Advice sought

[Lovelife]

What about during your working hours? Are you able to keep them both with you 24/7?

Does the kid live in your home currently? From your last response it sounds like maybe you are considering removing him from the home?

He does live with us. But I am on a leave from work over the summer to try to integrate the kid, and hub works at home. After having him here tho, we realized he could not function with-o a ton of stuff to keep him busy... like very very busy. He does not do well with any sense of boredom, and tires of things easily. So, he is involved in structured day camps.
Right now, we believe, with all the things being lined up that the Case Manager thinks he needs, it points to residential facility. We live in a small town. Therapies that would target his problems are not available here. And they are ineffective once a week. We had a therapist say nope, he needs more than private weekly sessions.

 

[BloodiedButUnbowed]

Nobody can say you have not tried your hardest.....how would you feel if he did injure or kill one of your precious dogs.....or injured/molested another child.....some of these kids will sexually act out with pets as well......you are like me I am sure, you would never forgive yourself, and unfortunately SomewhereOutThere lived this very nightmare. Bless you for trying but this kid is just too sick and dangerous.

 

[BusynMember]

Im a dog lover also worried about the dogs, considering what our kid did. I dont think the dog should have to shake in fear. Dont trust his affection to them...it is phony. Our kid acted as if he LOVED our pets. Not only did he kill them, but my daughter told me, after he left, that she saw him choking a neighbor's kitten and he dropped it when he saw her so he probably killed other neighborhood animals.
This is no life for your beloved pets. You will find you can't work...you can't leave him alone and caregivers will not keep him.

There are three symptoms of a budding psychopath in children...serial killers studied had them:

1. pooping and peeing inappropriately.

2. fascination with fire

3. cruelty to animals

Sexual acting out is a big red flag that he is unsafe alone with other children.

You cant win or lose here. Due to the neglect/abuse of earlier caregivers, his ability to care about others and love others was ruined far before you met him. You didn't cause it and certainly he is too damaged for you to fix him. He is a danger to you, your pets, and the neighborhood.

I am truly concerned about the welfare and quality of life of both your dogs. They are innocent.

in my opinion this kid needs 24/7 supervision, like residential treatment. Don't adopt him or you will have to he the one who pays for it. Right now the state has to foot the bill. Let the state do it. Eventually he will do something that will force the issue...they know this. They'd rather have you pay than them.

 

[Lovelife]

Also, does he have an IEP and what is his placement? If you are his legal guardian you will be liable for his behavior. sexually assaulting peers is no joke. No non-residential school is going to be able to restrict his freedom to the extent that seems necessary to protect other innocent children from his predations.

So sorry.....

He did have an IEP at last placement. That is being re-evaluated for the coming school year.

Nobody can say you have not tried your hardest.....how would you feel if he did injure or kill one of your precious dogs.....or injured/molested another child.....some of these kids will sexually act out with pets as well......you are like me I am sure, you would never forgive yourself, and unfortunately SomewhereOutThere lived this very nightmare. Bless you for trying but this kid is just too sick and dangerous.

When he jumped on our dog and I heard the yelp, you better believe I felt sick. And seeing how scared our other dog is of him.... yep. I would not forgive myself. And yes he has sexually acted out with one of our dogs (he was humping him), and he will also put his privates on him (and us...on our leg, etc.). And suspicion is he acted out sexually with a kid or two in the previous home. We know the answer. It is hard to admit it though, but would be harder to admit it after he destroyed our lives.

 

[BloodiedButUnbowed]

You are a strong person, I can tell from your posts.

You know what you have to do, or risk much greater heartbreak and devastation down the road.

Is there any way a relative can keep your furbabies until he is out of the home? Just to further guarantee their safety. A temporary separation is better than a permanent one and it can happen in an instant. You have already seen him sexually abuse one dog, right?

I am sorry the kid is so screwed up. Unfortunately nothing will change that. He will need to be institutionalized for the rest of his life, most likely.

You did not give birth to, abuse this boy, and his situation is not your responsibility.

Good luck

 

[BusynMember]

Get out of this. You cant help him. He needs more thsn any family can give.

Sexually acting out on kids...get him out. You have been warned. You dont want the blame for this. If he is cunning enough he may even tell the police,"They sexually abuse ME," This false accusation is common in Reactive Attachment Disorder (RAD) kids and is taken seriously.

We are fortunate our kid confessed and did not think of this common turnabout. I know people it happened to though.

You could end up in jail. Try fostering drug exposed infants. You can do a ton of good for them. This boy needs professionals watching him 24/7.

culturanta, sadly there is nothing available inpatient for the disturbed after age 18. Our kid is out of residential and has three kids he probably perps on. I found him on FB and got rather sick. Of course his young wife probably knows nothing.

 

[BloodiedButUnbowed]

Yes, by institutionalized I meant jail.....

And SOT I am so sorry for what you lived through. My heart bleeds for you as a lifelong animal lover.

 

[BusynMember]

culturanta, thank you so much. We made it through...the county felt sorry for our wish to help a child and what happened...they defrayed. much of the cost for treatment of the entire family. The victimized kids are responsible happy adults now...I still cry real tears thinking about how we did not know thus did not protect them.

Every time I also think of two strangled dogs, one a puppy, and how this boy cried harder than the rest if us, I feel I owe it to them to warn others who mean to do good with children that the system failed...they are a serious risk to other living creatures and should never be placed in homes, and tug the hearts of loving people...I feel I owe it to my hurt and dead ones to warn others to back off. Placing them with families helps nobody, not even them. They need more than any family can give. The state wants us to pay for their care...they know these degree of damanged children will end up in residential treatment and don't want to pay. They want us to.

Now that my kids are adults, I help rescue dogs and feel a kinship with all animal lovers, including wild animals. Much warmth to you .

 

[Lovelife]

culturanta, thank you so much. We made it through...the county felt sorry for our wish to help a child and what happened...they defrayed. much of the cost for treatment of the entire family. The victimized kids are responsible happy adults now...I still cry real tears thinking about how we did not know thus did not protect them.

Every time I also think of two strangled dogs, one a puppy, and how this boy cried harder than the rest if us, I feel I owe it to them to warn others who mean to do good with children that the system failed...they are a serious risk to other living creatures and should never be placed in homes, and tug the hearts of loving people...I feel I owe it to my hurt and dead ones to warn others to back off. Placing them with families helps nobody, not even them. They need more than any family can give. The state wants us to pay for their care...they know these degree of damanged children will end up in residential treatment and don't want to pay. They want us to.

Now that my kids are adults, I help rescue dogs and feel a kinship with all animal lovers, including wild animals. Much warmth to you .

This kid fake cries, with a smile on his face. Usually over the loss of a small privilege.
no kidding.
I really appreciate what you guys have provided, as painful as it is for you. You all are amazing people and I feel so much for you.
Looking back at the file, this kid had attachments issues early on and even went through a reputable foster attachment program. Sadly, early neglect and trauma and the impact on the brain development, is the real deal. He's festered in the system for 6 years. Might not be too late, but it will take years to even get him close to normal.

 

[Lovelife]

You are a strong person, I can tell from your posts.

You know what you have to do, or risk much greater heartbreak and devastation down the road.

Is there any way a relative can keep your furbabies until he is out of the home? Just to further guarantee their safety. A temporary separation is better than a permanent one and it can happen in an instant. You have already seen him sexually abuse one dog, right?

I am sorry the kid is so screwed up. Unfortunately nothing will change that. He will need to be institutionalized for the rest of his life, most likely.

You did not give birth to, abuse this boy, and his situation is not your responsibility.

Good luck

Thank you culturanta. As are you.
We have the animal situation under control. Always always line of site and never alone with them. They sleep with us at night. He is out of house during the day (Highly supervised day camp.), never alone when he is home. All of our knives are locked up.
And yes, we worry about what he might start doing to other kids... the sexual behavior is very abnormal and persistent. We cannot do this to our community.

 

[GoingNorth]

I'm sorry you are going through this. The emotional turmoil and pain must be horrible.

That said, the fact remains that this child is deadly dangerous. Too dangerous now, and mostly always too dangerous to live in society, let alone in a home with living beings that are vulnerable to his attacks.

I don't recommend adopting this child. I recommend returning him to state care with the recommendation that he be put into severely restrictive care where what is possible to treat can be treated.

This is the type of scenario that could very easily end up with your house burned down, or you and your family slaughtered.

Please. Love CAN'T fix all. Reactive Attachment Disorder (RAD) children, and he is textbook severe Reactive Attachment Disorder (RAD), do not grow out of it, with help, tey learn to lay on a veneer of normalcy over the Reactive Attachment Disorder (RAD), but you can't change an entire way of handling and expressing emotion that developed between the most formative years emotionally.

 

[Lovelife]

I'm sorry you are going through this. The emotional turmoil and pain must be horrible.

That said, the fact remains that this child is deadly dangerous. Too dangerous now, and mostly always too dangerous to live in society, let alone in a home with living beings that are vulnerable to his attacks.

I don't recommend adopting this child. I recommend returning him to state care with the recommendation that he be put into severely restrictive care where what is possible to treat can be treated.

This is the type of scenario that could very easily end up with your house burned down, or you and your family slaughtered.

Please. Love CAN'T fix all. Reactive Attachment Disorder (Reactive Attachment Disorder (RAD)) children, and he is textbook severe Reactive Attachment Disorder (Reactive Attachment Disorder (RAD)), do not grow out of it, with help, tey learn to lay on a veneer of normalcy over the Reactive Attachment Disorder (Reactive Attachment Disorder (RAD)), but you can't change an entire way of handling and expressing emotion that developed between the most formative years emotionally.

Thanks GoingNorth. and Yep. We went in knowing love is not enough. We only just started thinking about the attachment issues based upon how he has acted....(attempts at affection, followed by very negative, almost violent responses, the defiance, animal abuse, sexualized behavior, etc.). The best thing we can do for him is get him the best possible treatment in a facility, and hope he heals. He will not get better in a home.

 

[Lovelife]

I'm sorry you are going through this. The emotional turmoil and pain must be horrible.

That said, the fact remains that this child is deadly dangerous. Too dangerous now, and mostly always too dangerous to live in society, let alone in a home with living beings that are vulnerable to his attacks.

I don't recommend adopting this child. I recommend returning him to state care with the recommendation that he be put into severely restrictive care where what is possible to treat can be treated.

This is the type of scenario that could very easily end up with your house burned down, or you and your family slaughtered.

Please. Love CAN'T fix all. Reactive Attachment Disorder (Reactive Attachment Disorder (RAD)) children, and he is textbook severe Reactive Attachment Disorder (Reactive Attachment Disorder (RAD)), do not grow out of it, with help, tey learn to lay on a veneer of normalcy over the Reactive Attachment Disorder (Reactive Attachment Disorder (RAD)), but you can't change an entire way of handling and expressing emotion that developed between the most formative years emotionally.

When you go to many of the Reactive Attachment Disorder (RAD) forums, much of it is positive, talking about finding the right therapist, having patience, love, etc. Many claim the kids can be turned around. *sigh*

 

[Lovelife]

I'm sorry you are going through this. The emotional turmoil and pain must be horrible.

That said, the fact remains that this child is deadly dangerous. Too dangerous now, and mostly always too dangerous to live in society, let alone in a home with living beings that are vulnerable to his attacks.

I don't recommend adopting this child. I recommend returning him to state care with the recommendation that he be put into severely restrictive care where what is possible to treat can be treated.

This is the type of scenario that could very easily end up with your house burned down, or you and your family slaughtered.

Please. Love CAN'T fix all. Reactive Attachment Disorder (Reactive Attachment Disorder (RAD)) children, and he is textbook severe Reactive Attachment Disorder (Reactive Attachment Disorder (RAD)), do not grow out of it, with help, tey learn to lay on a veneer of normalcy over the Reactive Attachment Disorder (Reactive Attachment Disorder (RAD)), but you can't change an entire way of handling and expressing emotion that developed between the most formative years emotionally.

We also do not believe he just has Reactive Attachment Disorder (RAD). He could very well have CD as a co-morbid condition. He is cognitively delayed, motor skilled delayed... all fairly minor/moderate....not concerning. But dad was ASPD. Mom had many issues too.

 

[GoingNorth]

Reactive Attachment Disorder (RAD) kids, if they grow out of Reactive Attachment Disorder (RAD), very often wind up with severe personality disorders, ASPD is one of them. CD would be difficut diagnoses with Reactive Attachment Disorder (RAD) as so many of the behaviors are the same.

 

[Lovelife]

Reactive Attachment Disorder (Reactive Attachment Disorder (RAD)) kids, if they grow out of Reactive Attachment Disorder (Reactive Attachment Disorder (RAD)), very often wind up with severe personality disorders, ASPD is one of them. CD would be difficut diagnoses with Reactive Attachment Disorder (Reactive Attachment Disorder (RAD)) as so many of the behaviors are the same.

Yes, they are. Often over lapping. If he acted the same way with ALL adults in his life, and outside of the family environment, CD would be more feasible. The attachment problems he displays, probably make Reactive Attachment Disorder (RAD) more probable. Hopefully, a psychiatrist can confirm.

 

[Ironbutterfly]

We also do not believe he just has Reactive Attachment Disorder (Reactive Attachment Disorder (RAD)). He could very well have CD as a co-morbid condition. He is cognitively delayed, motor skilled delayed... all fairly minor/moderate....not concerning. But dad was ASPD. Mom had many issues too.

Do you know if he was sexually abused at other places before coming to your home? His sexual actions with your family, animals screams to me that he was abused at some point. My girlfriend's niece was 3 years old and she had a stuffed teddy bear, a big one. One day she rode that teddy bear in an inappropriate manner. Her Mom became suspicious. Long story- but basically her dad was putting her on his lap and raping her. She divorced him and he went to jail. The daughter had years of therapy.

I do agree with others, please do not adopt him. He is too far gone for "love and good home environment" to turn him around. The best thing is for him to placed in a specialized treatment facility. I am so sorry, I know your heart was in the right place.

 

[BusynMember]

He was obviously sexually abused at some time but often kids forget it happened. It is a defense and it goes deep into the subconscious. But even though they may forget it, as ours did, they act out sexually and/or like to get their parents into trouble by calling cps or the cops to claim THEY were sexually abused by their parents. I know foster parents who lost all their kids for long periods of time because of false abuse allegations. They can also go to jail or be forced to sign up for that abusers list. CPS is unlike our regular justice system. They assume you are guilty and act accordingly. It's the child's word against yours. Sexually abuse are hot button words. The kids know it.

That social services has seen this child fail over and over again in a family, it's kind of scary that they keep trying.

I do think Reactive Attachment Disorder (RAD) can be cured...yes cured. I've read at least one book written by a kid who had Reactive Attachment Disorder (RAD) and decided to trust his parents. But he wasn't as disturbed as our boys are although he was no fun to have at home.

I think there is a spectrum, like with most disorders. There are kids with attachment problems who don't hurt others but don't bond. And there are those who are trying to or killing animals by age 9. Those are the ones I don't think will ever be right.

Also most kids in foster care were drug/alcohol exposed in utero and that makes it even worse.

Reactive Attachment Disorder (RAD) is like antisocial personality disorder in a child. Neither treats living beings as anything more than objects for their own gain. They lack the normal human emotions and are good, remorseless con artists.

 

[BloodiedButUnbowed]

Best of luck to you. It sounds like you are working with a great team who will advocate for what is best for this child and for those whom he impacts, human and animal.

Does his caseworker know that he has abused your dogs?

How much longer will he be in your home? Will he be gone before your leave from work runs out, and you may have to worry about him being alone with the dogs? Some workplaces do allow pets. Maybe that is an option as might be doggy day care out of the house.

I would fight like hell to make sure he retains an IEP with a primary disability of emotional disturbance, if he has ever acted out in school this should be a no brainer. If he hasn't acted out in school, he may be labeled as learning disabled or intellectually disabled, but he needs a behavior plan in any case.

You have the right to request that the school evaluate him at their expense, even if he was recently evaluated and you do not agree with the results, or think they are incomplete in some way. Just want to be sure you know this. Does he attend the public school in your area?

 

[Lovelife]

This kid needs 24/7 constant supervision. You need to sleep and can't be watching him at night. And it is my understanding that if kids are going to learn to follow rules, they need to learn by age 15.

So I think the best thing for him would be to be placed in a facility where he is locked up and constantly watched at night and closely supervised with each and every little thing he does during the day. Going to another foster home will not help him, he needs that 24/7 supervision.

I know you can decline to take him, but I don't know if you could suggest to them where he be placed?

Thank you so much, we know you are right.