petrified for 23yo son..

[BusynMember]

I forgot to add re: monetary help from me to him. I already am paying his monthly car insurance bill, and his gym membership. That is almost $200/mo.

Last comment. Stop this now. He needs to learn to pay his own bills or not have things. He doesn't need a car at all until he is sober. If he can afford his own car, you can't stop it, b ut you don't have to put a drunk driver on the street.

Remember...you do not help him when you support him. More hugs

 

[toughlovin]

Hi rebelson, I understand your petrifying fear.... I have at times had that fear also. When my son was homeless and on the streets I had to accept that I had no control over the outcome of his decisions and whatever they were they were not my fault.... Not at this point. My son is now 24 and that was a couple of years ago. I worried a lot and I checked his phone records sometimes just to make sure he was still alive. So I totally get the fear and yet his life is out of your control. It is his choice to live or not.

I will say that if he calls and sounds suicidal then you need to tell him he should go to the hospital and check himself in. I think from your posts you are not nearby... So yeah you can talk him down maybe, but who knows where he will be a couple of hours later. You really cannot be his total safety net.... And if he is suicidal then he needs professional help. That is one place I got to with my son, when he got suicidal I told him he needed to go to the hospital.... And when he was local I could take him there.

One thing I have realized with my son is that he wants to live.... Because when he has gotten suicidal he has taken my advice and gone to the hospital.

I have also taken the stand with my son that when he wants to help himself then I will help him and I have. So with his substance abuse when he wants to get sober I will help him get into treatment..... He is finally at the point where I think he wants sobriety for himself, not for the courts and not just to get something from me... But it has taken time, and some relapses to get to that point... .and who knows what will happen from here.

The best thing you can do for yourself is to find ways to live and enjoy your life.

 

[rebelson]

To those of you are saying 'take his car, he doesn't need a car'. What would you like me to do? Drive 10hrs and abscond it from him? When I am not the owner? I do not need the extra drama. As I said, I have an anxiety problem. It is at its height right now. I came on here for advice and encouragement. I understand most of you are well-meaning, but right now, I am in a fragile state. I do not own his car, he does. It was sold to him for very little by a family member/friend. I had NOTHING to do with it. When I did help him repair the 'other' car he had, it was 2-4 months ago....BEFORE he was doing the multi-day binges.

There was one post earlier which caused me upset. I realize you are all passionate and stronger than I, but, please. If you want to help me, please try and tone down the drama. OR, I will not want to come on here anymore, and that would not be good. For me. I need this right now, the gentle support, not the fear-mongering. This problem is very stressful in and of itself. In fact, as I write this, my stomach is nauseas.

Thank you for understanding.

 

[toughlovin]

Totally understand that fragile feeling. Ultimately we all need to do what feels right to us.....I know there are ways I help my son more than some think I should.... But it doesn't really matter because you have to do what you can live with. For example many on this board do not pay for a cell phone for their kids.... All for good reasons. For me I pay for a cell phone for my son because it helped me be able to check to see if he was alive when he was homeless and it gave me peace of mind. Right now he is not homeless but I still feel better knowing he can reach me if he needs to and I can reach him..... So enabling or not I pay for his cell phone.

And you are right as far as his car.... You don't own it, you are not paying for it, you can not do a thing about it. I would agree don't pay for his car but it would make no sense for you to try and go and take his car..... That would be the exact opposite of detaching.

Hugs.... Remember everyone is coming from similar but different situations and we are comfortable doing different things and setting different boundaries and that is ok. They key is to figure out what they are for you.

TL

 

[Copabanana]

TL, I have not seen a thread from you lately. How is your son doing? How are you and your D H?

COPA

 

[Copabanana]

There was one post earlier which caused me upset. I realize you are all passionate and stronger than I

Nobody is stronger than you are, rebelson's.

At first I was wounded terribly by some posts to me. I felt like some people were blaming me. Or I thought they were telling me my son would never be better. Or telling me worse things that could be happening--worse than I ever imagined. I was so afraid that I got angry. Or I thought they were telling me that by not accepting the way he was, I was being cruel, demanding he be what I needed him to be. For me, not for him.

I did what you are doing. I said so in a thread. Good for us.

Looking back these comments by others helped me be stronger. They raised points that I needed to consider. Or they pointed out to me places I needed to toughen up and strengthen my stand. It was the comments that were hard to read, that in the end made the most difference.

Nobody can imagine fully how it is to be us, but nowhere in my own life do I have a community that understands as well as do some parents here on this site. Not all. Some.

Along the way, I saw that even the comments that were not on the mark, that hurt, could help me. I was not ready yet to hear them, but eventually, I could. Then, I could respond to clarify or to dispute.

I remember how infuriated I would be when somebody would write, take what you want and leave the rest.

Did they not know that "leave the rest" had already skewered my heart?

Somebody wrote this: Each of us here is in our own process. We are all of us in different places.

And I will add this: Finding mercy for myself and for others was I think the most important thing I have learned while here. Mercy for myself.

I see now that when my heart felt skewered by somebody's comments, I was doing it to myself.

It is hard this whole process because almost all of us have never spoken to each other or met. While we are all dealing with a version of the same thing, we are entirely different in backgrounds, even countries or cultures.

That is what makes this all so powerful. We come together from a thousand or ten thousand different places.

What makes this such a powerful tool of recovery is that while we post to you, we are really working out our own issues. This can be a profound mechanism of change. We help ourselves and each other at the same time.

People post to themselves, not necessarily to you. The comments you read that may feel hurtful may well be people who use this forum to work out their own pain. They are talking as much to themselves, about themselves, as you.

There was one post earlier which caused me upset. I realize you are all passionate and stronger than I, but, please. If you want to help me, please try and tone down the drama. OR, I will not want to come on here anymore, and that would not be good.

I hope this is not the case. I hope you give us a chance. Their is great kindness here. And counsel.

I looked back at some of the earlier posts, and the one that was overtly dramatic did not leap out at me. I certainly hope it was not one of my own. If it was, I apologize.

I am aware that a post of my own did add to the distress of a mother. That she was hurt caused me pain.

At the same time I would have done it again. Not hurt her, but tell my version of the truth that I needed to say.

There is a difference of opinion on the site about this. Some believe we should only write words of "support" to parents. Others believe that what supports a parent is hard to define, that support can be way more than uplifting words. Support can be telling the truth. Or support can be talking about resources and options.

Anyway, it is a good thing, I think, that we say what we need and want and do not.

We try, each of us.

After all was said and done I needed to hear what a broad array of people felt as their truth. It was only with that, that I really understood where I was and needed to go.

There is a way to send a private message if you would like to specifically comment on comments to you, should you choose.

COPA

 

[toughlovin]

Thanks for asking Copa..... I think my son is doing ok. He is out of the residential program, is now in a sober living and has found an IOP that he likes.... At least he did the first day!! Now I haven't heard much more than that and so as always I wonder. However we are going out to visit next week. My do has a business trip near there and so it was a good time to go. I didn't want to go unless my son wanted us to come. I made it very clear to my son that we would understand if he didn't want us to come because he is just getting settled in where he is at... He very clearly said he would like to see us and would like us to come! I think it is good that he wants to see us.....so we shall see.

I have been though this so many times... Each time my level of hope is a little bit less. At the same time though I am clearer and clearer this is his journey and I am a spectator.

TL

 

[rebelson]

Nobody is stronger than you are, rebelson's.

At first I was wounded terribly by some posts to me. I felt like some people were blaming me. Or I thought they were telling me my son would never be better. Or telling me worse things that could be happening--worse than I ever imagined. I was so afraid that I got angry. Or I thought they were telling me that by not accepting the way he was, I was being cruel, demanding he be what I needed him to be. For me, not for him.

I did what you are doing. I said so in a thread. Good for us.

Looking back these comments by others helped me be stronger. They raised points that I needed to consider. Or they pointed out to me places I needed to toughen up and strengthen my stand. It was the comments that were hard to read, that in the end made the most difference.

Nobody can imagine fully how it is to be us, but nowhere in my own life do I have a community that understands as well as do some parents here on this site. Not all. Some.

Along the way, I saw that even the comments that were not on the mark, that hurt, could help me. I was not ready yet to hear them, but eventually, I could. Then, I could respond to clarify or to dispute.

I remember how infuriated I would be when somebody would write, take what you want and leave the rest.

Did they not know that "leave the rest" had already skewered my heart?

Somebody wrote this: Each of us here is in our own process. We are all of us in different places.

And I will add this: Finding mercy for myself and for others was I think the most important thing I have learned while here. Mercy for myself.

I see now that when my heart felt skewered by somebody's comments, I was doing it to myself.

It is hard this whole process because almost all of us have never spoken to each other or met. While we are all dealing with a version of the same thing, we are entirely different in backgrounds, even countries or cultures.

That is what makes this all so powerful. We come together from a thousand or ten thousand different places.

What makes this such a powerful tool of recovery is that while we post to you, we are really working out our own issues. This can be a profound mechanism of change. We help ourselves and each other at the same time.

People post to themselves, not necessarily to you. The comments you read that may feel hurtful may well be people who use this forum to work out their own pain. They are talking as much to themselves, about themselves, as you.
I hope this is not the case. I hope you give us a chance. Their is great kindness here. And counsel.

I looked back at some of the earlier posts, and the one that was overtly dramatic did not leap out at me. I certainly hope it was not one of my own. If it was, I apologize.

I am aware that a post of my own did add to the distress of a mother. That she was hurt caused me pain.

At the same time I would have done it again. Not hurt her, but tell my version of the truth that I needed to say.

There is a difference of opinion on the site about this. Some believe we should only write words of "support" to parents. Others believe that what supports a parent is hard to define, that support can be way more than uplifting words. Support can be telling the truth. Or support can be talking about resources and options.

Anyway, it is a good thing, I think, that we say what we need and want and do not.

We try, each of us.

After all was said and done I needed to hear what a broad array of people felt as their truth. It was only with that, that I really understood where I was and needed to go.

There is a way to send a private message if you would like to specifically comment on comments to you, should you choose.

COPA

Thank you, Copa. The stressful, anxiety ramping posts that I referred to, were the ones on this current pg about how he should not be provided with a car. There were several of them, you can read over them if you'd like.

I appreciate & need the firm advice you refer to, on what I should or shouldn't be doing re: son. I can handle that. That is not what I was talking about in my last post.

What I cannot handle, are posters leaving drama posts re: things which I have no control over. A car that HE owns. Of course I worry about that. What can I do to change it? Nothing. What do the drama posts that almost scream (my perception) 'omg he shouldn't have a car...as this this & this could happen!' do? They significantly add to my already overwhelming worry/anxiety.

I need advice, not drama & more reasons given to me to worry MORE than I already am. I'm here trying to keep my head above water.

PS & by the way: as I was just writing this, son called me yelling at me..accusing me of telling his local older (26) cousin (sober now for 15mos) that he relapsed. I did no such thing & so maybe you can see how much stress I'm under. I felt like vomiting earlier this evening.

thank you for your kindness, Copa.

 

[Copabanana]

Hi again TL and rebel

He very clearly said he would like to see us and would like us to come! I think it is good that he wants to see us.....so we shall see.

You have guts, TL. I have not seen my son since early September. I am afraid to. It is easier for me to keep distance. It feels unnatural but I feel so much better. My health is worlds better, physical and emotional.

I feel guilt, like something is wrong with me. But my body must know it is for the best. I was able to stop eating Prilosec day and night. Now a pill every few days. That is a change that is hard to ignore.

Each time my level of hope is a little bit less. At the same time though I am clearer and clearer this is his journey and I am a spectator.

I see it for myself as I have my life, and he has his. That it was wrong of me to impose my own hopes onto him, even my hope that he would live, take seriously his treatment for his illness. That was when I really started feeling stronger and better, when I accepted that he controlled whether he lived or died. And that I had not a thing to say in the matter.

I am now trying to nurse my own hope for myself. Instead of feeling as if my life depends upon him or anything that he does or does not do. Even live or die.

I can imagine how horrible that sounds to somebody reading this.

Believe me, I am not indifferent to whether my son lives or dies. I just realized finally that I cannot control it. No matter how I tried to protect him, to try to protect his life, it meant nothing--if he did not value his own life and learn to take steps to protect it. Just like I have to do with my own. To sacrifice my own life and health is not love. I realized that. It took a long time.

I think my bottom came when I went by train with him to the Big City a few hours from here where he sees his physician at a University teaching hospital. I went to make sure he actually went to the appointment. The train was a few hours late. I was frantic. I was so ill by then, I could not board the underground train. I went to a coffee shop and told him to go alone, so as to do what he could to salvage the trip. He left, returning after 45 minutes, saying there had been a fight on the streetcar and he could not go to the hospital. A 12 hour trip for not one thing.

I had joined CD after I had enrolled in his online college courses to see that he completed his homework assignments. I was bad. Real, real bad. Look how far I have come. It is amazing.

I was just writing this, son called me yelling at me

This should never, ever happen, rebel. My son would yell at me too. He treated me like dirt. He gossiped about me to neighbors. He would call the police on us to get us arrested and thrown in jail. He gave my significant other a black eye.

My son was a sweet child, and beneath this all, I believe still is a kind person. He is my only child. I raised him alone. He is the moon and stars of my life. I descended to the depths to not lose him until I realized that it was all about me. My son was no longer my child anymore, he was an adult. His life was his own. He was my son. No longer my child.

I had to do whatever it took to get us back to a place where there was civility and at least the appearance of respect. That was my bottom line. Is my bottom line. I would not speak with him on the phone if he could not maintain civility.

I told him that. If you speak to me with disrespect I will say goodbye and end the call. I did.

I am proud of myself. It is not that I no longer care. It is that I care for myself, too.

COPA

 

[rebelson]

Hi again TL and rebel

You have guts, TL. I have not seen my son since early September. I am afraid to. It is easier for me to keep distance. It feels unnatural but I feel so much better. My health is worlds better, physical and emotional.

I feel guilt, like something is wrong with me. But my body must know it is for the best. I was able to stop eating Prilosec day and night. Now a pill every few days. That is a change that is hard to ignore.
I see it for myself as I have my life, and he has his. That it was wrong of me to impose my own hopes onto him, even my hope that he would live, take seriously his treatment for his illness. That was when I really started feeling stronger and better, when I accepted that he controlled whether he lived or died. And that I had not a thing to say in the matter.

I am now trying to nurse my own hope for myself. Instead of feeling as if my life depends upon him or anything that he does or does not do. Even live or die.

I can imagine how horrible that sounds to somebody reading this.

Believe me, I am not indifferent to whether my son lives or dies. I just realized finally that I cannot control it. No matter how I tried to protect him, to try to protect his life, it meant nothing--if he did not value his own life and learn to take steps to protect it. Just like I have to do with my own. To sacrifice my own life and health is not love. I realized that. It took a long time.

I think my bottom came when I went by train with him to the Big City a few hours from here where he sees his physician at a University teaching hospital. I went to make sure he actually went to the appointment. The train was a few hours late. I was frantic. I was so ill by then, I could not board the underground train. I went to a coffee shop and told him to go alone, so as to do what he could to salvage the trip. He left, returning after 45 minutes, saying there had been a fight on the streetcar and he could not go to the hospital. A 12 hour trip for not one thing.

I had joined CD after I had enrolled in his online college courses to see that he completed his homework assignments. I was bad. Real, real bad. Look how far I have come. It is amazing. This should never, ever happen, rebel. My son would yell at me too. He treated me like dirt. He gossiped about me to neighbors. He would call the police on us to get us arrested and thrown in jail. He gave my significant other a black eye.

My son was a sweet child, and beneath this all, I believe still is a kind person. He is my only child. I raised him alone. He is the moon and stars of my life. I descended to the depths to not lose him until I realized that it was all about me. My son was no longer my child anymore, he was an adult. His life was his own. He was my son. No longer my child.

I had to do whatever it took to get us back to a place where there was civility and at least the appearance of respect. That was my bottom line. Is my bottom line. I would not speak with him on the phone if he could not maintain civility.

I told him that. If you speak to me with disrespect I will say goodbye and end the call. I did.

I am proud of myself. It is not that I no longer care. It is that I care for myself, too.

COPA

I can relate to the Prilosec thing. I've had heartburn for the past week..been taking Zantac many days. Not typical for me to have heartburn.

The yelling phone call took me by surprise as I was typing my thread reply here, on my phone, so I jumped. He didn't even wait for a reply from me...just hung up after the 45 second rant. So I texted him this:
I have no earthly idea what you're talking about! Perhaps he suspects it (relapse) because you've not contacted him in many days? WRONG what you just did to me!
Maybe he cares about you & wants you to stick with AA?!!

Apparently his cousin called or texted son tonight with something about a certain AA Mtg that he should go to or something AA related. My son avoids this cousin when he's not sober, cousin is smart guy & likely put 2+2 together. But, of course it had to be my fault.

He has not responded to the text. Turning off ringer now.

 

[Copabanana]

What I cannot handle, are posters leaving drama posts re: things which I have no control over. A car that HE owns. Of course I worry about that. What can I do to change it? Nothing.

I know.

I felt this way too. Like how much more can I take? I was looking to diffuse the guilt and fear I had not get more of it.

It is not your fault. It is not my fault. There is not one thing that we can or should do except to take care of ourselves by setting limits and making our lives rich and ourselves healthy. This we do by letting go of all of the sense of responsibility we have shouldered, not taking on more.

I did think of the one thing I owe my son to do, still: Take care of myself. Not let him hurt or disrespect me or my environment. Tell him the truth, if he asks, or if he asks something of me, or does something to me, tell him the truth about how it effects me, how I believe it will effect him and what I expect. That is the role of a parent of an adult child as I understand it now. At least it is for this parent.

No criticism of anybody else can stick unless we believe already inside of us that we have done something wrong. That it is our fault. If what others say or do hurts us, it is a clue that somewhere inside of us we believe we deserve punishment. That is what I believe now.

We are not to blame and we are not responsible anymore. There is nothing you could of or should have done or done differently or can do now. Anything we knew to do, we did. When we knew better, we did better.

Your son knows that about you. He knows he has a mother who loves him. He knows he has a mother with integrity. Nobody is perfect. How can we expect ourselves to be?

This is all about your son and his choices and what he will do differently when he wants to. Not one moment sooner. He knows what to do. He knows where to go. He will do it when he wants to.

If he does not take responsibility, nothing will change for him. That is true for my son too. I had to accept that.

Turning off ringer now.

Good move.

COPA

 

[BusynMember]

Very sorry about talking about the car. Really. I did ask if you gave it to him. If you didn't, it is out of your hands. My daughter found "friends" (cough) who let her drive their cars and had two accidents.She has also quit drugs and is straight now over ten years, so THERE IS HOPE. THERE IS ALWAYS HOPE. It has to come from them, but I didn't expect my daughter to quit. I thought she'd end up dead or in jail. She did not talk to us about quitting. She just did it. People quit drugs, alcohol, gambling...all addictions....they quit every day. But it has to come from them.

We are only sharing our own experiences. It doesn't mean we are right for your situation.

Big hugs.

 

[toughlovin]

Copa - I totally get why you keep your distance. Your health and well being has to come first. My son is across the country which means we have some natural distance and to be honest that is helpful to me.... Because what is going on with him is not in my face all the time. When he was near by it was much harder in some ways..... Although easier in others.

I also agree that my life does not depend on what my son does. I have gone on and developed a life for myself and am no longer completely consumed by how he is doing. And it does not sound horrible to me that that is even true about him living or dying!

I am haunted by 3 recent deaths of young people my kids knew. I really can't say how I would handle that..... BUT I came to the point when my son was homeless and I was lying in bed worrying about him being dead in a gutter somewhere... Where I realized I had no control over his choices and that included his choice to live or die. He has got to want to live to live and if he doesn't there is not a lot I can do about that. That relates to drugs and to suicidality. If he asks me for help I can help.... Twice when he was living near me I took him to the hospital when he called and was suicidal. The fact that he called me was a sign that he wanted to live. In a bizarre way that has given me comfort. But in the end we have no control whatsoever of their choice in this matter.

 

[TheWalrus]

Rebelson -

We all have our "journey" with our children. For some, they have always been difficult, the relationship always strained, the chaos and drama beginning from an early age. It is that way for me. And I think that is perhaps why it has been easier for me to take in all the advice without seeing criticism and detach and create boundaries. This has been my life for a long time, and coming here helped it all make "sense" and gave me a path to follow to save myself.

For others, the children they had wonderful, loving relationships seemed to change overnight and become people that were unrecognizable from who they had been. Such a sudden loss of that relationship add to the confusion, guilt, pain, and fear.

I don't know what it has been for you, but as many have said, we are all on different places on this path.

Because every child, every situation, and every relationship is different, there is no "right" answer that fits us all. Often, there is no "right" answer - just the one we can live with. Even with my detachment, there are still things I take care of and "monitor" on behalf of my daughter. Yet I do only what I am comfortable with for reasons that make sense to me (not her) and do not allow myself to be pulled into anything that I am not comfortable with or cannot agree to. And things that are out of my control? I have to accept they are her decisions and trying to intervene will only cause a fight, more venom, and her possibly using it against me or as an excuse to pull away. I still worry - but I don't pack a bag and live inside that worry.

For me, the thing that helps the most now that I see my child how she is right now is that I decide the boundaries of our relationship and what I will and won't do for her, and I remain consistent no matter the situation. I think it helps her to know the lines no longer shift and there are no more games or manipulations to try, and it gives me back control of my life and my sanity.

 

[Copabanana]

For others, the children they had wonderful, loving relationships seemed to change overnight and become people that were unrecognizable from who they had been. Such a sudden loss of that relationship add to the confusion, guilt, pain, and fear.

That was how it was for me. My son had problems but not with me, not with our relationship, until he was about 16 or so.

I spent almost a decade fighting him. Fighting the sense of helplessness and loss in myself. Add to the constellation of emotions that come up: Anger. Betrayal. Right or wrong I felt betrayed. My dreams were betrayed. Of course I had no right to impose on him my own dreams. Not specific dreams. But my own need that he be happy, thrive. So that I would. I know that. It does not make it easier.

For me, the thing that helps the most now that I see my child how she is right now is that I decide the boundaries of our relationship and what I will and won't do for her, and I remain consistent no matter the situation.

The hardest task I am faced with is what to do for "hope?"? I want to have hope. I want to see him doing better. For who? For me?

COPA

 

[New Leaf]

The hardest task I am faced with is what to do for "hope?"? I want to have hope. I want to see him doing better. For who? For me?

There is always hope, that is the biggest thing I hang on to.
I think hope is for our d cs and us.
Hope that we can respond better and better each time we have contact.
Hope that our d cs will see the consequences of their choices, and learn to make better choices. Hope that we can achieve radical acceptance, steady state and live to be present. Hope that we can love our d cs enough without going into despair with them. Hope that we can live our lives to the fullest as an example to our d cs that they can do this, too.
Hope can come in small and large doses.
There is always hope.

leafy

 

[rebelson]

My son called me an hour ago. Said he was going night ocean fishing on his friends boat, and asked me for $15. I said no I could not do that. That I could not give him any money that he could use for alcohol, especially while out on a boat at night. He said he needed it for bait. I know, wrong answer, but I said I would give him $5 for the bait. He said if he wanted the $15 to buy alcohol with, he could easily not ask me & go to the store and use the gift cards that I sent him (which he very well may have depleted already). So those maybe are not even an option for alcohol, if they are empty of $. Hence, why he is asking me for $? I told him I can't trust what he would do with the money, & that I refuse to further contribute to anything that is harmful to him. (I.e. Etoh)

Long story short I held firm and eventually had to hang up on him. He was irate. Literally, I liken it to a "temper tantrum". Immediately he begins belittling, bashing, calling me names. Horrible names. He called me every minute for six minutes straight, no msgs. Just kept calling over and over. When that didn't work (I didn't pick up) he started texting me the more horrible, mean nastiness. My husband, who was at work, got a few of his own texts from son. One of them son told him to get his name tattoo OFF his arm. Again. He was oblivious to what was going on so he called me and asked what was up with son. When my husband came home he was so mad! He told me not to give him a dime. Said he is contemplating covering up my sons name tattoo on his arm. He's sick and tired, I need to get there.

Finally, after about 30 minutes of almost continuous calls and texts.... My phone quieted down. I don't know why, but he goes for the jugular..in terms of saying the most hurtful things. His father used to do that to me when we were together. Is this genetic?

Edited to add that now my worry/anxiety mode is kicking in. Picturing him on the ocean, at night, potentially with someone else's alcohol. I feel my anxiety ramping up right now....pls pray for us. I seriously feel my heart rate increasing.

 

[Copabanana]

I said I would give him $5 for the bait.

He will be OK. I am glad he did not get any money from you. I would not give him a dollar if it was me. Easy for me to say, but I would not.

The thing is you cannot keep him safe. Even if he is in your house.

His father used to do that to me when we were together. Is this genetic?

I do not think so. I think it is developmental. In the sense that your son is trying to grow up and not doing a great job of it.

In the long run it is not about what is wrong with your son and why. It is about what you do to take care of yourself, while he works out (or not) his own life. Boundaries, self-care, support, learning.

COPA

 

[Copabanana]

I would think about what you need to do right now to take control of these phone calls. No more abuse. Please do not let him treat you badly.

COPA

 

[toughlovin]

Oh sorry you are going through this.. I too am glad you didn't give him the money.... You had offered him $5 for bait and he got abusive and so got nothing! Good message, he gets abusive he gets nothing!

I think when he starts calling you names and being nasty hang up immediately! He needs to learn that you will not put up with it at all. And given how he then calls non stop at that point turn your phone off.

I do this with my son.... Who can also get very nasty and manipulative. When it starts I hang up. He needs to learn that kind of nastiness and manipulation will not work on you.

I understand the worry.... But honestly he probably has more survival skills than you think.... And there is not a thing you can do about what he is doing anyways.

TL