the ball is in his court??

[Lil]

Yes, this is a hard truth to accept but once we do there is a freedom that comes with it. I had to grieve the loss of the life I had dreamed for my son. It wasn't that I wanted him to be a Dr. or Banker, although he surely has the smarts for it, I had hoped that he would want to live a more conventional type of life. Get a good paying job, live in an apt. or house, pay his bills, etc... you know, be a productive part of society.

I agree. It took a while to come to terms with the fact that that MY dreams for my child will not come true. To be completely honest, I felt cheated by my son. I didn't get to watch him walk at graduation - he graduated, just wouldn't go thru the ceremony. I didn't get to rent him a tux and take prom pictures. I didn't get to proudly display his accomplishments. I didn't get to put the "honor student" bumper sticker on my car.

I didn't get to feel the pride that other parents do. Accepting that, swallowing the disappointment in what he didn't do - and what he did do, has been very hard.

 

[Albatross]

I think acceptance of their choices is crucial when we are deciding whether or not to give them any assistance. If there is not complete acceptance of their choices, our help will always come with expectations. That always leads to trouble, at least for me!

So I guess that would be what I would be trying to sort out, Copa. How would you feel if he accepted your deposit money to get off the streets, then decided not to work at all and live on $200 a month and his medical marijuana? Would you feel like he was "wasting" your help? What if, after paying the deposits, he decided he would rather live in his car so he could have more spending money per month? Could you accept his choice?

 

[Copabanana]

hi lil and albatross

the car is not his. that said. if i gave the money it would not be to him. i would find a way to deliver it in a form that could only go to that purpose and be verified. i actually told him i would go with him to pay. he brings his part to the bank. i supply the rest. which is probably a deal killer.

he keeps his life close to the vest unless he wants something on his terms. of course i understand he could decide in 2 days he likes the street better.

while i would be disappointed, hugely, i would accept it. and grieve. but i (and he) would know i supported him, unconditionally.

thank you guys.

the graduation and prom i could care less about. i suffer for his suffering. and i want grandchildren. i cannot even bear to hope.

he is saying he weaned himself off marijuana. but he lies. if he only got himself off the street, could bathe and have a kitchen, and used the $200 for food and mj, i would consider it a grand victory. he would have made a commitment to his best interest despite his ambivalence.

i believe in my heart he is working his way through this. i fear too. a lot.

 

[Littleboylost]

Copa
I too get wrapped up in the FOG. I try very hard to replace Fear, Onligarion and Guilt with Faith, Hope with no expectations and Courage. This courage is for me to endure the pain and do what is right to supper but not enable my beautiful son.

It is an exhaustive perpetual slippery slope. We are human and mother's/Parents/Grandparents.

This is not about what if dreams or what could have been. It is about the bare basics of human need, when the hierarchy of basic needs are even lacking for our children we can't help but worry or try to help.

I so hope he is making the right choices to improve his circumstances. Stay strong and be well.

 

[Lil]

the graduation and prom i could care less about. i suffer for his suffering. and i want grandchildren. i cannot even bear to hope.

Oh dear of course! I wasn't suggesting that those little things were on a level with the real issues...merely pointing out that that even the little things parents expect ... we don't get. What we, as parents, hope for our kids is a meaningful life. A stable, at least somewhat conventional, life. A life with more of the right choices and fewer of the wrong ones. In other words, this↓

if he only got himself off the street, could bathe and have a kitchen, and used the $200 for food and mj, i would consider it a grand victory.

What a huge step in the right direction is simply taking care of themselves, off the street.

 

[Copabanana]

son is really in a bind. things are breaking in a way that he has to take responsibility for making a definite choice.

the friend of a friend who has the apt will work with son over the deposit. so i am out of it. friend told me that a woman burst her way into the car where my son is sleeping to shoot up drugs.

my son is not ambivalent about having housing. he is ambivalent about commitment and responsibility and true independence.

thus he raised again the possibility to come home. i've changed mom. these 3 months have changed me. ask h (friend). i'm almost always happy.

j. change is when you change by doing something. handling things. concretely put in place habits by sustained behavior which results in something different in your life and then feeling better is a result.

he asked for money because he has no food. case in point. i did moneygram him a little cash.

i am basically taking a neutral position. coming home to escape this dilemna. ie rescue. is not an option.

 

[pasajes4]

Why can he not go to a food bank? My son is always calling for me to give him money for food. My counselor told me not to give it to him. Mine will use it for drugs. Her reason is that food is the easiest thing for the homeless to get. Her response was to give son information on food banks in his area.

This is a tough one.

 

[Littleboylost]

It is so very hard we see through our lense the chaos their life is in. They just don't seem to get it.

True change is a much needed position before home is an option or he will just bring the chaos with him.

My heart goes out to you. Stay strong and keep well.

 

[Copabanana]

well. new iteration.

call today. he needs money for deposit. today. or will lose opportnity. lie.

asked to be on speaker phone as he was with friend.

i have reservations i said. where's your skin the game j? h is trying to help you. you want me to help you. where are you helping yourself? if you haven't worked how can you take on an obligation to pay that kind of rent? what wiil change?

despite that i did pretty much say i would help. i feel so on a gangplank.

i later spoke with the friend alone who said something that made me so sad: j has not changed. he still wants to focus on his supplements. going to the movies alone. etc. we have to support him to do what he can and push him a little bit. i think the apartment is something he can do. me and another contractor are prepared to give him 1 or 2 days a week work.

then m came home. m thinks son is playing everybody. that there is a large preponderance that points to j's getting my money and not getting the apartment. i doubt that. but who knows? j tells us he wants to come home. he tells the friend he does not want to come back here.

m is in favor of j's coming home. (other house.) he says we can monitor him here.

i cannot really justify helping my son get an apartment he is not motivated to or able to pay for.

so this is where we are; no money yet. requested j call later tonight. we will pose to him a choice.

come back and live in the apt. m's brother will share.

if so: drug free. pay rent. be productive. if you damage willfully i call the police and report the crime.

or

if you wamt the apartment, commit to it and commit to working to pay the rent. commit to paying money back as a short term loan.

that's where i am. except his coming back makes my stomach twist in knots. but each way i pay a price. i am very little convinced he will make this work. but i feel torn

 

[BusynMember]

in my opinion he will not stop smoking pot. And I think he has lots of challenges. You have to deal with not being able to force him to do anything and he has to decide to live on his own in the lifestyle of his choice. He may promise to quit and not really do it.

Hard. It is very hard.

 

[Copabanana]

well. the truth revealed itself. or my son revealed the truth.

mom. you're right. i should have gotten together the deposit and not asked you.

what's your point, j?

it's a lot of money for me to commit to pay for rent.

h is going to be very angry with me

(that's his friend.)

j (to me)but if you don't have the money...

j. i have the money. what it is is i do not want to help you do something you don't want to do. you would have to work to earn the rent. you would have to pay back the money i front you for the deposit. these commitments and decisions must come from you.

oh. you will get the.deposit back when i move out..

j no. my expectatiom is the $300 is a short term loan for which you are responsible.

i have to go mom. i'm calling from a gas station.

no mention was made of coming home.

 

[pasajes4]

Copa, This is the problem I have with my son. He does not want to commit HIS money ( when he has any) to food or a place to live. He wants someone else to pay for those things. He lost the last place he was living in because he would not chip in, and I refused to pay for him. Now his back is against the wall and he wants to move home.....not happening. Nothing changes if nothing changes.

 

[Copabanana]

my son is able to apply for subsidized housing in any county he lives. he resists this. i am still uncertain why.

i believe it is because he prefers dependency and complete independence. kind of like a drover on a cattle drive. always with somebody else responsible. signing on to only go from san antonio to kansas. sleeping under the stars.

wash. rinse. repeat.

the learning is for me to do.

sad and hard. i think i will make it a practice to watch westerns which i love to try to gain some acceptance.

thank you people.

 

[Nomad]

I'm sorry I only recently saw this and only perused.
My heart aches for you.

As a side note we found a gift card from the local food store that was likely designed for when your child goes to college.
Our D.C. Has one and we have one.
When she appears to have a legitimate /emergency food need we can go to our local food store and put money on our card.
Her card has the same number. It's as if it is shared.
Then she can go get food using her gift card. She always keeps the card and never discards it. You can put a small amount like $10...whatever.
True, the person on the other side could get alcohol or cigarettes. But we have found her to be using it for food. When we have any doubts, I make her send us a photo of the food purchased in her apartment.
If you send a D.C. Cash the probability of them using it for something other than food is relatively high. This reduces that risk significantly.

Just something to consider...don't know if it's available in CA or appropriate for your situation.

Note: Your son wants to be a dependent independent. Omg. Confusing as heck. And sorrowful.


This is why I like solid part time jobs, low rents etc. meet me half way with some of these young people whose issues might be incredibly complicated. No matter what your physical or psychological disability, the great majority of young folks should be able to meet that criteria if they are trying at all. And in time with continued effort and therapy, perhaps they can do more.

Usually.

But, I'm in a similar yet different boat, as our daughter has not been able to hold down even a PT job. She has been able to work temporary jobs...relatively often. And her disability check pays the rent and basics since her dad is in charge of the funds. Otherwise, it would be a disaster. Little cause and effect reasoning so she might very well spend her money on something silly and forget to pay the rent and be homeless.

I thank the one above that drugs aren't an issue.

When she messes up royally, she absolutely does go to the food bank.

I can't pretend to fully know what you are going through, Copa. This sounds very hard. I just know this D.C. Stuff is freakin gut wrenching and I'm sorry.

 

[Littleboylost]

Try for a while to focus on yourself and be kind to yourself. This is such a difficult road.

 

[Nomad]

Onligarion....what is this word?

 

[Copabanana]

where is that word, nomad? is it a typo?

new iteration.

spoke with friend who said this: j does not have an option. the car is horrible. sub-human.

that he, friend, will take responsibility that j work. he said upfront that it was he who decided about the apartment. that j does not have a choice. that j does not want to come home. it is only a means to escape.

that j is known and liked and accepted in the brasilian community. he says the prospective roommate is a decent person and knows j. that j can find a girlfriend if he cleans up. that friend is optimistic. that there is hope. friend also said he thought the idea of subdidized housing is bad. that there j will always be with problemed people.

i spoke with m and we agreed to go along.

i will wait for j to call tomorrow and see where we are.

thank you all.

 

[Nomad]

Saw this word within little boy lost's post from tues night. Likely a typo.

 

[Copabanana]

nomad. i think she meant to type obligation. as in: fog. fear. oligarion. guilt.

 

[Nomad]

Yep...