Still looking at residential

[BusynMember]

Drew, I hope everything goes well. I also need you to realize something...as one who has been in a psychiatric hospital three times...she has to want to change. It is like that in every form of therapy. She will learn to say and do the right thngs to become discharged. That doesn't mean she has changed inside of her though. Therapy is a lot like drug rehab in that it is only as useful as the person getting the treatment wants it to be. Then there is the follow up afterward...the person has to want to continue the help. I put my son in the hospital when he was twelve and he hated it so much that he still brings it up as a horrible experience. It didn't change him at all.

Make sure you are not using this as a punishment. She may nor may not think she has it good/bad because of this. She also may, say, clean herself while there because they will forcefully put her in a small room if she doesn't, but she may not do it once she gets out. She may or may not tell them the truth about what is bothering her. She will tell them something, but it may not be the truth.Therapy doesn't tell you "Now your father is good to you. You'd better like him." Therapy is a lot about talking to a qualified person and coming to your own conclusions and you may not like the conclusions she draws. I learned I had an abusive family. At least, I feel they were abusive and every therapist I've had agreed with that so I moved away from them. Not saying your daughter will decide you are abusive. She is young and probably loves you to the moon and is not abused (I was). But just saying that she isn't going to be told how to think. Therapists let you figure t hings out for yourself. Hopefully she will figure out how much you love her and want to help her.

Hopefully what will happen is that she will be correctly diagnosed and treated for whatever disorder she has that is causing her to be unable to function well. And hopefully she will embrace the treatment and want to get well. Residential Treatment Center (RTC) and therapy should not be used as a punishment as in "If you don't listen, I'll put you in an Residential Treatment Center (RTC)." I'm not saying you are doing that, but a little bit of your post came back at me as if you sort of are trying to scare her into liking it at home. A mental health facility is to treat mental health problems, but it won't cure them, even if she is there a year. She will have to keep on helping herself. There is a reason your daughter is not acting like a typical teenager. She is not just being defiant and "bad." She may need medication or other interventions.

I really felt that being in the hospital helped me A LOT. But I wanted to go and I did all I could to help myself. Some hospitals are good and some are like jails, which are the ones that only help short term because you are afraid...and some are abusive too. I was careful about where I went, but still there were people who ended up in isolation rooms, something I disagree with and that I think can cause worse problems than you have going in.

I do hope everything goes well for your daughter and she gets the help she needs for her mental illness or neurological difference and I hope she comes to see the Residential Treatment Center (RTC) as a place that wants to help her. Good luck!

 

[DawnMM]

I am brand new to this forum, but I have read your previous threads. It seems very clear to me that your daughter does need help and also that you may be in a bit of denial about it (not too much though, since you are getting her help). She is a good kid who plays on the computer too much - that is normal. You can't make her stop - not normal. Also, her response to your parenting is not okay. She seems to be causing a massive upheaval in your home and you cannot live that way. I just sent my son to a residential wilderness camp so I know the feelings of denial and also the massive relief after he left. When you tell your family and friends why she left don't say she is a good kid who plays on the computer too much. I better description that more people will understand is that she become addicted to Internet games, became depressed and was defiant and disrespectful.

My sons issues are very different than your daughters and my husband and I lived in massive denial about it. We had locks and alarms on everything to keep ourselves safe for goodness sake, yet we still thought, "maybe he isn't that bad," "maybe we overreacted." He has been at the Residential Treatment Center (RTC) for a month and there is worry and stress along with massive relief. My point is that many other people also thought this was the correct place for my son (as it the same with your daughter). I would not have been able to get my son in yo a Residential Treatment Center (RTC) with just my words. Therapist, doctors, and psychiatrists all had to agree. My sons care is paid for with his adoption subsidy, they wouldn't do that without a good reason. In my case, denial stinks. I wish there was a way to not feel it. If I listed the things my son did and said you would think I was crazy to still feel denial. It is a powerful emotion. My son being at a Residential Treatment Center (RTC) is not my fault. Your daughter going is not your fault, nor your wife's. Many, many, many people let their kids play on MineCraft, this does not happen to most of them. My daughter plays online and has become addicted, she did not behave like your daughter. We were able to help her stop.

I really feel for you. This is such a hard decision to make. No one does it lightly. I believe there is a lot of hope for your daughter, A LOT! She was a good kid before and she will be again.

 

[DawnMM]

I forgot to mention that we had family based services before my son left. We stopped them early because a space opened up at the Residential Treatment Center (RTC) for him. They told us we could get these services again when he returns. You may want to look into this. We are in PA, I don't know what is available where you are. Family based services meant having two counselors come to the house to provide support for everyone for 10-20 a month. It was very helpful. It did take about two months to get it set up.

 

[InsaneCdn]

This is not easy. You're doing the right things. Make sure you also have resources available to help YOU - a therapist or whoever else.

 

[Drew64]

We have people coming to home too. She doesn't participate. I just found out that even if put her in hospital first and transfer her to Residential Treatment Center (RTC) she still has to comply or they won't take her. To me there should be no choice at her age.

 

[InsaneCdn]

I'm not sure about your laws. Here... at 12 years old, they have the "right" to refuse treatment. It's insane, I agree. I believe the only thing close to forced treatment is court ordered, and even then they can't force compliance.

 

[Drew64]

So what do you do with your kid. Leave threat home to waste away. It's insane. If it were a physical problem would be different

 

[BusynMember]

Psychiatric problems and neurological disorders ARE physical conditions. She could have autistic spectrum disorder...that would fit with obsessions and isolation and poor hygiene, for example. That requires interventions, but is not a behavioral disorder. It is a neurological difference that needs treatment, but t he child is probably never going to act just like "typical" children. It could be bipolar or severe depression or secret drug use or a little of a few. Almost all behavior problems are mired with physical differences. Our kids are wired differently.

An Residential Treatment Center (RTC) may or may not help. I've known many kids who went to RTCs and the jury is out. They are a good holding place for a child who can't live at home because he/she is too dangerous or is doing drugs or runs away. But there is no easy fixes. I've heard of better results, at least short term, with teenage boarding schools. Again, though, you have to diagnose your child and have the problem treated. It is complicated with our differently wired children than our typical children. They do not think like we do.

Just hang in there. Likely you should take good care of yourself and learn to detach with love as often this is for the long term. Again, a residential treatment center should not be used as a punishment because a child does not behave the way you want her to. It's not going to work if either she or you see it as anything other than a place for help and if you don't see your child improving, you may have to look for other options/places. There is no easy way to solve our types of children.

A parent should never say, "If you don't act the way we want, you are going to a residential treatment center to learn how good you have it at home." That sets the Residential Treatment Center (RTC) up as a jail, not a treatment center and it is usually the last resort when a child needs help desperately and the family can no live with the child at home anymore. But it's not like juvie hall. Still...they do have an isolation room where your kid can be locked up in a windowless room with nothing to do and only a thin mattress on the floor and it can be traumatic. I know some kids have been locked in them for days, and feel the doctors used them almost sadistically. I did foster care and am not unacquainted with RTCs. Some methods horrified me. Be sure you ask about all this. Ask if they call you if your child is put into Isolation. Hopefully they will say, "We don't do that anymore." And I hope they don't.

That is one punishment I think is total abuse and should be banned. It doesn't teach the child to behave. It makes the child afraid of it, but once he/she is out it can have lead to even more anger. Make sure the Residential Treatment Center (RTC) does not use this method or your daughter could end up in there and worse off for it.

 

[Drew64]

Not doing it to punish her. Doing it for help. They have an alternative school and can get therapy since doesent want to go to outpatient. I did ask about restraints and only used if kid gets physical with staff. I know my kid. She won't get physical. I've also never used it as a punishment. I'd rather have her at home. I stated to her that her behavior is dive taking what happens and she can turn it around if she chooses. I will say again no drugs involved. First of all to scared of them second haven't left house all month except for a doctors appointment.
She thinks she is going to hold out until mom gets help or is out since their relationship can be not the best at times but mom is getting therapy and is functioning. My daughter not functioning.

 

[DawnMM]

My son had to agree to his program. He is 13 and things were so bad here for everyone, so he agreed. I did tell him that I would send him to a non-voluntary boot camp type school if he said no to the wilderness program. I thought they had those still. The wilderness program is ideal for my son who LOVES to be outside and is forever creating things out of the things in our woods. He knew this was better than any other school so he said yes. Also, when the people from the school came they told him all the good things. While he hasn't decided to work on his problems yet, he does like the place I sent him. I hope there is a way to get your daughter to agree. For us, we had to make the alternative worse than going.

 

[Drew64]

The alternative would be somewhere that does not require her consent. Then she would be transported there against her will by a transport service.

 

[Drew64]

Well had therapist at house and tried to explain what was going to happen with respect to placement. My daughter just said I'm not going there and walked back in her room. Wouldn't even say what she wants to do because she can't stay like this. Very frustrating. I knew she would make this as hard as possible. This consent crap for a 15 y/o is just crazy.

 

[InsaneCdn]

She believes she CAN stay like this. It's been going on for a while, right? Of course she won't tell you what she wants to do... she doesn't want to do anything.

its SO hard at this age!

 

[Drew64]

That's why she shouldn't have to consent to going kids don't know what is best for them.

 

[DawnMM]

I was worried my son would refuse to go as well. I was going to have literature from a far less desirable school sent the the house so he could see I was serious. He son knew full well he was going somewhere so he agreed to go. Our situation was very different though, my son has conduct disorder and/or very likely Reactive Attachment Disorder (RAD). Things were so bad here that I would have turned him over to the state for good and he knew it. Since your daughter won't motivate herself to go, you have to find a way to make staying home seen worse than going.

I told my son he could refuse the camp, I then told him what the result would be (psychiatric hospital, boot camp type school, school for mean kids on drugs, foster care group home, ect). You have to find a way to make her believe she is going somewhere and she has no choice but to accept the placement you think is best for her. I wish you the best, this is so hard.

 

[Lucedaleblessed]

As long as she believes she is in control she will go nowhere. As I stated before, print out pages from transportation services for her to be found. If she believes that there is an alternative then she will make the local choice. If there is not alternative she will remain in her room.

Just don't contact either a private place or one of the transport services. There are too many of them outthere who will milk you dry and keep her too long.

 

[FlowerGarden]

If she has internet access, she has probably already looked up the consent laws and knows she has the right to say no. The consent law is the reason we had to get the police involved. It was horrible. We couldn't afford to send our son anywhere else other than places through the state's mental health system. It's so unfair our kids have more rights than us when it comes to their mental health.

 

[Drew64]

Well she told the case manager on Thursday she didn't want to move forward with anything. I then got a text from her stating what she said was wrong. Stuff about losing her best friend (she missed a yr of school from cutting self and has ignored my daughter since back ). Also feels doesn't need therapy. When I got home I praised her for finally acknowledging some. Problem. We the ended up going out to watch her cousins skate lesson and then dinner. First time she's been out socially in a month. Still have date of 3/6 as admit date but she won't go. I told her needs help and could go to outpatient nearby but needs to want to. Can't admit her to hospital since not in any crisis. Options are get her to sign consent. Do intense out patient nearby home. Revisit alternative schools again or have her taken to school out of state that don't require consent. Thought took a step in right direction that day. Over weekend went back to up late and sleeping late. Seeing home therapist Monday and will present options again.

 

[InsaneCdn]

what does she do when she is up late, again? technology stuff? if so, its part of the problem. The light from computer screens messes with our sleep/wake cycles. Like it or not, everybody should be shutting off electronics 2 hours before bed. "Nobody" does that, of course... which is part of why many are short on quality sleep.

And lack of quality sleep is often a huge factor in depression - may cause it, definitely makes it worse.

 

[Drew64]

Of course technology. I've tried in past to take computer away. Always causes a big fight which is what started this whole process. I'm just angered that I can't dictate where she needs care at this age. She can decline anything. And God forgive I carry her out of house to a therapist I'll get arrested.