital. He will be getting a diagnosis at some point during this process. I'm assuming not until he goes to the dbt place, so, no he's not there yet. He needs to go through the detox program first. He was fully honest at the ER and talked about all of his symptoms. The dbt place has sober houses which insurance won't pay for- but I am going to check into the psychiatric diagnosis for possible extended benes for sure. You are a great help as I wouldn't even think of that.
We are ok. Kind of in shock. XO

 

[Copabanana]

QS, you are doing a very hard thing, very, very well.

The treatment options sound fantastic. Better than I have heard of. I totally believe that DBT is phenomenal.

Your son sounds very impressive. It takes character, motivation, guts and maturity to fess up as did he.

Try as hard as you can to be kind to yourself now.

I would try hard to not diagnose my child or to give much credence to his self-diagnosis.

The kind of diagnosis that might help with benefits, I think, is what they call an Axis I diagnosis, which is an acute problem, like depression, anxiety, etc.

A personality disorder like Borderline (BPD) is an Axis II disorder. As far as I know it is not typically considered a focus of treatment that would be covered by insurance. But of course you need to verify your benefits. I could not know what is or is not covered.

If it were me, I would stay silent about what my thoughts are about diagnosising, and let the professionals decide.

Keep posting. I admire how you are handling this. You are doing so great under unbelievable pressure.

COPA