He's been kicked out of the shelter

[Lil]

Well, he's actually here now, doing some laundry, taking a shower, etc. We had earlier told him he could. He's been cold-cotting at the shelter. Says the people at the house are literally insane and he doesn't want to stay there. Problem is, he only gets to sleep until 6:30 at the shelter. Right now not too bad because his hours are so bad, he's getting off at midnight or 1...but when he starts getting off at 2-4 a.m., the lack of sleep will be a problem.

I'm afraid this will be the day he asks to come home. We will say no.

I'll update tonight.

 

[Tanya M]

Hugs to you Lil.

 

[recoveringenabler]

 

[Scent of Cedar *]

Our difficult children would be mortified if they knew how "famous" they've become.

:O)

Cedar

Got a flash of difficult child son when you mentioned the shower, Lil.

Try to remember that you have time. You can change, and change your mind again. Nothing is written in stone, everything can be renegotiated depending on his response.

 

[Lil]

So far, a bit of a fuss, a bit of a fight, but in the end after all was calm and we got past the panic he was in because things have gone very badly, we are discussing doing something I'm sure several of you will think is crazy...paying the deposits and 1st month rent for an apartment and yes, possibly co-signing a six month lease.

We're apprehensive, no doubt. We've told him flatly, we've been scr__ed before...by HIM...and if he does it this time, we're done. This is his one and only chance. We'll get him settled, but after that rent is on him. He loses his job he better find another even if he's scrubbing toilets in McDonald's.

He's rather adamant that he wants to make this work. He wants to keep this job. He wants to work but can't figure out anything else to do because of his hours. He works 9 to whenever (full-time starts next week with the legislative session) and if he cold-cots he will only get 2 hours of sleep or so and that simply won't work. He has no friends. We have no family close. Frankly, we can't think of anything else to do. None of us want him to lose his job. He could go to another town and be homeless there, but he'd have no more resources than he has now.

I might add, he did not ask to come home, although I kind of went nuts for a bit and told him flat out it was not going to happen and gave an exhaustive list of reasons why. It wasn't pretty there for a bit and I probably didn't help.

He's our son. We are still willing to help him, trying not to enable him, but this really is something that he needs immediately and hasn't got the ability to do himself. The house he was set to stay at apparently is full of meth. That won't do. He actually does manage to stay away from hard drugs and I want that to last. He only stayed there one night and has cold-cotted since.

I suspect my wonderful, fantastic husband made the offer to him that we help with the apartment out of love for me. I will never, ever, stop being grateful that I found such a man.

It may blow up in our faces. If so, we'll deal. But it truly and honestly is the last time. He screws this up, I swear I am done.

 

[BusynMember]

Lil, I think this is actually a good thing. You have told him it is his last chance. You spelled it out. He has it made. Many parents would not do that for a kid who has his stuff together. He has to know you mean it. Now it is on him. There is no reason not to try one more time. It's when people are still doing it for 25-35 year old difficult children that I scratch my head. You have the resources so give him a chance to do his best. Now he will have to keep working and be responsible. You do sound serious about this being t he last time around. Wishing you good luck!

Jabby is a keeper. You are very blessed.

 

[recoveringenabler]

Lil, you don't have to convince any of us that what you're doing is the right choice for you, you and Jabber are the ones who have to live with yourselves. I think many of us make the same kinds of opportunities available to our kids on whatever level we can and that feels right to us. Remember, there is no right way or wrong way, only what you can live with. And, if it goes south, well, then you make another choice at that time. We can't judge you for doing what you feel is best for your child.

There are a lot of stories here where the parents helped against all odds and lo and behold, the kids got with the program. And, there are an equal amount who ended up holding the bag and even more angry and with emptier pockets. It is what it is. In one year, I gave my daughter close to 10 grand, and her life didn't change one little bit. However, that was a big wake up call for me, and yes it cost me 10 grand, but at that point I knew I had done all I was willing to do. That's the point we usually have to get to, to the point where we feel in our hearts that we have done everything we possibly can to help and then we're done. We all reach that at different times in various ways.

Your son is still young. He is immature and is learning the ropes of adulthood as you let go........he may pull it out of the hat, I hope he does. If he doesn't, well, you'll be the first to know and you can handle it then. You discussed this as a family and you're all on board with it. It's an experiment. I hope it is a successful one.

 

[Tanya M]

Lil, I do not think you are crazy, I think you love your son and are just trying to help him. As I said in my previous post only you and Jabber can say when you have really had enough. Your son is still pretty young and he just might get it together. If nothing else it will give you peace of mind that through the winter he will have a warm place to stay.
Have you given any thought to "rules" that will go along with the apt, like none of his friends can stay there. I do not think co-signing is a good idea because it leaves you on the hook if he doesn't pay the rent but I'm sure you have already considered this and that is your risk to take.

The only thing I can say to you is once you have put it out there that "this is it, no more" you really need to stick to it otherwise you are sending a message to your son that you can still be bargained with.

Thanks for updating us. Keeping good thoughts for you.

 

[Jabberwockey]

I suspect my wonderful, fantastic husband made the offer to him that we help with the apartment out of love for me.

Yes honey, I love you very much. But I love our son too and even though I may not show it as much as you, this tears me up as much as it does you.

Have you given any thought to "rules" that will go along with the apt, like none of his friends can stay there. I do not think co-signing is a good idea because it leaves you on the hook if he doesn't pay the rent but I'm sure you have already considered this and that is your risk to take.

Unfortunately, unless we are willing to simply cut him loose, this is a risk we almost have to take. We are going to talk to management about the apartment tomorrow and will NOT mention co-signing. Unfortunately, with our sons work/credit history (or more specifically the lack there of) we will probably have to co-sign for him to be able to get it. As far as rules go, if we dont have to co-sign then its his place and he can do as he wishes. If we have to, then yes, we will definitely be coming up with a set of rules #1 of which will be J1 IS NOT ALLOWED!!! For any reason, for any amount of time! J1 would happily trash the place telling our son, Dude your mom and dad will pay for it! Chill out and quit being a b_tch!

 

[Lil]

We are going to talk to management about the apartment tomorrow and will NOT mention co-signing.

Oops. I emailed them and did mention it.

As for rules, I do see that as a problem. I'm really, really, really hoping he gets away from J-1. Without a doubt, he cannot stay there. Period. Not if we're co-signing, which we're just definitely going to do. Of course, all we can do is demand. If he's paying the rent starting February, we really can't do anything about it. So we'll insist on a promise...but really, at this point it's all trust and trust is in short supply.

He's napping now. It's been kind of a trying day. In his place I would cry and kiss my parent's feet. He gives attitude even after everything. But, in part I think he may be exhausted. There was one long...not really argument, because there was no disagreement, but bickering...refusal to just listen without constant defensiveness and interruption. It was almost like he simply couldn't shut up! That's all he needed to do. He does wear one out. I'd almost forgot how he can be in the two months he's been gone.

 

[Jabberwockey]

It was almost like he simply couldn't shut up!

Actually, at one point while you were at the store, he actually said he couldnt stop talking. And yes, I do believe exhaustion played a part but either one of us would have simply said "I'm sorry for blowing up but I'm exhausted and need a nap". Then we would have took a nap. He refused until he had a cigarette.

 

[Tanya M]

In his place I would cry and kiss my parent's feet. He gives attitude even after everything. But, in part I think he may be exhausted. There was one long...not really argument, because there was no disagreement, but bickering...refusal to just listen without constant defensiveness and interruption. It was almost like he simply couldn't shut up! That's all he needed to do. He does wear one out. I'd almost forgot how he can be in the two months he's been gone.

It always boggles my mind how our difficult child's can be so ungrateful for the help that has been offered to them and that is part of what makes it so hard to want to help them at all. While he may not see it, it is a generous thing you are doing.

 

[Lil]

Maybe he is grateful, maybe he's not. I actually told him at one point I wanted to hear a freaking "Thank You!"

I really didn't help. Truthfully, I'm very on edge anymore whenever he's around. The nerves are shot and I'm kind of excitable anyway. I once said I thought I was a calm person...Jabber laughed at me. Really, I used to consider myself pretty sedate. lol But my son gets his temper from me and I've just been close to freaking out for weeks so every little thing sets me off. I'm amazed I can still deal with people at work...I know the clerical staff is not getting my best. I need to buy them all candy or something.

I can't say I'm not nervous and pretty unsure about this whole thing. But you know, if he's set up my conscience, which (stupidly) has been bothering me for the last two months, will be clear. He will have a place of his own where he can sleep, eat, live and it isn't that we just tossed him out with the clothes on his back, although I agree he deserved it. He has every chance to make it. Unlike the shelter, he can live his own life, doesn't have to worry about his stuff being stolen. If he hangs with druggies or thieves, it's because he wants to...not because he has nowhere else to be. It's on him...really on him...and if he fails I will have no problem saying, I'm done. (Well, less problem...as it is now, it was just too much. The problem of keeping his job and finding a way to sleep was just pretty much insurmountable. We remove that problem and the rest then is up to him.) I think it really has been kind of bad. Hopefully, this will have been his wake-up-call.

Maybe I will finally be able to be back to the person I was before this. I know I've changed. I know I'm not ... nice. I'm not as pleasant to be around. I want my life back. I think it's safe to say this is as much for me as for him.

 

[in a daze]

Jus a question. What's cold cotting?

 

[Albatross]

Lil, no one judges you or Jabber for what you feel is the right thing to do. I think in these types of situations, as parents we agonize over what the right thing to do is to ensure a certain outcome with difficult child, even though we have no control over what they do. Ultimately you do what feels the most right or the least wrong to YOU, for YOU, out of some lousy choices.

I am hoping that this will give you and Jabber some peace in your hearts and difficult child some breathing room so he can make a fresh start of it.

 

[Jabberwockey]

Jus a question. What's cold cotting?

Cold cotting is when the shelters will let people spend the night on sufficiently cold nights. They have to be there by a certain time, out by a certain time, and it has to be below a certain temperature.

 

[Lil]

Jus a question. What's cold cotting?

Our shelter is a residential shelter. Most people stay long-term, 90 days or so. But there are people who don't want to be residents or, like my kid, get kicked out for infractions of the rules. Those people don't get rooms, don't get to use the lounge, etc., but they are allowed - if it's under a certain temperature (and they pass the breathalyzer) - to sleep on cots in the lobby at night. Hence, "cold-cotting". They can be in the cafeteria when the residents are not eating meals and that's it. Sleep in lobby until 6:30 a.m., sit in cafeteria at tables (but get kicked out of there for about 2 hours at meal times).

Lil, no one judges you or Jabber for what you feel is the right thing to do. I think in these types of situations, as parents we agonize over what the right thing to do is to ensure a certain outcome with difficult child, even though we have no control over what they do. Ultimately you do what feels the most right or the least wrong to YOU, for YOU, out of some lousy choices.
I am hoping that this will give you and Jabber some peace in your hearts and difficult child some breathing room so he can make a fresh start of it.

We know there's no way to "ensure" any outcome here. But we think this is the last, best chance for him. He may fail, but it won't be because he didn't have every chance. He'll be 20 years old in April. It's time.

And yes...we need some peace. Hopefully for good, but I'll take just for a while...like 6 months. lol Stand or fall, he's on his own then.

 

[SeekingStrength]

Lil,

Reading along. As many others feel, I believe you and Jabber are doing a good thing. As I have read many, many times on this forum, it comes down to what helps you sleep at night.

Also, as others have chimed in, in my case, gfg33 was helped many times--at about age 20 we found him an apartment. It was a studio. The couple who rented it did not make us co-sign. The husband wanted a co-signer and the wife said, No, I do not think it is necessary. I have felt guilt about that from time to time. difficult child smoked in the apt (big no-no) and threw parties (another no-no). Ended up catching the couch on fire and got evicted. Moved back home with nightmarish months for husband and me.

And, still, after that..we continued to try to help - though, never to that extent.

Point is, husband and I kept trying to help him and it ended up being ten years wasted. So, I, like others, may try to steer you away from helping because, in our experience, it was years of wasted effort. That does NOT mean it is wasted effort for you guys. It's difficult to not say, NO, NO, learn from us. Do not do this.

But, of course, we don't know nuthin'. It is your journey with your own difficult child. I join everybody else in hoping this catches and which of us can know it will not? As a mother, it makes me happy he will have a warm place. Here's hoping to something good coming of your loving choice.

Stay close. We are here for you. Good/bad/beautiful/ugly and everything in between.

SS

 

[Lil]

Thanks SS. I'm actually not too worried about damages...too worried. But he hasn't got lots of friends...He's not been the "wild party" type of kid. Although of course, who knows? He's no darling, I know that.

I got an email back and we will go tomorrow to look at a studio apartment tomorrow, and maybe a one-bedroom if there's one open. This is the first place we've looked, but of course we have limitations. He has to be close enough to walk to work...which this is...has to be open for pretty much immediate move-in...which this is...and it has to be around $300...which this is. With his income any higher is pushing it. Thankfully he should start getting more hours and be working full time next week.

 

[Jabberwockey]

Just thought everyone would like to know that its pretty much a given at this point that at least a portion of the problem earlier was exhaustion. Lil went to wake him after he had been asleep for around two hours and she couldnt. He mumbled and barely moved. 4 and a half hours after he first went to sleep and he is still out.