From bad to worse...much, much worse.

[Scent of Cedar *]

Of course, this leads to him talking to me about how he was told by the "couple" that he is nothing but an annoyance and a disruption to the household and that the only reason they haven't kicked him out is they don't want him to be homeless, but they don't like him, don't like living with him, don't want him there and can't wait until he's gone. He said they told him to just stay in his room and don't come out.

When I don't know what to say and I don't want to say what I want to say, I say: "You can do this. You will figure it out. You are strong enough. I love you."

Stuff like that.

Those people are jerks. Maybe this will be a good lesson for him, Lil.

I would buy the bus pass, too.

I have done that.

Lots of times.

It isn't that we can never help. And there is a fine line between what we think we are supposed to do and what we can live with having done or not done.

We have had to learn to respect that line.

It is an easy thing to destroy ourselves, to make a wrong choice and destroy ourselves, when the kids are in trouble.

We break and break and break.

Like Albatross posts for us, that is how the light gets in. Or, out.

That is from Leonard Cohen's "Halleluiah".

Cedar

 

[InsaneCdn]

Of course, he pointed out no alarm clock and no phone, because he won't be able to charge his and it requires charging twice a day

Get him an old-fashioned wind-up alarm clock? Around here, they cost $2 at a garage sale or @5 at the thrift store...

 

[Echolette]

What do you SAY to something like that?

You say "that sounds hard".

and nothing else.

Practice practice practice. It starts to feel right after a while.

Good luck Lil, I know this is hard.

Echo

 

[SeekingStrength]

Hi Lil,

Wanted you to know our youngest child, not a difficult child by anybody's yardstick, has bedbugs. They were in the rent house he and his roommate moved into a year ago. Really dumpy part of town, but he pays his own way and our advice was not listened to. We got him some spray and his grandmother ordered them some Diatomaceous earth. Not certain how much those guys used either.

Bed bugs are about as horrible as you could wish for, but I wanted to reassure you that your son can make it with those nasty critters. My son has always brushed off my alarm at the very thought of them living with bed bugs. (He does know he can never bring any belongings back to our house). He is like, Aw, it's not that big a deal, while his arms would be covered in tell-tale bites.

Even the easier kids can make us roll our eyes - and our insides.

When it is a difficult child, roaches and bed bugs seem even more catastrophic - and they are plenty bad enough.

Here's to the Job Corp countdown! Along with you, I am happy for this opportunity. Keeping good thoughts for your son!

SS

 

[Copabanana]

You are hanging onto Job Corps like it is YOUR last chance,

Lil, I have been worried that this comment was too harsh and I want to tell you I am sorry if it was.

You know I am doing this detaching with training wheels on, and because we have commonality I CAN EASILY SEE YOU (i.e. I see myself in you) whereas I do not so easily see me.

There was no judgment meant, only admiration and caring.

 

[Lil]

Lil, I have been worried that this comment was too harsh and I want to tell you I am sorry if it was.

Not at all Copa. I do desperately want this to be a good thing...the thing that "fixes" him. Realistically, I know that it's unlikely (in the extreme) he'll spend a few months getting a certification in computer tech and suddenly be a more mature, responsible young man. But I've said to myself and others that if it doesn't work out and he just resigns in a few weeks...well, he'll be no worse off than he is now. At a minimum, it'll give ME some time away from him.

I'm trying very hard to keep a picture in my mind of putting him on that plane with a smile and excitement that he's embarking on a new adventure. I hope that's the attitude he goes into this with...some determination to work hard and get his education and a job. He does have some vague plans...he wants to complete the program asap and then move to another area, where this girl he's been "on-line dating" for a couple years lives. Since it's a major metro area, that's not bad...there are jobs in major metro areas.

But heck, at the moment I'm just happy that he said his first day at work was "really fun" (which means he's less likely to quit) and he's getting his community service done.

 

[Scent of Cedar *]

But I've said to myself and others that if it doesn't work out and he just resigns in a few weeks...well, he'll be no worse off than he is now. At a minimum, it'll give ME some time away from him.

This is a true thing. I like it that you are at a place where you can accept that time away would be good for you, too. That is a hard admission for us to make. It feels wrong somehow, to know we are not able to help them and that we need a time away, for ourselves.

This is a safe way for that to happen. You and Jabber have changed the game plan; you have created a new way for all this to work out.

There have been many good changes for you both, and for your son, too.

It's been quite a year, for you and your family.

Cedar

 

[Lil]

...aaannnddd he's already blown off his community service. Called and he's "not feeling well" so he's not going today and tomorrow he has to go to work at 1 and he was supposed to start at noon at the church so he can't do community service tomorrow. SO - the first time he'll work at church will be Friday - assuming his job doesn't want him early THAT day.

I warned him that if he gets called to go to Job Corps and isn't done with community service, don't think that the judge is just going to say, "Oh well." That's NOT going to happen!

He said he'll make up time on Saturday. Of course, that only leaves me and his dad to supervise him. That's SO not going to work. But he has to get it done, so I guess we'll see how many windows he can do in an hour and then just add them up, since we're just NOT going to stay there for hours.

Good grief.

 

[Copabanana]

Called and he's "not feeling well"

Oh Lil. What to say??

so I guess we'll see how many windows he can do in an hour and then just add them up, since we're just NOT going to stay there for hours.

Lil, why not post a thread on this because there could be drama here. I want you and Jabber spared.

Ask the community how they might handle this on Saturday...what do you think?

This is a smart cookie here, your son. Is there not a risk that he might stage a confrontation, when you and Jabber of necessity set a limit? May he not scapegoat you, blame you guys for not saving him from his own choices?

The questions arise. Is calling in sick a piece of his habitual shirking of responsibility or is he trying to sabotage Job Corps or has he said yes to solutions, yes job corps, yes community service, in a momentary knee jerk response to get out of a difficult situation without really taking on the commitments and responsibility for same? Or all of the above?

It really does not matter does it? The consequences need to be his.

I am sorry, Lil. So, so hard.

 

[BusynMember]

Yikes, Lil. He has a seriously, seriously horrible case of not wanting to work. since you are sure he is not using serious drugs, this is him...who he is. maybe got this from bio. dad?

My kids would be in huge trouble if they weren't working when given an opportunity. we expected part time by sixteen and school or full time by after high school and that is one thing we did get. we never gave them any extra money though. One good thing about not having any...lol. they either worked or they were darned bored. You two need to quit your jobs and go lower middle class and then you'd have nothing to give him. what do you think he'd do if he HAD to do it and KNEW you had nothing to bail him out with?

 

[Lil]

Is there not a risk that he might stage a confrontation, when you and Jabber of necessity set a limit? May he not scapegoat you, blame you guys for not saving him from his own choices?

I'm really not worried about a confrontation. He screws up we won't supervise him anymore and he'll have to deal with just the property manager. Just not my problem. There's no scapegoating either. We have nothing to do with this. It's HIS responsibility to get this done. Sure, I'll go to court and say, "Golly Gee Judge" if he gets called to Job Corps early...but I can't stop a warrant if it comes to that. Already told him so.

He has a seriously, seriously horrible case of not wanting to work. since you are sure he is not using serious drugs, this is him...who he is. maybe got this from bio. dad?

Really, HOW could a lack of work-ethic be genetic? HOW?

And yes. His biodad wouldn't hold a job for love or money. Would give a friend the shirt off his back...so long as I paid for the shirt.

You two need to quit your jobs and go lower middle class and then you'd have nothing to give him.

You know, that would make a lot more sense if we hadn't stopped giving him anything.

 

[Lil]

Lil, why not post a thread on this because there could be drama here. I want you and Jabber spared.

Ask the community how they might handle this on Saturday...what do you think?

No time at the moment. Maybe in a bit.

 

[BusynMember]

Really, HOW could a lack of work-ethic be genetic? HOW?

Lack of drive/laziness can be a genetic trait just like some kids are born almost driven to conquer everything and to win. I know it didn't come from you or your excellent environment. I just assumed bio. dad might be allergic to work.

Hey, allergies can be hereditary too

 

[Lil]

That's funny in a very sad way. lol

And exhausting.

 

[Jabberwockey]

The questions arise. Is calling in sick a piece of his habitual shirking of responsibility or is he trying to sabotage Job Corps or has he said yes to solutions, yes job corps, yes community service, in a momentary knee jerk response to get out of a difficult situation without really taking on the commitments and responsibility for same? Or all of the above?

Definitely yes to the habitual shirking. Very possible on the others but no way to be sure.

 

[Scent of Cedar *]

Here I come. "It helped me to...." But I do think this might help. And I am pretty certain you have already done it, but if you haven't: What is your plan for if he should fail abysmally at each of ~ or at any one of, the tasks ~ the Community Service, the windows, the Job Corps?

If you have a plan for the worst, you will be able to stay steady-state.

If you have a plan for the best, you will be able to stay steady-state.

It isn't about your son, because it cannot be. Since you have done all you can and continue to be there for him in every healthy way and since you always were, now could be a time when you make a plan for how your response will look, for how it will look as you stand up and survive whatever comes next ~ good or bad.

What would be your best imaginary response to each potential upcoming failure or success?

Who and how do you strive to be, going through it?

What would happen if you told him he needed to find his own way to window washing?

This is a secret thing I know: We could all be considered lazy by someone. Just depends on who you ask and on how you are looking. So, lazy is not part of the equation. It is a question of will.

He may come through this yet.

Cedar

 

[Jabberwockey]

This is a secret thing I know: We could all be considered lazy by someone. Just depends on who you ask and on how you are looking.

A few years ago I had told him after shoveling the snow from our driveway and that of our elderly neighbors that, since they snuck me a 12 pack of soda and a $20 bill for doing it against my wishes, that they would probably not hesitate to give him $30 if he shoveled their drive come the next snow. He said ok.

A few weeks later we have another snow heavy enough to have to shovel the driveway again. I remind him, he states that he is waiting for the snow to stop. Still snowing pretty heavy so not unreasonable. Several hours later its still snowing but has slowed significantly. I'm dressed to go shovel our drive. I remind him again on my way out the door and comment that several people are already out. He is still waiting for it to stop snowing. A while later, I'm almost finished. Our son is still inside the house and another neighborhood teen walks up their drive and starts shoveling their drive. 15 or 20 minutes later our son comes out and see's the other kid shoveling the drive. I state the obvious, that he waited too long. He storms into the house and I go in because I'm now done. He goes off on a tirade about someone else doing HIS job blah, blah, blah. I remind him that he had no agreement set up with the neighbors and that it was his fault that he waited too long to get started.

Ok, did forget to mention that when I finished our drive I started helping the other kid. Didn't know him but these were REALLY good neighbors and I wanted to make sure it was done correctly so I was a quarter of the way up from the road by the time our son came out. Basically, he expected to come out when I was half finished, help for a few minutes, then reap the reward.

I know that I can be considered lazy. For that matter, I freely admit it. The thing is, when something needs doing, I do it. Nothing wrong with a bit of creative screwing off IF you're caught up enough with work to do so. Our son's basic philosophy seems to be "Why do something now when if I put it off long enough someone else will probably do it for me or at least get tired of pestering me to do it?"

I'm not trying to be pessimistic or down my son here, just trying to be realistic.

 

[Scent of Cedar *]

One time? We so foolishly told our son to mow the grass?

And he paid the neighbor kid $20 to do it.

And back in the day, I would have mowed my lawn and the neighbor's, for twenty bucks.
We were so surprised and kind of embarrassed. difficult child was all about being a bigshot about it, too. Like, everyone knew where the money was coming from. Well, I mean, except those in denial, of course. I just thought he must be doing really well in that house with those nice young men he lived with.

But even I, Cleopatra on steroids cruising along in my boat full of holes, felt embarrassed for the neighbors to know our son had paid theirs to do his job. And like I said, back then, $20 was alot of money. Everything gets all twisted, when we do the things that work for normal parents.

Or the things that used to work, for us.

I love it that you shovel the elderly neighbor's drive, Jabber.

Our neighborhood is like that, too.

Cedar

 

[Jabberwockey]

What is your plan for if he should fail abysmally at each of ~ or at any one of, the tasks ~ the Community Service, the windows, the Job Corps?

Sorry, forgot to address this. If he fails at doing the windows, he fails at doing the Community Service. If he fails at the Community Service then the judge will probably put him in jail for a bit and Job Corps will either be pushed back or cancelled all together but that will be his choice.

We don't have a PLAN (Insert Dr Evil air quotes here) but we have talked between us and to him. It has been made clear that he will not be coming back to our house. It has been made clear that we will not continue to pay for his cell phone although we have discussed a go phone while he is at Job Corps. He does something counter productive, we quit sending the card with the minutes. Beyond that??

 

[Jabberwockey]

One time?

One example. Not just one time.