I can't do this....

[Jabberwockey]

Mental illness can get much better WITH HELP.

Agreed. Now if he would just acknowledge that he NEEDS help we'd be heading in the right direction.

 

[pasajes4]

A rock and a hard place..........and you and Lil are in the middle

 

[Ironbutterfly]

Lil and Jabber, have you looked into Job Corps? After completion of a course, they help with finding living accommodations, transportation and family support services. He would have to be willing to give up the pot and get clean before applying.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Job_Corps

 

[RN0441]

I wish my son would do it!

 

[Lil]

Lil and Jabber, have you looked into Job Corps? After completion of a course, they help with finding living accommodations, transportation and family support services. He would have to be willing to give up the pot and get clean before applying.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Job_Corps

Oh don't remind me.

Last summer he was signed up and ready to go to Chicago to study Computer Tech thru Job Corps. They told him to expect to go in 4 to 6 weeks. He actually got a job and two days later Job Corps said, You'll go in 2 weeks! He utterly panicked. Instead of working and saving up, as I told him, he quit his job on the spot and then he refused to go as well. He wouldn't even call them back! Finally the Job Corps woman in Chicago had left so many messages I called her and told her, "Quit calling! He changed his mind and won't even discuss it!" He wouldn't either. He just made some nasty remarks about going to the ghetto in Chicago and that was that. He never explained why he did it. He squatted in some apartment with some other guys until he got evicted and then he took off to the girlfriend's house.

Yeah, Job Corps. It was a great idea. I even have a friend who's stepson went to Chicago for the same program.

 

[BusynMember]

If they won't get help...yeah. I am thinking your son may have the differently wired thinking of Aspergers. That's a neurological difference that renders one socially and life decision clueless with anxiety. But again...he would need to be willing to accept help or supports from the community and I know he won't.

I'm sorry. I think he has a lot of potential...but I get it. HE doesn't think so...and I think he is afraid to try. Very heartbreaking for me to read about him. He is not a bad person. He's just kind of lost...I keep cheering for him to stop self sabotaging. I think maybe it's easier to not try and not fail than to try and fail. Unfortunately, I had a bit of this. Ok, well a lot. I stopped even dealing with school once I reached high school specifically thinking, "i would rather be known as smart but I don't try, than a hard worker who is stupid " So I gave up.

Maybe that's part of it with your struggling child.

 

[Ironbutterfly]

Oh don't remind me.

Last summer he was signed up and ready to go to Chicago to study Computer Tech thru Job Corps. They told him to expect to go in 4 to 6 weeks. He actually got a job and two days later Job Corps said, You'll go in 2 weeks! He utterly panicked. Instead of working and saving up, as I told him, he quit his job on the spot and then he refused to go as well. He wouldn't even call them back! Finally the Job Corps woman in Chicago had left so many messages I called her and told her, "Quit calling! He changed his mind and won't even discuss it!" He wouldn't either. He just made some nasty remarks about going to the ghetto in Chicago and that was that. He never explained why he did it. He squatted in some apartment with some other guys until he got evicted and then he took off to the girlfriend's house.

Yeah, Job Corps. It was a great idea. I even have a friend who's stepson went to Chicago for the same program.

Oh wow. Ok, well it was just a thought. Sitting here trying to figure out a win solution for all of you. I do know that there are hardly any services for single men. It's families first, then abused single women, then single women, then men. I found this out when trying to get help for my son.

Do you live near a farming community at all? I know they always need help, milking cows, bailing hay, chores on the farm, etc. I doubt they would drug test

 

[Lil]

I'm not sure what else we can do short of simply no longer pussy-footing around the whole subject. He won't admit to even needing therapy, I can imaging his reaction if we suggest an actual neurological problem.

But maybe it's come to that. Maybe we have to sit him down and say, "Look. We want to help. We don't want you homeless; we want your success. But we feel you are stabbing yourself in the foot by constantly hanging with these losers you don't even like and refusing to stop smoking pot because you think it makes you happy and refusing to just...try things our way. Maybe it's not your fault you have problems making friends? Maybe it's not your fault you are so unhappy? Maybe it's not your fault you're afraid of trying to be on your own? So, if you want to stay here, our conditions are: 1. You go have an actual evaluation by a psychologist to see if you have something that makes you different, like ADD or Aspergers. And if you do then you learn coping skills to stop the tantrums and become a more confident and well-rounded person..."

If he agrees to term #1, then more follow...but #1 gets him some help.

Or he says F-U and walks out the door.

Do you live near a farming community at all? I know they always need help, milking cows, bailing hay, chores on the farm, etc. I doubt they would drug test

Oh! I laughed out loud so hard at that! You have no idea how funny the though of MY son doing farm chores is. OMG! Really, I'm practically in stitches! He'd die...honestly, I think he'd rather DIE than accidently step in cow poo! Working on a farm would be his idea of Hell. Truly!

 

[BusynMember]

Lol (dang tablet) it is worth a try. I'm sure you can introduce it in a very gentle way. I feel your kindness in your posts. Maybe even hold his hand, if he lets you.

"Son, hear me out. You may reject my idea and even walk away (bring it up in advance to mitigate the action if he sadly takes it.)That's your choice if you'll only listen first. I love you so very much " I like telling Jumper I love her to the moon but not sure that would work for your boy. It might make him smile or roll his eyes and sayb"Oh, mom!" But he will get it.

Your dad and I believe you struggle with anxiety and work and making friends. Some people do...honestly, you aren't alone. I would so appreciate it if you'd humor me and just try a different direction. We don't want to make you leave. We want to see if we can help you. Maybe we've been trying to help you the wrongbwayb(never hurts to take some blame...I have sure done it).

Then present Aspetgers as a MILD disorder that does not require medication or anything scary...just some help with coping skills. You know best what to say to your son. If he listens and talks about it...ok, yes, give him something small he likes, like money for cigarettes. Thank him for hearing you out.

Vomit worthy? Perhaps. But he seems so overly sensitive that hearing you out would probably make him very anxious so it would be an accomplishment. A big, New one that was hard for him.

If he walks out...no cigarettes and you know you have tried your very very hardest. His total fear of failure touches me in a very hearfelt way. And I do think it's fear. He is one kid on this site I'd love to meet and hug..oh, I know he's not always likeable, but he has your heart, caring about animals his friends even if they don't always do him right.

Your son is far from hopeless. I suspect bio. Dad had similar fears and issues. And his life with Jabber and you have shown your boy only love.

I hope it works if you do it and you know how beloved you are on this forum. We will be here to hold your hand anytime you are down. Anytime. We so care.

 

[Skool Teacher]

I like dstc's point of view, but I think I disagree in part.

I believe we still have a role as parents even though these kids are now adults. From my way of thinking (and I know not everybody agrees with me) I still have an obligation to act in such a way that does not foster my child's dependency or stunt his growth.

It is not always clear to me, what that is. But I knew that letting him lay around in my house, smoke marijuana, take control, etc. was not in his best interests, let alone mine.

There is no reason to think that lil and Jabber's son would do anything better or different if he was given the privilege of staying on in their house. Actually, in my mind, it would be a deterrent.

As far as their son needing a great deal of help, I disagree there, too. To me, he seems headstrong and self-indulgent, but he seems to control himself when he needs to.

As long as he believes his mother will suffer for him, he will not change. I believe that because I have seen that with my own eyes with my own son.

When he was acting like a nutcase with his conspiracy theories, successfully got his SSI, went in and out of residential treatment and crisis programs--I was the only one who did not think he was seriously and irrevocably mentally ill. The only one. That stupid psychiatrist/pschoanalyst I was paying $250 an hour was certain, just certain that my son (who he had never met) was a goner.

All I did was tell my son I would not talk to him if he spouted his fruitcake theories--and hung up if he did--and he was cured. *Well he still believes them (but I have not heard him mention Brexit one time)-- he has miraculously found the self-control to not talk about them, which is unlike any delusional person I have ever known in my life.

You see, some of our kids, not all, but many of them--will be as crazy and as big a losers as we allow them to be.

Amen!!!

 

[Skool Teacher]

Now, I am aware here that one might think that I am forcing my son to suppress mental illness as a condition of support by me.

Or conversely, might think that I am taking away the pay off and incentives for my son to act mentally ill, or extract favors from others using the excuse of mental illness.

Of course, I prefer the latter. The worst could happen or it could not. My son will decide. If he feels that my view of him is incorrect or harsh, there are all kinds of community resources of which he might avail himself, away from me. All of them, I am certain, have harsher requirements than do I. It is his choice.

I am not insensitive to mental illness. I just do not think it is an excuse to not be productive if one is able bodied, attempt to handle problems and to control one's behavior, except in extreme cases.

I prefer to pull for strength. Almost all of the children on this forum save the ones with active psychosis fit the criteria of being able to be productive, should they choose, and control their behavior. I believe to expect less of them is to sell them out. Actually, I do believe that. To the extent that I did not call my son out, before, I betrayed him and I betrayed myself.

After you guys went to sleep, I went out to the kitchen to tell my son to help me wash the dishes and stove. And guess what? He had done it.

He is concerned because last night he left the back door wide open and the cat got out. He is apprehensive we will ask him to leave. While it breaks my heart a bit that he is fearful, I believe that in another way I am reassuring him--because I have a bottom line. I have a bottom line for him. Of what I expect from him. Expectations are a vote of confidence. Hope is a vote of confidence.

I believe that strongly, actually.

I am reassuring him that I believe in him. That I believe in him so much that I can hold the line. My line. I am even believing now a little bit that in time this will mean that he will be able to pick up the slack for me a little bit, some day. I am gaining confidence that this might happen. That as I get older and older, he will step up. That is very important to me because I want to be able to leave him whatever money and assets I have.

Of course, the worst thing can always happen. But sometimes, it does not. We cannot always be afraid of the worst thing.

Copa... Agreed! Well said! Amen! We all want the best for our adult children and it is expected at some point that they will become responsible adults. Some get this sooner than others and some don't get it ever and if we've done the best we can and they flounder, we (parents) have to be ok with this even when it breaks our hearts. I pray my daughter wakes up and gets her life together but if she doesn't I know I went above and beyond what a single parent could have and sacrificed so much to ensure she had everything she needed to make it. The rest was up to her.

 

[InsaneCdn]

If he agrees to term #1, then more follow...but #1 gets him some help.

Or he says F-U and walks out the door.

Lil, I think you're onto something.
Because this sequence means that something is going to change.
Either he changes and is willing for "help".
OR he takes his own backside flying out the door.

Either way, you didn't actually "kick him out", if he leaves. You simply gave him a choice, and he didn't want the other option. And if he actually gets help, you all win.

 

[1905]

Lil, You have got to just do it. This is the same nonsense he's been pulling for a year and a half. Nothing's changed, right? Why would it? I am speaking from the point of view of a person who kicked my son out. I didn't know of anything else, he was too comfortable doing nothing and fine for my support of him. Yours is the same as mine was. He needs stuff to get real. I know he was in a homeless shelter and all, but he also came home to watch tv and eat. You threw everything at the wall, you did, nothing stuck. You only wanted to help him and tried to give him a hand up as opposed to handouts. Really, it was just handouts you see now. Don't repeat it. Stop doing things. Throw the phone in the lake. Have a good life with Jabber. It's right there, just do it, your son will figure it out on his own. You'll be doing him a world of good.

 

[BusynMember]

wow.

while I can see grieving and leaving emotionally a kid like mine who I will never see again, and havent for ten years, I doubt I could just throw Jabber and Lils son out and move on and have a happy life. Hes not a drug addict. He has a temper, but can also be sweet. He is struggling probably because of mental illness or a neuroligical glitch.

if they do make him leave, there sill be angst and grief. And contact.

Seriously, it tool me five years of cruel no contact for reasons I was never told AND the deliberate refusal of this man, my alleged son, and his devil wife to make sure I never got to see their children fpr me to actually finish grieving totally and moving on completely. I was blessed with four other kids and two grands all whom made me see that it is best to let this imposter son go completely.

Their son is an only child.

I feel really badly for and deeply care about all of them.

 

[Lil]

Uh, yeah....Upallnight, that was a tad intense. I know you mean well...but I don't think I'm quite there yet. He is actually doing better. Less volatile and, (hard to believe I know) more willing to hold a job and pay his own way. I don't think he's not quite a lost cause yet.

 

[1905]

I am sorry Lil, that's just just what I did. I couldn't take it for another second. I went off the deep end, stopped eating, went to 87 pounds. I am glad your son is getting better. It just takes some longer, they march to,the beat of their own drummer. There is nothing wrong with that, I support all that. Sorry.

 

[1905]

I am sorry Lil, that's just just what I did. I couldn't take it for another second. I went off the deep end, stopped eating, went to 87 pounds. I am glad your son is getting better. It just takes some longer, they march to,the beat of their own drummer. There is nothing wrong with that, I support all that. Sorry.

 

[Ironbutterfly]

I don't think there is one parent here that threw their child out of their house and lived happily ever after. That decision came after much emotional and physical stress. Many give advice here about the home being your sanctuary, to make sure you keep yourself healthy and mentally stable so that you can maintain your life, your career, take care of other family members in the home.

What works for some folks doesn't work for others. Every situation is a different set of circumstances. Some Difficult Child's are on drugs, some are violent, some are mentally, physically or emotionally unwell, some use their kids as pawns, some have stolen from their family or others, some just take a little longer to "launch".

Upallnight- I know it was a hard decision to make and please don't feel bad about having to remove your child from your home. YOU did what you had to do to protect your own sanity and health. It's called self-survival. Many of us have been driven almost to the grave due to the stress of our Difficult Child's and their decisions, which directly impacts our decisions and our well-being. Just because some people would never make "x" decision doesn't mean it isn't the right decision for someone else.

To fix any problem you have to know the "why" before you can figure out the "How" .

 

[Lil]

It may come to that...we're talking about it still. Jabber and I have quite a lot to discuss and very little time to do it.

 

[BusynMember]

Up All Night, Im so sorry. I know it is often survival and I made my 19 year old daughter leave due to drugs. About killed me, but for her it was for the best. I know where all of us are coming from. And we all have to do what is best for them but us too. I'm sorry. I admire you and all of us. It has been a hard journey for all. We deserve kudos for our tough decisions. Every one of us.