When it Rains, it Pours

[New Leaf]

I just wanted to add something for you to think of. Maybe true or not in your daughter’s case but, my husband sees it daily. He is a mental health counselor and is on call several days out of the month. It’s pretty cold here where we live and more and more homeless are calling saying they need mental help and or suicidal. A lot of the homeless use these facilities for a few days to get out of the cold, have a few warm meals and a hot shower. Some even use our jails for the same thing.

We live in the islands, so the weather is not too much of an issue here. When my daughters are actively using, all I know is that they are some where out there……….

 

[ANewLife4Me]

Your journey is amazing and I wish your daughters could see how wonderful a Mom they indeed have. 16 years…wow! I am blown away how long this has been for you, so very sorry on the loss of your husband.

I understand if something should happen to one of your daughters, the regret you would feel. It’s definitely a fine line we are traveling. I wish you all the best.

 

[New Leaf]

Thank you Michelle,
My granddaughter and I were talking about this journey with her Mom, how long it has been. Troubles with both daughters started in middle school, so it has actually been challenging for over 20 years. I tried my best as a Mom, made mistakes along the way for sure and am thankful to have three well adult children to keep me somewhat sane.

Your journey is amazing and I wish your daughters could see how wonderful a Mom they indeed have. 16 years…wow! I am blown away how long this has been for you, so very sorry on the loss of your husband.

I do miss my hubs, but am glad that he is no longer suffering. Thank you for your condolences.

I understand if something should happen to one of your daughters, the regret you would feel. It’s definitely a fine line we are traveling. I wish you all the best.

Thank you. I find that writing here and praying has helped tremendously. I am also finding that I need to hold space for my initial reaction of sorrow. We were taught as children to have a stiff upper lip, tough it out and keep smiling. I find that unrealistic now. I am learning to try to process the emotions and let it out. I wrote in an earlier post that I was having not feeling, feelings. If that makes any sense. I’m finding that burying my sadness only brings about aches and pains in my body. Keeping busy was another way of not coping with feelings so I am learning to rest when I can.
My two have been out there a long time. I do miss them and feel that any small connection is a reminder to them of what they left behind and that also we are here as their family if and when they are ready.

The Serenity prayer has been a powerful reminder of the work I need to do.

“God, grant me the serenity to accept the things I cannot change, the courage to change the things I can, and the wisdom to know the difference.”

Thank you for your best wishes. You are doing remarkably well in dealing with your situation with your daughter.
Best wishes to you.
Leaf

 

[ANewLife4Me]

Its hard to even imagine how this has affected you and your entire family. ((HUGS)) My daughter’s troubles started young as well so guess I could say not 10 years but, her entire life. The past 10 being the very worst, I cannot take anymore and why no contact. I feel if anything happens to her while going no contact that while heart crushing, I have absolutely done every single thing for her and am hoping and praying no contact wakes her up to make changes. I am ready mentally if she does not.

I do have good news to share with you! My son, who I have not seen in over a year, said on the phone last night we should get together. We do not have issues like my daughter and I, he and I had an issue how his wife treated me at a family event. We are both stubborn as anything and kept the fight going. Guess we both ran out of steam. At the same time though there is my daughter sneaking into my head and heart trying to make me feel bad for my son and I reconnection. I am going to try very hard and put those thoughts out of my mind and enjoy the life I should be living. My daughter is very much welcome back into our life but, the changes have to begin with her and not just for a day or month. Real change.

 

[New Leaf]

My two youngest children grew up watching us struggle with their sisters choices. So yes, it has been hard on all of us.

My daughter’s troubles started young as well so guess I could say not 10 years but, her entire life. The past 10 being the very worst, I cannot take anymore and why no contact.

That’s a difficult road Michelle. 10 years of dealing with a beloved child growing up making bad choices is a long time.

I feel if anything happens to her while going no contact that while heart crushing, I have absolutely done every single thing for her and am hoping and praying no contact wakes her up to make changes. I am ready mentally if she does not.

You have mentioned that your daughter has been violent with you and you fear for your safety, I absolutely understand why you would not want to engage with her. There was a time while hubs was alive that my Rain became threatening towards me and I had to avoid her. I don’t often see my two, they know where I stand. The lifestyle they choose is a completely different world.

My son, who I have not seen in over a year, said on the phone last night we should get together. We do not have issues like my daughter and I, he and I had an issue how his wife treated me at a family event. We are both stubborn as anything and kept the fight going. Guess we both ran out of steam.

I’m glad for you that you have an opportunity to reconnect with your son. It is good to be able to talk with our adult children who are doing well.

At the same time though there is my daughter sneaking into my head and heart trying to make me feel bad for my son and I reconnection.

Why should you feel bad for having a relationship with your son? If he is respectful and making good choices, that is a good thing. Our wayward adult children have to deal with the consequences of their choices.

I am going to try very hard and put those thoughts out of my mind and enjoy the life I should be living. My daughter is very much welcome back into our life but, the changes have to begin with her and not just for a day or month. Real change.

Good for you Michelle. Keep working on yourself and relationships that are healthy. Our adult children will do as they want, it is what it is. Finding ways to switch focus on what we can change is so important.

 

[Copabanana]

I have some time to think things through to decide whether or not I will put funds into her jail phone account. Right now, I am thinking not.

It's a hard call. (No pun...) Communication is a good thing...when they're sober. How is communication "enabling?" I see it as hope, strength, flexibility....and hard. I shut down like a trap. How is that good? It's not.

I’m not sure if not putting money on her books shows “strength.” I

I think it can be said that putting money on her books, shows hope...and strength. Not saying to do it, but just that there is another way to see and to feel and to be.

n reading on detachment it does not mean we have to cut off communication with our wayward adult kids.

Yes. It's not an all-or-nothing deal. Not linear. Not zero-sum.

The change I am seeking is within myself.

Absolutely.

 

[ANewLife4Me]

n reading on detachment it does not mean we have to cut off communication with our wayward adult kids.

Yes. It's not an all-or-nothing deal. Not linear. Not zero-

Sorry did not get the quote thing right.

So we are encouraged to be honest here and what works for one may not work for another. We don’t know what the other has been through and had no idea what New Leaf has gone through. When she replied to me about 10 years is a long time, I took that as her time dealing with this shorter than mine. I feel bashed at what I am doing going non contact. Maybe I will just go back to reading, was pouring my very soul out and also trying to help.

 

[ANewLife4Me]

Yes. It's not an all-or-nothing deal. Not linear. Not zero-

Sorry did not get the quote thing right.

So we are encouraged to be honest here and what works for one may not work for another. We don’t know what the other has been through and had no idea what New Leaf has gone through. When she replied to me about 10 years is a long time, I took that as her time dealing with this shorter than mine. I feel bashed at what I am doing going non contact. Maybe I will just go back to reading, was pouring my very soul out and also trying to help.

There is no way on this site to delete posts? Nothing I have looked at on this site allows me to do so. My edit is no longer there either.

I am sorry Copacabana but that reply hurt me deeply.

Yes. It’s not an all-or-nothing deal. Not linear. Not zero-

If you only knew how violent my daughter is, how I fear her, you might understand my reasonings.

 

[Copabanana]

They obviously want no part of the life you want for them and continually test the waters to see how much until you break.

I think that some part of my son wants the life I want for him. I don't think it's pure manipulation and lying when he says this or that to secure some part of what I have (to offer or to take advantage of.) I think it's as much self-deceit and self-deception.

The change I am seeking is within myself.

I think this is the issue for my son. He sees change as coming from outside of himself. The manipulation of circumstance, securing results from another person, rather than changing himself.

I think that the 12-step groups work on this. First, beginning to accept one's absolute weakness and vulnerability in the face of reality, And then finding and cultivating true strength and power in the face of this. When we accept "a higher power" and then put this relationship in the place of the addiction, is when we are empowered.

I have yet to see any other way that either makes sense or works.

New Leaf, when you say "change within myself" I see you saying this same thing. It's giving up power to feed our addiction to believing that we have the power to change or save our children.

But we do have the ability to face reality and make our primary relationship be between ourselves and reality which to me is G-d.

At the core of all of this is humility and acceptance of our powerlessness. Which is the basis of strength.

The whole thing is not about boundaries. Not about distance or saying no or enabling or not enabling. It's an acceptance of what is true.

 

[Copabanana]

I am sorry Copacabana but that reply hurt me deeply.

I am sorry. Why don't you tell us what hurt you and we can talk about it. There is no need to apologize.

 

[New Leaf]

I’m sorry you feel bashed Michelle, I don’t think anyone here intends to judge each other’s challenges, or their solution. We are all dealing with incredibly difficult situations, each one unique to our own history. There are many ways to pull up out of the rabbit hole and no contact is one of them. It is up to each individual. I was just sharing my experience.

 

[ANewLife4Me]

The whole thing is not about boundaries. Not about distance or saying no or enabling or not enabling. It's an acceptance of what is true.

There found out how to use quotes. The book I read says differently, one by a mother who is going through this exact thing, and another from a psychiatrist. At times we are enabling and must set boundaries or we keep repeating the same results and patterns. I am choosing what is best for my situation and don’t need to be put down over it.

Am done here. Thanks to everyone for your kindness.

 

[Copabanana]

Maybe I will just go back to reading, was pouring my very soul out and also trying to help.

I hope you don't retreat. The absolute best thing I have found to repair myself is to reply to the posts of others. When we write here to others it is a way to know and to repair ourselves. The people who are actively posting here now, most of them, have known each other for many, many years. New Leaf and I began posting about 8 or 9 years ago, within a few months of each other. There comes from all that time and experience together a deep protectiveness and intimacy. We need to give ourselves a break.

You're right. When people speak from the heart, it can be direct. New Leaf is a master. She is gentle caring and empathic. Not all of us have that gift. We don't have to let other people's failings or limits be about us.. Or anything we wrote. We try to let it go and go from here, to get what we need. Of course that doesn't leave us off the hook to be kind and non-judgmental.

 

[Copabanana]

Am done here. Thanks to everyone for your kindness.

I hope that is not the case. All of us here have gone no contact for a time. I did. I did so when I had a dissociative experience. I blacked out. I realized everything I was as a person and had in my life was at stake of being lost, if I did not protect myself. I don't regret going no contact. I needed to. I made absolute boundaries. I met my son in the street and walked away. To save myself. This would have been about 5 or 6 years ago.

I don't judge myself and I don't judge others.

If you feel judged by me that was not my intention. I apologize.

 

[Copabanana]

This back and forth with your emotions, time and effort you know is not good for you. They obviously want no part of the life you want for them and continually test the waters to see how much until you break. Your son is involved in relaying messages for you, while admirable, it’s still letting them know…..okay Mom is super mad, let her cool off and will try her again later.

I know my son wants part of the life I want for him. The part he wants is comfort and safety and refuge and support. The thing is, he wants it on his terms. His terms are either that we accept him as he is, and impose his way of life on us, or he wants shelter when his way doesn't work. This is to say, his money is gone and he has nothing to eat, no money for cigarettes, and he is cold and wet.

Neither Plan A nor Plan B works for us.

But the thing is, these are relationships we have with our children that are lifelong and perhaps, go to eternity. And as much as relationships with our kids, we have relationships with ourselves and with our lives.

I for one, do not want to retreat into a corner and make my son the bad guy. He is not the bad guy. He is my son. And I am his mother.

Yes. The back and forth costs us, and in so many ways harms us. But it also grows us. Teaches us. Humbles us. Being worn down and breaking is not a bad thing. It's a good thing. Because sometimes breaking down is a breakthrough. Sometimes being broken lets something more vital take seed. Sometimes being broken down can be a way to heal more strongly and differently.

There is no one size fits. Not between us. And sometimes we as individuals outgrow old styles and sizes. All of it is okay.

I am grateful for this site and for each of you, to help me grow.